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Same with having children. “I don’t even want kids. They are needy, expensive, and tie you down.” All true, but having kids was never a choice for you given yo

by tnel77 3y ago

Same with having children. “I don’t even want kids. They are needy, expensive, and tie you down.” All true, but having kids was never a choice for you given your financial situation so let’s not pretend you had a say in the matter.

xyzelement 3y ago
I agree with you but I don't think it's a financial thing but a psychological/maturity thing. People have kids at all income levels. For every one who claims they can't afford kids - someone is raising a family on that same income.
- est31 3y ago
  Yes but one of the most common desires is that you want your children to have a better childhood and life than yourself. Some people don't care or don't explicitly make the choice to get children, they just get them. But some people won't get children if they can't provide an environment that is at least as good as the one their parents provided to them.
  - OccamsMirror 3y ago
    People need to learn that material possessions are way less important than emotional environment. For most of us, being better parents is about how we parent. Not what we can afford.
    - dalyons 3y ago
      Childcare, education, housing (often tied together) and health care. Those are the big 4 expenses that are killing fertility rates, and only one is somewhat material.
      - est31 3y ago
        All of them are tied to money, really. If you are rich, then you can afford nannies (or a stay at home parent, this is nowadays a luxury too), housing, and if you are in a district with high property taxes, your public school is well funded. College is also easier if you don't rely on scholarships or on your children to work so that they can support you. Health care also suddenly becomes affordable with money (although in the US for big things it's still inaccessible). In general, if you get N children, then you either favor one child, or each child gets 1/N of the inheritance. Same goes for money available for sending your kid to college. Meaning, as a rule of thumb, the more children you get, the poorer those children will be from that point of view. Like a single can live well from €2k euro per month in most of Germany, but for a family with 3 children the same sum is very little. And of course there is the entire dateability aspect, too. People with higher income are seen as more attractive than those with lower income.
- tnel77 3y ago
  That’s true. I meant more so for those that purposeful have children. My brother had two children that were definitely unplanned.
  - xyzelement 3y ago
    That's what I am referring to as well. Plenty of people at income X intentionally have children while plenty of people at 5X lament not being able to afford them. I think this is true for every X. I suspect income has a negative correlation with the number of children in general, if anything.
Gigachad 3y ago
It’s always a choice. People in 3rd world countries are having 5 kids in a mud hut without doctors. It might not be a choice to have kids, and a new car while also going to the cafe every day. But having kids is always an option.

by tnel77 3y ago

xyzelement 3y ago

I agree with you but I don't think it's a financial thing but a psychological/maturity thing. People have kids at all income levels. For every one who claims they can't afford kids - someone is raising a family on that same income.

est31 3y ago
Yes but one of the most common desires is that you want your children to have a better childhood and life than yourself. Some people don't care or don't explicitly make the choice to get children, they just get them. But some people won't get children if they can't provide an environment that is at least as good as the one their parents provided to them.
- OccamsMirror 3y ago
  People need to learn that material possessions are way less important than emotional environment. For most of us, being better parents is about how we parent. Not what we can afford.
  - dalyons 3y ago
    Childcare, education, housing (often tied together) and health care. Those are the big 4 expenses that are killing fertility rates, and only one is somewhat material.
    - est31 3y ago
      All of them are tied to money, really. If you are rich, then you can afford nannies (or a stay at home parent, this is nowadays a luxury too), housing, and if you are in a district with high property taxes, your public school is well funded. College is also easier if you don't rely on scholarships or on your children to work so that they can support you. Health care also suddenly becomes affordable with money (although in the US for big things it's still inaccessible). In general, if you get N children, then you either favor one child, or each child gets 1/N of the inheritance. Same goes for money available for sending your kid to college. Meaning, as a rule of thumb, the more children you get, the poorer those children will be from that point of view. Like a single can live well from €2k euro per month in most of Germany, but for a family with 3 children the same sum is very little. And of course there is the entire dateability aspect, too. People with higher income are seen as more attractive than those with lower income.
tnel77 3y ago
That’s true. I meant more so for those that purposeful have children. My brother had two children that were definitely unplanned.
- xyzelement 3y ago
  That's what I am referring to as well. Plenty of people at income X intentionally have children while plenty of people at 5X lament not being able to afford them. I think this is true for every X. I suspect income has a negative correlation with the number of children in general, if anything.

Gigachad 3y ago

It’s always a choice. People in 3rd world countries are having 5 kids in a mud hut without doctors. It might not be a choice to have kids, and a new car while also going to the cafe every day. But having kids is always an option.