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They key question is whether death penalty or life sentence acts as an effective deterrent. We all heard that Chinese execute for big corruption. Does this mean

by f6v 3y ago

They key question is whether death penalty or life sentence acts as an effective deterrent. We all heard that Chinese execute for big corruption. Does this mean China has eradicated corruption? I have my doubts (and believe me, I don’t ever jump on CCP hate train).

remote_phone 3y ago
I think it would. Why would someone falsify data for a company if they know they might get executed. It wouldn’t be for their own gain.
jmyeet 3y ago
Eradicate corruption? Almost certainly not. That's not really possible. The goal is largely to keep it below a certain threshold so the country can actually function. As the death penalty, personally I'm not a fan. But I am a fan of severe punishments for the kind of intentional corporate malfeasance we're talking about. Here's the lesson I'd like people to take from all of this: markets need strong voernments to function. Libertarianism is a fantasy with no basis in reality (eg [1]). Political movements such as "starving the beast" [2] are nothing more than an attempt to extract even more profits from the populace, even to the point where that society can no longer function because no one can afford food or housing, the drinking water is poisonous and none of the roads or bridges can be repaired. [1]: https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/21534416/free-state-project-new-hampshire-libertarians-matthew-hongoltz-hetling https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/21534416/free-state-... [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starve_the_beast https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starve_the_beast
Al-Khwarizmi 3y ago
Eradicated is quite a high bar, isn't it? I don't think any category of crime has ever been eradicated from anywhere. The question is whether China's measures reduce corruption. My bet would be yes, but who knows.
- f6v 3y ago
  But we’re not going to introduce death penalty based on bets, right?
  - Al-Khwarizmi 3y ago
    I'm against death penalty, not only for corruption but in general. But there's a huge spectrum between death penalty and the almost irrelevant penalties for corruption in most of the West.
sitkack 3y ago
Being more like China, in this case, is being hard on this kind of crime, the death penalty or life sentences isn’t germane to the conversation. Whether China eradicated corruption or not, doesn’t have bearing on whether we should have stronger responses to this kind of fraud and harm.

by f6v 3y ago

remote_phone 3y ago

I think it would. Why would someone falsify data for a company if they know they might get executed. It wouldn’t be for their own gain.

jmyeet 3y ago

Eradicate corruption? Almost certainly not. That's not really possible. The goal is largely to keep it below a certain threshold so the country can actually function. As the death penalty, personally I'm not a fan. But I am a fan of severe punishments for the kind of intentional corporate malfeasance we're talking about. Here's the lesson I'd like people to take from all of this: markets need strong voernments to function. Libertarianism is a fantasy with no basis in reality (eg [1]). Political movements such as "starving the beast" [2] are nothing more than an attempt to extract even more profits from the populace, even to the point where that society can no longer function because no one can afford food or housing, the drinking water is poisonous and none of the roads or bridges can be repaired. [1]: https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/21534416/free-state-project-new-hampshire-libertarians-matthew-hongoltz-hetling https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/21534416/free-state-... [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starve_the_beast https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starve_the_beast

Al-Khwarizmi 3y ago

Eradicated is quite a high bar, isn't it? I don't think any category of crime has ever been eradicated from anywhere. The question is whether China's measures reduce corruption. My bet would be yes, but who knows.

f6v 3y ago
But we’re not going to introduce death penalty based on bets, right?
- Al-Khwarizmi 3y ago
  I'm against death penalty, not only for corruption but in general. But there's a huge spectrum between death penalty and the almost irrelevant penalties for corruption in most of the West.

sitkack 3y ago

Being more like China, in this case, is being hard on this kind of crime, the death penalty or life sentences isn’t germane to the conversation. Whether China eradicated corruption or not, doesn’t have bearing on whether we should have stronger responses to this kind of fraud and harm.