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Weight loss surgeries rise substantially among adolescents: research

DirectorKrennic 3y ago
The average bariatric surgery costs $7,400 to $33,000 before insurance coverage. [1] It's safe to say that the number of adolescents undergoing the procedure would be higher if it was cheaper. For comparison, a good pair of running shoes costs $100, a new, quality bike costs $500, and a gym membership is $50 per month. [1] https://www.goodrx.com/conditions/weight-loss/bariatric-surgery-costs https://www.goodrx.com/conditions/weight-loss/bariatric-surg...
- mdgrech23 3y ago
  That's kind of like telling a smoker all they need to do is quit smoking. It's true and it sounds easy enough but it's actually super difficult. I quit smoking. It took 11 attempts and I needed a dedicated mental framework which I found in the book The Easy Way to Quit Smoking which I highly recommend. Point being these people are going to need dedicated help to dig into why they have these habits and education to teach them how to cook and eat healthy neither of which are cheap either.
  - wlesieutre 3y ago
    The good old "have you tried not being sad" approach to health. I lost a bunch of weight once, but like many others I didn't keep it off. Having a harder go the second time around. If it were easy nobody would be overweight.
- simiones 3y ago
  Are you implying that running shoes, a bike, and/or a gym membership are a replacement for bariatric surgery? Will you suggest salads as well next? The magnitude of the obesity epidemic should really give people more pause when imagining simple fixes like this. It's becoming more and more clear that this is not simply a problem of lifestyle, but very likely environmental factors at least as problematic as leaded gasoline was on IQs.
  - amanaplanacanal 3y ago
    Yes this seems obvious to me too. The whole population just suddenly in the 1970's started eating more and exercising less? And we as a society have no idea what is causing it, and there seems to be no sense of urgency to find out.
  - 1970-01-01 3y ago
    Here's the environmental factor: massive amounts of sugar and syrup. Ban companies from pumping kids with high fructose syrup and sugar. Ban the sale of milk, yogurt, bread, cereal, juice boxes, sodas, and any other foods contaminated with high fructose syrups and sugars. Only then can we actually say we are fighting this weight problem. Everything else is lip service.
- CyberDildonics 3y ago
  20 minutes of running is negated by a single cookie. Exercise alone is an exceptionally difficult way to lose weight and telling people to just exercise more is not a systemic solution.
- tetrisgm 3y ago
  I've lost 120lbs. I'm a PM so I A/B tested different methods to lose weight until I found one. Exercise did almost nothing. It helped start my metabolism here and there. The real weight loss came from just eating as close to 0 calories a day as possible. Water, lettuce, whatever gets you full. It's a grueling process. It's not something you do because you love your body and your habits. You have to hate them. Feel free to recommend running shoes and gym memberships to people. In my experience, your comment isn't grounded in data, experience, or even helpful. It comes across as dismissive and wanting to sound right. The people doing these operations are suffering through a level of anguish you can't imagine. They are well aware of your trite advice, and unable to get their problem solved. That's why they turn to painful, expensive surgery. It's a problem, and playing armchair life coach with gotcha one liners isn't going to solve it.
  - stanmancan 3y ago
    Most people would probably lose a significant amount of weight just cutting out beverages with calories in them. A step further is to cut out fast food, boxed food, or anything pre-made. You should be doing 90% of your shopping in the produce/meat/dairy sections of the grocery store. The vast majority of anything you buy in aisles is either bad for you or incredibly calorie dense. Unfortunately nutrition doesn't seem to be taught in high school, and cooking at home is an optional course. Learning how to take care of your body and having the tools to be healthy if you choose is beneficial to everyone; much more useful in day to day life than almost anything you learn after grade 8.
    - EatingWithForks 3y ago
      > Most people would probably lose a significant amount of weight just cutting out beverages with calories in them. This hasn't been borne out. Coke zero, sprite zero, pepsi zero, etc. are widely available, tastes the same as far as I know, and we haven't solved the obesity crisis since they came out.
      - JimtheCoder 3y ago
        Fruit juice, Coffee with cream and sugar, Gatorade/sports drinks, Alcohol
- josephcsible 3y ago
  Exercise is way less important than diet for weight loss, and eating less is free.
- Rebelgecko 3y ago
  I wouldn't be surprised if people are overeating by 1k calories/day. It takes a substantial daily gym commitment to burn that much, you're better off eating better in the first place (which unfortunately can be easier said than done)
nancyhn 3y ago
Here the American Academy of Pediatrics is calling for more surgery, but not a word about preventing the situation in the first place. Why are they so focused on highlighting sickcare? What about prevention education? The researchers also noted that metabolic and bariatric surgery is a “safe and effective treatment” for severe obesity, saying that the American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) issued a statement last year calling for increased pediatric access to these surgeries... “The AAP has highlighted the need to educate pediatricians about the benefits of MBS for qualified patients,” the letter reads.
- dzink 3y ago
  The surgery, if done right, makes it hard to impossible for the person to ingest too much food. Results can inverse if the person keeps trying to increase their portions with time, and they can’t get a second surgery, but if someone is committed, the surgery can be a stepping stone for them to fix their eating problem. That said, the reason some overeat is often depression and the lack of energy that comes from not being able to eat as much leads to worsening mental health. If you don’t know how to adjust your diet for a smaller stomach (more proteins and filling food, less carbs) the mental health issues grow worse.
