8 ms·

I consider Singapore less than ideal to live in, but not because some websites are blocked. While free speech and access to information is almost always a good

by jeswin 3y ago

I consider Singapore less than ideal to live in, but not because some websites are blocked. While free speech and access to information is almost always a good thing, people raised with western values should not overlook that the east does things a little differently; not all countries started from the same place and lifting people out of hardship is the primary goal. As they prosper (as Singapore did), it'd be good if priorities are realigned and they become more open. But it's a process and it takes time. Now the second part. Singapore has some barbaric laws incompatible with modern society. Many times a year, they put to death people for drug related offenses (even cannabis), almost always poor people. It is tragic and heart breaking that such a wealthy country with a well-educated population (80% supporting death for drug offenses) gets behind execution for non-violent crimes. Most recently - 6 weeks back Tangaraju Suppiah was put to death for carrying 2 pounds of cannabis [1]. It's a well manicured garden, but I'd stay away from that place. Especially if you're raising kids. [1]: https://edition.cnn.com/2023/04/25/asia/singapore-cannabis-execution-tangaraju-suppiah-intl-hnk/index.html https://edition.cnn.com/2023/04/25/asia/singapore-cannabis-e...

throwaway2990 3y ago
> Singapore has some barbaric laws incompatible with modern society. Many times a year, they put to death people for drug related offenses (even cannabis), almost always poor people. Nothing to do with people being poor. Majority of those executed are foreigners coming into the country. https://youtu.be/-PXAOZwvv04 https://youtu.be/-PXAOZwvv04 You can argue cannabis is harmless but that’s simply not true. Most studies that look at long term usage conclude it affects the brain.
- drsnow 3y ago
  Literally everything "affects the brain"
- jeswin 3y ago
  > You can argue cannabis is harmless but that’s simply not true. Most studies that look at long term usage conclude it affects the brain. Let's assume this is true. Nobody is saying they needn't be punished, but put them to death? > https://youtu.be/-PXAOZwvv04 https://youtu.be/-PXAOZwvv04 LKY says in the video: "In America they're changing their minds and sending people back to the death row." Yeah, but not for this.
  - throwaway2990 3y ago
    > Let's assume this is true. Nobody is saying they needn't be punished, but put them to death? There’s warning before you get off the plane. Warnings when you get off the plane. Warnings when you go through customs.
    - bunga-bunga 3y ago
      That’s not an argument for the death penalty. Are you saying that it’s ok to kill people for whatever reason as long as they’re informed?
      - throwawayb3223 3y ago
        [dead]
      - Redoubts 3y ago
        > for whatever reason But there's a very specific reason here, and it's easy to avoid.
  - jusonchan81 3y ago
    No one is put to death for personal use. Only if you possess large enough quantities that makes you a dealer peddling typically peddling cannabis to large groups of people including underage kids. I personally don't believe in death penalty and I hope it's abolished entirely. But facts needs to be stated with clarity. Also Lee Kwan Yew is a legend. An absolute hero for bringing this country to where it is today. This is just my personal opinion, probably unpopular, but let me be free to state what I feel. And to add - as of 2013 - laws have changed, death penalty rules are changing. Not changing fast enough, but changing. Hopefully they abolish it entirely asap.
- scheeseman486 3y ago
  You know what else affects the brain in a negative way? Execution.
  - throwaway2990 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - scheeseman486 3y ago
      Wow. Sucks that the nice lady who sells me my weed I get under prescription at my local chemist is someone you think should die.
      - throwaway2990 3y ago
        [flagged]
        scheeseman486 3y ago
