3 ms·

You just argued against yourself though, because in a theoretical sense that is exactly what you do. If you don't have a parking space available at the location

by mym1990 3y ago

You just argued against yourself though, because in a theoretical sense that is exactly what you do. If you don't have a parking space available at the location you are going to, a "public driveway" so to speak, you are not able to leave the car there. Now you could make a similar point about short term living situations like hotels, but I would imagine that the number of people who regularly stay in hotels is much lower than the number of people who own and operate a vehicle regularly.

AnthonyMouse 3y ago
The point is that it's not any different than the living space itself. If you go from home to work, you need an office to be in while you're there in addition to a parking space, and for that time both your home and the parking space at your home are empty. But they're counting the parking space at the office and not the office space there.
- orwin 3y ago
  I don't need a parking space at my office. Never needed one.
  - AnthonyMouse 3y ago
    So either you park your car at the train station, and then the train station needs a parking space for you and according to this math it still counts as another one even if it's outside the city. Or you live within walking distance of mass transit, which most people can't because there isn't enough relevant land zoned for that kind of high density development for everyone to live in even if they wanted to. But I'll do you one better. If you work from home you don't need the parking space or the office space.
- mym1990 3y ago
  I don't know where you work, but I haven't had an office all to myself ever, a desk is pretty much all I have ever been allotted, and it has usually been an open one at that. I have one place to go to work(usually). But I have almost countless places I could go for shopping or experiences...and that is where the parking problem arises. ...If I did have a house, my driveway would not be open to others, so either you have an empty plot of driveway, or a car that is not being used in it...both of those things are not productive. My "empty" house still has utility. My family could be using it. It is storing all of my possessions. It is a source of comfort for knowing I have a place to go to rest. Anyways, the productivity footprint of shared spaces is very different from those that are exclusively mine, and spaces that are exclusively mine are very limited...essentially my home and my car. I'm not arguing that everyone ditch their cars and start biking to work, American infrastructure is not there, but the time I have spent in cities that do have this infrastructure have been absolutely wonderful.
  - AnthonyMouse 3y ago
    > I don't know where you work, but I haven't had an office all to myself ever, a desk is pretty much all I have ever been allotted You don't just need a desk. You need a desk in addition to your share of a series of hallways that go to your desk, an elevator, a staircase, conference rooms, a lunch room etc. More to the point, even if your desk is small, it's not literally zero, but that's how it's being accounted for. > and it has usually been an open one at that. The building's parking lot will generally be sized according to size of the space (i.e. the number of desks), so this also means that you don't have your own parking space. > ...If I did have a house, my driveway would not be open to others, so either you have an empty plot of driveway, or a car that is not being used in it...both of those things are not productive. If you did have a house, it would commonly be in an area zoned to require each plot to have an acre of land. An acre is more than 40,000 square feet. Nobody cares about 320 square feet for a parking space when it's sitting next to >35,000 square feet of grass. > I'm not arguing that everyone ditch their cars and start biking to work, American infrastructure is not there, but the time I have spent in cities that do have this infrastructure have been absolutely wonderful. The thing preventing this isn't that we have so many parking spaces. You could add a hundred million more parking spaces at strip malls and things and it would use up 0.04% of the land in the continental US and be totally irrelevant. The thing preventing this is the zoning de facto requiring each house in the suburbs to have 35,000 square feet of grass.
    - mym1990 3y ago
      > You don't just need a desk. You need a desk in addition to your share of a series of hallways that go to your desk, an elevator, a staircase, conference rooms, a lunch room etc. All of which are shared throughout the workday, unless someone hired me to be the only one in the building, which seems like a poor decision. The parking spot I take is mine for the day though. > Nobody cares about 320 square feet for a parking space when it's sitting next to >35,000 square feet of grass. It isn't about the size of the plot, but what its usage is for. Tell a person about to have diarrhea in the middle of a mall that the bathroom is out of service, and panic will surely ensue. > The thing preventing this isn't that we have so many parking spaces. You could add a hundred million more parking spaces at strip malls and things and it would use up 0.04% of the land in the continental US and be totally irrelevant. Ah yeah, and dumping 100 million barrels of oil off the coast of California will be totally irrelevant because the ocean is very, very big. The thing about parking spaces is that they are usually where people are, so even if you're using arable land for calculation, a parking space isn't just randomly thrown down somewhere, it is condensed into places with lots of traffic. But I love how you calculate the relevancy/irrelevancy of such massive changes in the snap of a finger. I really hope you don't ever estimate anything of actual value.