- 0zemp2c 3y ago
  [dead]
- JamesBarney 3y ago
  What would you believe they should recommend instead?
  - wmeredith 3y ago
    Probably physical activity and a healthy diet, both of which they've been advocating for for decades. This is an odd comment.
    - JamesBarney 3y ago
      So they should double down on the thing they've been advocating for decades as the obesity epidemic has exploded, and not look at the only options that have proven effective. That seems like an odd recommendation.
spacKingChamath 3y ago
Even though there has been a body positivity movement and large brands (Target, Victoria's Secret) have changed marketing material to present there designs with people of all body types, the fact remains that humans are a visual species that are driven by aesthetic attributes of what is considered "beautiful" and "popular". Today that happens to be fit and athletic (or whatever the Kardashians are doing these days) and social media clearly presents these folks to the youth while simultaneously pushing the idea of medical procedures to attain these looks.
- josephcsible 3y ago
  You make it sound like not being overweight is just about looks, but there are really important health reasons too.
- nancyhn 3y ago
  Body positivity will go down as one of the most destructive marketing campaigns of all time. It helped lock in big food and big pharma revenues and avoid scrutiny at the expense of people's health and amplified healthcare costs for everyone.
  - amanaplanacanal 3y ago
    It's not body positivity that is driving the obesity epidemic. It started long before that movement existed. Body positivity is just a coping mechanism because we don't have anything better.
CyberDildonics 3y ago
Systemic problems require systemic solutions. Until we confront that sugar is something that people can get addicted to we won't be dealing with the root of the problem.
cm2012 3y ago
Weight loss surgeries are an incredible tool with great research to back them up. Until the recent invention of semaglutides, they were the only tool that works for doctor prescribed weight loss (telling people to eat right and diet doesn't help outcomes at all, its more or less a waste of time).
- josephcsible 3y ago
  > telling people to eat right and diet doesn't help outcomes at all That's only because they don't listen to what you tell them. When people actually do eat right and diet, that works to lose weight 100% of the time.
  - cm2012 3y ago
    Yes, but that's pointless as a policy for doctors and healthcare in general.
  - simiones 3y ago
    No, it's because people can't just fight what their body tells them they need for any significant amount of time. It is incredibly difficult to lose weight for anything more than a year or two, and in fact very rarely happens - at least without surgery.
    - chiefalchemist 3y ago
      > it's because people can't just fight what their body tells them they need for any significant amount of time. Yes, the body is saying "nourish me" and they're feeding it food that is high-calorie and low-nutrient. So the body keeps asking "nourish me". And they feed it the same thing. We shouldn't be so quick to blame the body for the mind making poor decisions. > It is incredibly difficult to lose weight for anything more than a year or two, and in fact very rarely happens But why is that? Have they developed new better habits, or simply put the proven bad ones on hold? Is the whole family / household in on the effort, or is it usually one very obese person trying to change, while the obese and overweight under the same roof aren't making any effort (to change diet, exercise, and TV watching* routines). The point is, we are known creatures of habit. We are also creatures known to conform to the surrounding norms. If the norms of the house are counter-productive then yes you're going to lose. If the norms once you leave the house (or turn on the TV) are against you, that doesn't help either (but it's a bit less impactful). I understand it's a complicated social issue. But the biology and psychology / behavior aspects are fairly well known and documented. People don't want to believe that all that good tasting food is bad for them. They don't want to give up the idea that ice cream is for daily consumption (not limited to special occasions). Etc. I agree. It's not easy. But the denial doesn't make it any easier. * My parents loved to watching cooking shows, and their diet reflected it. I wish I had $20 for every time I said, "Food is for nutrition, not a pleasure center...Rachael Ray is not your friend." I'd like to add that Oprah spent years pushing the idea of "love yourself" (regardless of how unhealthy that might be) now has a diet-friendly food line (a la Weight Watchers). And yet no one stops to say, wait didn't she help normalize this problem?
notShabu 3y ago
I think each generation tries to be more "real" than the previous generation. At first social media allowed us to express "who we really are" by providing us tools to present "who we think we are". This was more "real" in contrast to the suit & tie professional persona many were shoehorned into. (Which was more "real" in contrast to traditional work-husband/housewife roles, since it was theoretically gender-blind) Now social media personas feel too "fake". Being physically fit in the real world is one of the only hard-to-fake ways to stand out as "special" now.
TekMol 3y ago
Can you stay lean without looking emaciated at any age? It seems many people get a belly as they age, but the face still looks normal. Can you prevent this with a diet or will your face look haggard?
- uoaei 3y ago