        Maybe the reason why people are so miserable in your country is because they execute people. Drug use is a symptom, not a cause. A society that devalues life to the point normalizing of ending of it can never be a happy one. People abuse drugs to escape, what do you think they're trying to escape from? If it's the drugs and the dissemination of them that you find are objectionable enough to murder those who participate, my nice pharmacy lady is just as guilty. You want her to die, or you're a hypocrite.
        rayiner 3y ago
        What makes you think people are “miserable?” East Asia has the lowest percentage of people who say they desire to emigrate elsewhere out of anywhere in the world: https://news.gallup.com/poll/468218/nearly-900-million-worldwide-wanted-migrate-2021.aspx https://news.gallup.com/poll/468218/nearly-900-million-world.... Just 4%, versus 15% in North America.
- defrost 3y ago
  > Most studies that look at long term usage conclude it affects the brain. I take it then you're also in favour of the death penalty for alcohol consumption, distribution, and production then? It would certainly be hypocritical if that were not the case.
  - scheeseman486 3y ago
    Almost any type of contact sport too. Martial arts, boxing, football, all proven to cause permanent damage even when protection is worn.
    - SamReidHughes 3y ago
      Sports are virtuous, drunkenness is not.
      - scheeseman486 3y ago
        Brain damage is virtuous to those that are probably brain damaged.
  - rayiner 3y ago
    “One bad thing is too deeply rooted in society to remove, so we have to accept a different bad thing and allow it to take root?”
    - defrost 3y ago
      If that's the comment that you wish to make then by all means do so. Adding quotes and a question mark makes it appear is if you are paraphrasing the comment that I made which I'd kindly ask you not to do as I can speak for myself and that's not what I stated.
    - scheeseman486 3y ago
      Alcohol and tobacco are empirically worse than cannabis, which is just as rooted in society. The choices of what is legal and what isn't came down to class and politics, not medical evidence. So yes? Acceptance, regulation and social safety nets are probably the way to go for a lot of drugs. The alternative is to indefinitely fight an unwinnable war, to perpetuate a cycle of death and murder seemingly oblivious that the fight itself and the consequences of a punitive system are the things taking most of those lives, not the drugs.
- awongh 3y ago
  if harmful/harmless were the real test, the government would ban alcohol. But that’s not the real reason. Just like drug laws everywhere, it’s more about controlling a certain demographic of the population (i.e. poor people) The fact that people in singapore still equate marijuana use to “harmful” “mind altering” “bad drugs” becomes more and more ridiculous as it gets legalized elsewhere. We’ll see what happens with thailand. As if for some reason asians can’t be allowed marijuana while it’s fine for white people.
  - throwawayb3223 3y ago
    [dead]
  - throwaway2990 3y ago
    They ban you drinking in public places. People used to drink on the bridge at Clark quay but that’s banned now. There’s less out of control people there now. Alcohol can only be purchased during certain hours.
    - sterlind 3y ago
      but alcohol actually kills people, unlike weed. and causes actual long-term damage, physical dependence, etc. just admit that the reason your country permits alcohol and executes weed smugglers is because alcohol is part of your culture and weed isn't.
      - throwaway2990 3y ago
        Weed has long term damage. It’s easy to make alcohol at home. It’s not easy to grow weed at home. But keep trying.
- JackeJR 3y ago
  Do you drink coffee?
- throwaway2990 3y ago
  In typical dang authoritarian fashion I’m rate limited because discussion and opinions are censored on HN.
akomtu 3y ago
Singapore is a society where one gives up freedom in exchange for material prosperity. It's a dead end for anyone who wants to grow.
- jhanschoo 3y ago
  Do you have personal anecdotes backing your claim?
- stefantalpalaru 3y ago
  [dead]
rayiner 3y ago