AnthonyMouse 3y ago

The point is that it's not any different than the living space itself. If you go from home to work, you need an office to be in while you're there in addition to a parking space, and for that time both your home and the parking space at your home are empty. But they're counting the parking space at the office and not the office space there.

orwin 3y ago
I don't need a parking space at my office. Never needed one.
- AnthonyMouse 3y ago
  So either you park your car at the train station, and then the train station needs a parking space for you and according to this math it still counts as another one even if it's outside the city. Or you live within walking distance of mass transit, which most people can't because there isn't enough relevant land zoned for that kind of high density development for everyone to live in even if they wanted to. But I'll do you one better. If you work from home you don't need the parking space or the office space.
mym1990 3y ago
I don't know where you work, but I haven't had an office all to myself ever, a desk is pretty much all I have ever been allotted, and it has usually been an open one at that. I have one place to go to work(usually). But I have almost countless places I could go for shopping or experiences...and that is where the parking problem arises. ...If I did have a house, my driveway would not be open to others, so either you have an empty plot of driveway, or a car that is not being used in it...both of those things are not productive. My "empty" house still has utility. My family could be using it. It is storing all of my possessions. It is a source of comfort for knowing I have a place to go to rest. Anyways, the productivity footprint of shared spaces is very different from those that are exclusively mine, and spaces that are exclusively mine are very limited...essentially my home and my car. I'm not arguing that everyone ditch their cars and start biking to work, American infrastructure is not there, but the time I have spent in cities that do have this infrastructure have been absolutely wonderful.
- AnthonyMouse 3y ago
  > I don't know where you work, but I haven't had an office all to myself ever, a desk is pretty much all I have ever been allotted You don't just need a desk. You need a desk in addition to your share of a series of hallways that go to your desk, an elevator, a staircase, conference rooms, a lunch room etc. More to the point, even if your desk is small, it's not literally zero, but that's how it's being accounted for. > and it has usually been an open one at that. The building's parking lot will generally be sized according to size of the space (i.e. the number of desks), so this also means that you don't have your own parking space. > ...If I did have a house, my driveway would not be open to others, so either you have an empty plot of driveway, or a car that is not being used in it...both of those things are not productive. If you did have a house, it would commonly be in an area zoned to require each plot to have an acre of land. An acre is more than 40,000 square feet. Nobody cares about 320 square feet for a parking space when it's sitting next to >35,000 square feet of grass. > I'm not arguing that everyone ditch their cars and start biking to work, American infrastructure is not there, but the time I have spent in cities that do have this infrastructure have been absolutely wonderful. The thing preventing this isn't that we have so many parking spaces. You could add a hundred million more parking spaces at strip malls and things and it would use up 0.04% of the land in the continental US and be totally irrelevant. The thing preventing this is the zoning de facto requiring each house in the suburbs to have 35,000 square feet of grass.
  - mym1990 3y ago
    > You don't just need a desk. You need a desk in addition to your share of a series of hallways that go to your desk, an elevator, a staircase, conference rooms, a lunch room etc. All of which are shared throughout the workday, unless someone hired me to be the only one in the building, which seems like a poor decision. The parking spot I take is mine for the day though. > Nobody cares about 320 square feet for a parking space when it's sitting next to >35,000 square feet of grass. It isn't about the size of the plot, but what its usage is for. Tell a person about to have diarrhea in the middle of a mall that the bathroom is out of service, and panic will surely ensue. > The thing preventing this isn't that we have so many parking spaces. You could add a hundred million more parking spaces at strip malls and things and it would use up 0.04% of the land in the continental US and be totally irrelevant. Ah yeah, and dumping 100 million barrels of oil off the coast of California will be totally irrelevant because the ocean is very, very big. The thing about parking spaces is that they are usually where people are, so even if you're using arable land for calculation, a parking space isn't just randomly thrown down somewhere, it is condensed into places with lots of traffic. But I love how you calculate the relevancy/irrelevancy of such massive changes in the snap of a finger. I really hope you don't ever estimate anything of actual value.