  You will look spindly if you remain sedentary and eat fewer calories, yes. Importantly, you can eat the same amount of food if you eat things that aren't laced with sugar and have higher fiber content. This is a good rule of thumb for cutting the excess calories when you're first starting out. The trick is to metabolize the food you eat. You do that with exercise, primarily cardio. Then your body's new homeostatic program also involves "supporting the frame of the body during physical movement" and you begin to develop some muscle, preventing the emaciated look.
  - TekMol 3y ago
    develop some muscle, preventing the emaciated look Muscle in the face?
    - algoatecorn 3y ago
      With a reasonable amount of muscle mass, you don't need to reach as low of a body fat percentage to look fit. With regard to your original comment, yes there are millions of people who remain fit, lean, and without a "belly", as you put it, in older age.
- nine_k 3y ago
  Human body is built to be economical. If you don't use muscles regularly, they degenerate to the size sufficient for your normal load. If you want to look athletic, the only way is to be athletic, that is, spend significant effort working your muscles, proving to your body that you actually have a use for them. For most people it means a gym, or a barbell at home, or some kind of athletic sports, several days a week. If, on top of that, you don't want a belly (which is a normal way for the body to store some energy reserve near the center of gravity), you also need to limit your intake of carbs.
blanketcitrus 3y ago
[flagged]
somewhereoutth 3y ago
The one issue I could not see a workaround for while living in the US was the food (short of getting *everything" flown in from the EU). That is why there is an obesity epidemic, the food is poison - and it is the entire chain, from confectionery in the grocery store to a meal at a high-end restaurant. Back in the EU, everyday I am grateful for the simple, good, food that I can get even without making much effort - whether that be street food from a kiosk, or something I put together at home from basic supermarket ingredients. I am lucky in that my body tells me what is good/bad food and what/how much it needs. It remains a mystery to me how others lose control of their weight.
- cudgy 3y ago
  Are you saying that there are not supermarkets with basic wholesome ingredients from which to make healthy meals in the United States? That you were unable to buy grass-fed organic beef, pasture raised chicken, and organic vegetables and fruits? Where did you find this wasteland in the US? I have yet to see one that cannot provide these basic ingredients.
  - bluefirebrand 3y ago
    For a substantial amount of Americans that is exactly what is happening. https://moveforhunger.org/harsh-reality-food-deserts-america https://moveforhunger.org/harsh-reality-food-deserts-america
    - cudgy 3y ago
      “[I]n urban areas, the U.S Department of Agriculture considers a food desert an area with no ready access to a store with fresh and nutritious food options within one mile.” One mile? With such a definition of the term “food desert”, no wonder so many people are defined as being in one. Living more than one mile from a grocery store is hardly a “desert”. Most grocery stores deliver food now too, so even lack of ambulatory faculties is a poor reason to not cook wholesome meals for one’s family. This study appears to have been created to create alarm about a possibly nonexistent or virtually nonexistent issue.
archsurface 3y ago
Presumably plastic surgery next for kids. Trickle down, like eg mobile phones, at first for a few adults, then many adults, a few children, then many children. As things become cheaper they spread to the younger; things including practices. Enter moral philosophy, a topic too big for chit chat.
- archsurface 3y ago
  Great discussion.
Beaver117 3y ago
Surgery is just a bandaid on a systemic problem. We still don't even know why we are obese! Certain groups say carbs are the devil (what about Japan, China who eat a lot of rice and keep their obesity rates very low?). Other groups say it's saturated fats (what about the thousands of years history we have of eating fats? Obesity is a very recent problem). You will probably get fatter living in a suburb driving everywhere rather than say NYC. But that's not enough to explain the difference between countries. What about pollutants? The food, the water, the air, the feed for animals, the antibiotics, pesticides, seed oils, microplastics?
cudgy 3y ago
“[I]n urban areas, the U.S Department of Agriculture considers a food desert an area with no ready access to a store with fresh and nutritious food options within one mile.” One mile? With such a definition of the term “food desert”, no wonder so many people are defined as being in one. Living more than one mile from a grocery store is hardly a “desert”. Most grocery stores deliver food now too, so even lack of ambulatory faculties is a poor reason to not cook wholesome meals for one’s family. This study appears to have been created to create alarm about a possibly nonexistent or virtually nonexistent issue. Edit: Sorry, I top-posted this accidentally. This comment is referring to a study that another user posted here regarding lack of access to food supplies in the US.
- 29083011397778 3y ago
  Respectfully, I think you might have gotten used to the sas state America has ended up in. I'm in a reasonably sized city, and have fresh groceries less than half a mile away. My parents live in a suburban, approaching rural area - and have multiple grocery stores within a mile. Hell, I had fresh produce within a mile in a very small town in Alberta, at both apartments I lived in. I can see the argument if most people were actually living someplace rural - but they aren't. Living in a city that's also a food desert sounds like it misses the point of what a city is for, to be honest.
- HEmanZ 3y ago
  I think the problem with “food deserts” (kind of dramatic term but that’s probably the point) is that they are significant hurdles for the working class (maybe they can order, but can they justify that in their budget?) and serious issues for the very poor who don’t have transportation. The important question is how many impoverished or nearly impoverished people live in a food desert.
deathlight 3y ago
Is it covered by medicare/medicaid?