> While free speech and access to information is almost always a good thing, people raised with western values should not overlook that the east does things a little differently; not all countries started from the same place and lifting people out of hardship is the primary goal It’s deeper than that. Generally, asian cultures place a higher value on community and thus have a lower tolerance for antisocial behavior. That same communalism also means they tend to place a lower value on individual life. Hence death penalties for people engaging in antisocial behavior. It might not be your cup of tea, but Asians tend to think that their “well manicured garden” is desirable. In my view it’s far better than say San Francisco—the embodiment of European individualism taken to its logical conclusion—where you’re stepping over needles and human feces to get to work.
- awuji 3y ago
  San Francisco isn't the embodiment of European individualism, it is the embodiment of American mismanagement.
  - rayiner 3y ago
    It’s mismanagement that arises out of European individualism. Because the individual is sacrosanct, you can’t infringe on individual “rights” like doing drugs or sleeping in parks. You can’t throw them in prison or execute the people facilitating antisocial behavior, like drug dealers. Simultaneously, no value is accorded to the collective right to a clean and orderly commons, free from antisocial behavior.
    - nec4b 3y ago
      That just not true, there are a lot of places which value European individualism in the US or outside of it where drugs problems are on the same level as in Asian countries.
      - rayiner 3y ago
        Such as?
nirui 3y ago
> that the east does things a little differently Give the history a look and you'll know why. Unlike in Europe where people choose to unite and live largely peacefully after many conflicts (2 world wars got people fed up especially quickly), Asian countries landed themselves in a different situation, and reasonably suspicious towards "outsiders". What makes things even worse is that due to how many of these countries are governed (dictatorships, monarchies, monoparties and fake democracies), the recent movement of globalization is less effective in terms of bringing enough benefits to their citizens to allow them to brainwash their old world views out of their head voluntarily. Plus, many of these Asian countries don't have enough market ability to support the development of such Internet product domestically. As a result, if you just fully open up your Internet, the majority of the benefit from the action will then be absorbed by some companies located half an earth away while continue to deplete the market demand for homegrown alternatives. This is the situation where when you fully obey the international treaties, you lose. So, all and all, it's not "the east (just) does things a little differently" ("argh, these uncivilized barbarians" probably follows). Some delicate and sophisticated calculation is involved there.
- esperent 3y ago
  > Plus, many of these Asian countries don't have enough market ability to support the development of such Internet product domestically. As a result, if you just fully open up your Internet, the majority of the benefit from the action will then be absorbed by some companies located half an earth. It's not facebook.com that's blocked. It's BBC.com and other news sites. None of the big companies you're talking about are significantly blocked (outside of China). Meanwhile there's quite a few homegrown internet companies doing great over here. Here in Vietnam, shopee.com and lazada.com are the most popular shopping sites. Zalo is the most popular messaging app by far. Grab is the most popular ride sharing and food delivery app (in Indonesia it's Gojek). The only American companies that do have dominance are FB for social media and Google for search. Although maybe TikTok is more popular now.
  - pepa65 3y ago
    In Thailand, bbc.com is not blocked, but asiasentinel.com is (never visited it, don't know what I'm missing...)
porphyra 3y ago
> Tangaraju Suppiah He was a kingpin dealer who manipulated others into trafficking drugs, not just some poor guy who was unwittingly forced or tricked into carrying cannabis. His pawns, forced into doing his bidding, were spared the death penalty. I personally don't think marijuana is harmful, but if you're going to be intentionally running a network distributing drugs knowing full well the law, there is really nobody to blame but yourself. > Especially if you're raising kids There is no better place to be raising kids to be honest. Singapore boasts a world-class education that consistently ranks at or near the top of the OECD PISA scores, a rich culture with both Eastern and Western perspectives. My Singaporean colleagues (here in the Bay Area) are all outstanding people with both a fine grasp of technical matters and great creativity and critical thinking skills.
- jusonchan81 3y ago
  100% agreed on the best place to raise kids. World class education that is so cheap that no one ever even needs to take a student loan. The universities are among worlds top in rankings. Another factor: Safety - I doubt there is a safer country than Singapore.
- hestefisk 3y ago
  Until recently it was illegal to be gay in Singapore. I wouldn’t that “a western perspective”. Btw the army still classify homosexuality as a mental illness when they assess recruits for conscription. As for the educational system, university is very expensive. Schools are free and yes they claim to be very good on academic scores. What they don’t tell you is they still do caning in public schools (boys only). Still stuck in the fifties. The educational system largely focuses on academic strength and if you are not academically strong you get put into a second tier system very quickly. Kids as young as 8 have exams and suffer from exam stress early in their life. So yes, Singapore is an iron fisted, draconian police state, not much better than their Chinese neighbours. Source: I live here.
  - porphyra 3y ago
    I went to school in Singapore too. Yes, there is caning, but only for very serious offences. They no longer cane kids just for being late (which was done to Lee Kuan Yew, though he mentioned in his memoir that "it never did me any harm"). Homosexuality is technically illegal (to be precise, the act of sex between men), but it is rarely enforced and most people don't mind it, especially the younger generation which tend to support LGBT strongly.
AmericanChopper 3y ago
> As they prosper (as Singapore did), it'd be good if priorities are realigned and they become more open. There’s a lot of arrogance in this statement. The prosperous Asian countries (Singapore, Korea, Japan, maybe UAE too) all have more restricted social freedoms. But they’re also the safest and most orderly places in the world. Why would anybody living in those places look at LA, or NY, or Paris, or London, and think “I want where I live to be more like that”, ya know, filthy and full of violent and property crime…
- WeylandYutani 3y ago
  Maybe they are a little different from the hive mind? I know a Japanese guy who left because he was gay and didn't want to become a salary man.
  - AmericanChopper 3y ago
    There’s hundreds of millions of people in those countries. I’m sure they have all sorts of views. It’s the presumption people in developed economies are going to naturally start adopting western values that I’m taking issue with. It’s a highly arrogant position, that seems to lack any form of awareness about how western countries might be perceived by people outside the west.
flerovium 3y ago
> While free speech and access to information is almost always a good thing, people raised with western values should not overlook that the east does things a little differently "'The East' does not respect freedom of thought" is a sentiment one would be castigated for expressing in the West.
Trencin 3y ago
I will paraphrase LKY: it is more kind to execute one drug trafficker than allow him to destroy thousands of families. I don't disagree with him.
fakedang 3y ago
> It was Singapore’s first execution in six months. Not as common as you put it out to be.
Barrin92 3y ago
Singapore executes a dozen people per year. Trafficking, not consumption results in the death penalty. If that is barbaric, do you know that a hundred people per day in the US die of opioid overdoses? How many people are in prison for drug related crimes in other developed countries? How many families are ruined by drugs? Singapore has made its rules clear, these punishments aren't arbitrary. If you bring drugs into a country that will sentence you to death for it, something the population supports, that's not barbarism on part of Singapore, it's just reckless crime.