The average bariatric surgery costs $7,400 to $33,000 before insurance coverage. [1] It's safe to say that the number of adolescents undergoing the procedure would be higher if it was cheaper. For comparison, a good pair of running shoes costs $100, a new, quality bike costs $500, and a gym membership is $50 per month. [1] https://www.goodrx.com/conditions/weight-loss/bariatric-surgery-costs https://www.goodrx.com/conditions/weight-loss/bariatric-surg...

mdgrech23 3y ago
That's kind of like telling a smoker all they need to do is quit smoking. It's true and it sounds easy enough but it's actually super difficult. I quit smoking. It took 11 attempts and I needed a dedicated mental framework which I found in the book The Easy Way to Quit Smoking which I highly recommend. Point being these people are going to need dedicated help to dig into why they have these habits and education to teach them how to cook and eat healthy neither of which are cheap either.
- wlesieutre 3y ago
  The good old "have you tried not being sad" approach to health. I lost a bunch of weight once, but like many others I didn't keep it off. Having a harder go the second time around. If it were easy nobody would be overweight.
simiones 3y ago
Are you implying that running shoes, a bike, and/or a gym membership are a replacement for bariatric surgery? Will you suggest salads as well next? The magnitude of the obesity epidemic should really give people more pause when imagining simple fixes like this. It's becoming more and more clear that this is not simply a problem of lifestyle, but very likely environmental factors at least as problematic as leaded gasoline was on IQs.
- amanaplanacanal 3y ago
  Yes this seems obvious to me too. The whole population just suddenly in the 1970's started eating more and exercising less? And we as a society have no idea what is causing it, and there seems to be no sense of urgency to find out.
- 1970-01-01 3y ago
  Here's the environmental factor: massive amounts of sugar and syrup. Ban companies from pumping kids with high fructose syrup and sugar. Ban the sale of milk, yogurt, bread, cereal, juice boxes, sodas, and any other foods contaminated with high fructose syrups and sugars. Only then can we actually say we are fighting this weight problem. Everything else is lip service.
CyberDildonics 3y ago
20 minutes of running is negated by a single cookie. Exercise alone is an exceptionally difficult way to lose weight and telling people to just exercise more is not a systemic solution.
tetrisgm 3y ago
I've lost 120lbs. I'm a PM so I A/B tested different methods to lose weight until I found one. Exercise did almost nothing. It helped start my metabolism here and there. The real weight loss came from just eating as close to 0 calories a day as possible. Water, lettuce, whatever gets you full. It's a grueling process. It's not something you do because you love your body and your habits. You have to hate them. Feel free to recommend running shoes and gym memberships to people. In my experience, your comment isn't grounded in data, experience, or even helpful. It comes across as dismissive and wanting to sound right. The people doing these operations are suffering through a level of anguish you can't imagine. They are well aware of your trite advice, and unable to get their problem solved. That's why they turn to painful, expensive surgery. It's a problem, and playing armchair life coach with gotcha one liners isn't going to solve it.
- stanmancan 3y ago
  Most people would probably lose a significant amount of weight just cutting out beverages with calories in them. A step further is to cut out fast food, boxed food, or anything pre-made. You should be doing 90% of your shopping in the produce/meat/dairy sections of the grocery store. The vast majority of anything you buy in aisles is either bad for you or incredibly calorie dense. Unfortunately nutrition doesn't seem to be taught in high school, and cooking at home is an optional course. Learning how to take care of your body and having the tools to be healthy if you choose is beneficial to everyone; much more useful in day to day life than almost anything you learn after grade 8.
  - EatingWithForks 3y ago
    > Most people would probably lose a significant amount of weight just cutting out beverages with calories in them. This hasn't been borne out. Coke zero, sprite zero, pepsi zero, etc. are widely available, tastes the same as far as I know, and we haven't solved the obesity crisis since they came out.
    - JimtheCoder 3y ago
      Fruit juice, Coffee with cream and sugar, Gatorade/sports drinks, Alcohol
josephcsible 3y ago
Exercise is way less important than diet for weight loss, and eating less is free.
Rebelgecko 3y ago
I wouldn't be surprised if people are overeating by 1k calories/day. It takes a substantial daily gym commitment to burn that much, you're better off eating better in the first place (which unfortunately can be easier said than done)