by jeswin 3y ago

throwaway2990 3y ago

> Singapore has some barbaric laws incompatible with modern society. Many times a year, they put to death people for drug related offenses (even cannabis), almost always poor people. Nothing to do with people being poor. Majority of those executed are foreigners coming into the country. https://youtu.be/-PXAOZwvv04 https://youtu.be/-PXAOZwvv04 You can argue cannabis is harmless but that’s simply not true. Most studies that look at long term usage conclude it affects the brain.

drsnow 3y ago
Literally everything "affects the brain"
jeswin 3y ago
> You can argue cannabis is harmless but that’s simply not true. Most studies that look at long term usage conclude it affects the brain. Let's assume this is true. Nobody is saying they needn't be punished, but put them to death? > https://youtu.be/-PXAOZwvv04 https://youtu.be/-PXAOZwvv04 LKY says in the video: "In America they're changing their minds and sending people back to the death row." Yeah, but not for this.
- throwaway2990 3y ago
  > Let's assume this is true. Nobody is saying they needn't be punished, but put them to death? There’s warning before you get off the plane. Warnings when you get off the plane. Warnings when you go through customs.
  - bunga-bunga 3y ago
    That’s not an argument for the death penalty. Are you saying that it’s ok to kill people for whatever reason as long as they’re informed?
    - throwawayb3223 3y ago
      [dead]
    - Redoubts 3y ago
      > for whatever reason But there's a very specific reason here, and it's easy to avoid.
- jusonchan81 3y ago
  No one is put to death for personal use. Only if you possess large enough quantities that makes you a dealer peddling typically peddling cannabis to large groups of people including underage kids. I personally don't believe in death penalty and I hope it's abolished entirely. But facts needs to be stated with clarity. Also Lee Kwan Yew is a legend. An absolute hero for bringing this country to where it is today. This is just my personal opinion, probably unpopular, but let me be free to state what I feel. And to add - as of 2013 - laws have changed, death penalty rules are changing. Not changing fast enough, but changing. Hopefully they abolish it entirely asap.
scheeseman486 3y ago
You know what else affects the brain in a negative way? Execution.
- throwaway2990 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - scheeseman486 3y ago
    Wow. Sucks that the nice lady who sells me my weed I get under prescription at my local chemist is someone you think should die.
    - throwaway2990 3y ago
      [flagged]
      - scheeseman486 3y ago
        Maybe the reason why people are so miserable in your country is because they execute people. Drug use is a symptom, not a cause. A society that devalues life to the point normalizing of ending of it can never be a happy one. People abuse drugs to escape, what do you think they're trying to escape from? If it's the drugs and the dissemination of them that you find are objectionable enough to murder those who participate, my nice pharmacy lady is just as guilty. You want her to die, or you're a hypocrite.
        rayiner 3y ago
        What makes you think people are “miserable?” East Asia has the lowest percentage of people who say they desire to emigrate elsewhere out of anywhere in the world: https://news.gallup.com/poll/468218/nearly-900-million-worldwide-wanted-migrate-2021.aspx https://news.gallup.com/poll/468218/nearly-900-million-world.... Just 4%, versus 15% in North America.
defrost 3y ago
> Most studies that look at long term usage conclude it affects the brain. I take it then you're also in favour of the death penalty for alcohol consumption, distribution, and production then? It would certainly be hypocritical if that were not the case.
- scheeseman486 3y ago
  Almost any type of contact sport too. Martial arts, boxing, football, all proven to cause permanent damage even when protection is worn.
  - SamReidHughes 3y ago
    Sports are virtuous, drunkenness is not.
    - scheeseman486 3y ago
      Brain damage is virtuous to those that are probably brain damaged.
- rayiner 3y ago
  “One bad thing is too deeply rooted in society to remove, so we have to accept a different bad thing and allow it to take root?”
  - defrost 3y ago
    If that's the comment that you wish to make then by all means do so. Adding quotes and a question mark makes it appear is if you are paraphrasing the comment that I made which I'd kindly ask you not to do as I can speak for myself and that's not what I stated.
  - scheeseman486 3y ago
    Alcohol and tobacco are empirically worse than cannabis, which is just as rooted in society. The choices of what is legal and what isn't came down to class and politics, not medical evidence. So yes? Acceptance, regulation and social safety nets are probably the way to go for a lot of drugs. The alternative is to indefinitely fight an unwinnable war, to perpetuate a cycle of death and murder seemingly oblivious that the fight itself and the consequences of a punitive system are the things taking most of those lives, not the drugs.
awongh 3y ago
if harmful/harmless were the real test, the government would ban alcohol. But that’s not the real reason. Just like drug laws everywhere, it’s more about controlling a certain demographic of the population (i.e. poor people) The fact that people in singapore still equate marijuana use to “harmful” “mind altering” “bad drugs” becomes more and more ridiculous as it gets legalized elsewhere. We’ll see what happens with thailand. As if for some reason asians can’t be allowed marijuana while it’s fine for white people.
- throwawayb3223 3y ago
  [dead]
- throwaway2990 3y ago
  They ban you drinking in public places. People used to drink on the bridge at Clark quay but that’s banned now. There’s less out of control people there now. Alcohol can only be purchased during certain hours.
  - sterlind 3y ago
    but alcohol actually kills people, unlike weed. and causes actual long-term damage, physical dependence, etc. just admit that the reason your country permits alcohol and executes weed smugglers is because alcohol is part of your culture and weed isn't.
    - throwaway2990 3y ago
      Weed has long term damage. It’s easy to make alcohol at home. It’s not easy to grow weed at home. But keep trying.
JackeJR 3y ago
Do you drink coffee?
throwaway2990 3y ago
In typical dang authoritarian fashion I’m rate limited because discussion and opinions are censored on HN.

akomtu 3y ago

Singapore is a society where one gives up freedom in exchange for material prosperity. It's a dead end for anyone who wants to grow.

jhanschoo 3y ago
Do you have personal anecdotes backing your claim?
stefantalpalaru 3y ago
[dead]

rayiner 3y ago

> While free speech and access to information is almost always a good thing, people raised with western values should not overlook that the east does things a little differently; not all countries started from the same place and lifting people out of hardship is the primary goal It’s deeper than that. Generally, asian cultures place a higher value on community and thus have a lower tolerance for antisocial behavior. That same communalism also means they tend to place a lower value on individual life. Hence death penalties for people engaging in antisocial behavior. It might not be your cup of tea, but Asians tend to think that their “well manicured garden” is desirable. In my view it’s far better than say San Francisco—the embodiment of European individualism taken to its logical conclusion—where you’re stepping over needles and human feces to get to work.

awuji 3y ago
San Francisco isn't the embodiment of European individualism, it is the embodiment of American mismanagement.
- rayiner 3y ago
  It’s mismanagement that arises out of European individualism. Because the individual is sacrosanct, you can’t infringe on individual “rights” like doing drugs or sleeping in parks. You can’t throw them in prison or execute the people facilitating antisocial behavior, like drug dealers. Simultaneously, no value is accorded to the collective right to a clean and orderly commons, free from antisocial behavior.
  - nec4b 3y ago
    That just not true, there are a lot of places which value European individualism in the US or outside of it where drugs problems are on the same level as in Asian countries.
    - rayiner 3y ago
      Such as?

nirui 3y ago

> that the east does things a little differently Give the history a look and you'll know why. Unlike in Europe where people choose to unite and live largely peacefully after many conflicts (2 world wars got people fed up especially quickly), Asian countries landed themselves in a different situation, and reasonably suspicious towards "outsiders". What makes things even worse is that due to how many of these countries are governed (dictatorships, monarchies, monoparties and fake democracies), the recent movement of globalization is less effective in terms of bringing enough benefits to their citizens to allow them to brainwash their old world views out of their head voluntarily. Plus, many of these Asian countries don't have enough market ability to support the development of such Internet product domestically. As a result, if you just fully open up your Internet, the majority of the benefit from the action will then be absorbed by some companies located half an earth away while continue to deplete the market demand for homegrown alternatives. This is the situation where when you fully obey the international treaties, you lose. So, all and all, it's not "the east (just) does things a little differently" ("argh, these uncivilized barbarians" probably follows). Some delicate and sophisticated calculation is involved there.

esperent 3y ago
> Plus, many of these Asian countries don't have enough market ability to support the development of such Internet product domestically. As a result, if you just fully open up your Internet, the majority of the benefit from the action will then be absorbed by some companies located half an earth. It's not facebook.com that's blocked. It's BBC.com and other news sites. None of the big companies you're talking about are significantly blocked (outside of China). Meanwhile there's quite a few homegrown internet companies doing great over here. Here in Vietnam, shopee.com and lazada.com are the most popular shopping sites. Zalo is the most popular messaging app by far. Grab is the most popular ride sharing and food delivery app (in Indonesia it's Gojek). The only American companies that do have dominance are FB for social media and Google for search. Although maybe TikTok is more popular now.
- pepa65 3y ago
  In Thailand, bbc.com is not blocked, but asiasentinel.com is (never visited it, don't know what I'm missing...)

porphyra 3y ago

> Tangaraju Suppiah He was a kingpin dealer who manipulated others into trafficking drugs, not just some poor guy who was unwittingly forced or tricked into carrying cannabis. His pawns, forced into doing his bidding, were spared the death penalty. I personally don't think marijuana is harmful, but if you're going to be intentionally running a network distributing drugs knowing full well the law, there is really nobody to blame but yourself. > Especially if you're raising kids There is no better place to be raising kids to be honest. Singapore boasts a world-class education that consistently ranks at or near the top of the OECD PISA scores, a rich culture with both Eastern and Western perspectives. My Singaporean colleagues (here in the Bay Area) are all outstanding people with both a fine grasp of technical matters and great creativity and critical thinking skills.

jusonchan81 3y ago
100% agreed on the best place to raise kids. World class education that is so cheap that no one ever even needs to take a student loan. The universities are among worlds top in rankings. Another factor: Safety - I doubt there is a safer country than Singapore.
hestefisk 3y ago
Until recently it was illegal to be gay in Singapore. I wouldn’t that “a western perspective”. Btw the army still classify homosexuality as a mental illness when they assess recruits for conscription. As for the educational system, university is very expensive. Schools are free and yes they claim to be very good on academic scores. What they don’t tell you is they still do caning in public schools (boys only). Still stuck in the fifties. The educational system largely focuses on academic strength and if you are not academically strong you get put into a second tier system very quickly. Kids as young as 8 have exams and suffer from exam stress early in their life. So yes, Singapore is an iron fisted, draconian police state, not much better than their Chinese neighbours. Source: I live here.
- porphyra 3y ago
  I went to school in Singapore too. Yes, there is caning, but only for very serious offences. They no longer cane kids just for being late (which was done to Lee Kuan Yew, though he mentioned in his memoir that "it never did me any harm"). Homosexuality is technically illegal (to be precise, the act of sex between men), but it is rarely enforced and most people don't mind it, especially the younger generation which tend to support LGBT strongly.

AmericanChopper 3y ago

> As they prosper (as Singapore did), it'd be good if priorities are realigned and they become more open. There’s a lot of arrogance in this statement. The prosperous Asian countries (Singapore, Korea, Japan, maybe UAE too) all have more restricted social freedoms. But they’re also the safest and most orderly places in the world. Why would anybody living in those places look at LA, or NY, or Paris, or London, and think “I want where I live to be more like that”, ya know, filthy and full of violent and property crime…

WeylandYutani 3y ago
Maybe they are a little different from the hive mind? I know a Japanese guy who left because he was gay and didn't want to become a salary man.
- AmericanChopper 3y ago
  There’s hundreds of millions of people in those countries. I’m sure they have all sorts of views. It’s the presumption people in developed economies are going to naturally start adopting western values that I’m taking issue with. It’s a highly arrogant position, that seems to lack any form of awareness about how western countries might be perceived by people outside the west.

flerovium 3y ago

> While free speech and access to information is almost always a good thing, people raised with western values should not overlook that the east does things a little differently "'The East' does not respect freedom of thought" is a sentiment one would be castigated for expressing in the West.

Trencin 3y ago

I will paraphrase LKY: it is more kind to execute one drug trafficker than allow him to destroy thousands of families. I don't disagree with him.

fakedang 3y ago

> It was Singapore’s first execution in six months. Not as common as you put it out to be.

Barrin92 3y ago

Singapore executes a dozen people per year. Trafficking, not consumption results in the death penalty. If that is barbaric, do you know that a hundred people per day in the US die of opioid overdoses? How many people are in prison for drug related crimes in other developed countries? How many families are ruined by drugs? Singapore has made its rules clear, these punishments aren't arbitrary. If you bring drugs into a country that will sentence you to death for it, something the population supports, that's not barbarism on part of Singapore, it's just reckless crime.