nancyhn 3y ago

Here the American Academy of Pediatrics is calling for more surgery, but not a word about preventing the situation in the first place. Why are they so focused on highlighting sickcare? What about prevention education? The researchers also noted that metabolic and bariatric surgery is a “safe and effective treatment” for severe obesity, saying that the American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) issued a statement last year calling for increased pediatric access to these surgeries... “The AAP has highlighted the need to educate pediatricians about the benefits of MBS for qualified patients,” the letter reads.

dzink 3y ago
The surgery, if done right, makes it hard to impossible for the person to ingest too much food. Results can inverse if the person keeps trying to increase their portions with time, and they can’t get a second surgery, but if someone is committed, the surgery can be a stepping stone for them to fix their eating problem. That said, the reason some overeat is often depression and the lack of energy that comes from not being able to eat as much leads to worsening mental health. If you don’t know how to adjust your diet for a smaller stomach (more proteins and filling food, less carbs) the mental health issues grow worse.
0zemp2c 3y ago
[dead]
JamesBarney 3y ago
What would you believe they should recommend instead?
- wmeredith 3y ago
  Probably physical activity and a healthy diet, both of which they've been advocating for for decades. This is an odd comment.
  - JamesBarney 3y ago
    So they should double down on the thing they've been advocating for decades as the obesity epidemic has exploded, and not look at the only options that have proven effective. That seems like an odd recommendation.

spacKingChamath 3y ago

Even though there has been a body positivity movement and large brands (Target, Victoria's Secret) have changed marketing material to present there designs with people of all body types, the fact remains that humans are a visual species that are driven by aesthetic attributes of what is considered "beautiful" and "popular". Today that happens to be fit and athletic (or whatever the Kardashians are doing these days) and social media clearly presents these folks to the youth while simultaneously pushing the idea of medical procedures to attain these looks.

josephcsible 3y ago
You make it sound like not being overweight is just about looks, but there are really important health reasons too.
nancyhn 3y ago
Body positivity will go down as one of the most destructive marketing campaigns of all time. It helped lock in big food and big pharma revenues and avoid scrutiny at the expense of people's health and amplified healthcare costs for everyone.
- amanaplanacanal 3y ago
  It's not body positivity that is driving the obesity epidemic. It started long before that movement existed. Body positivity is just a coping mechanism because we don't have anything better.

CyberDildonics 3y ago

Systemic problems require systemic solutions. Until we confront that sugar is something that people can get addicted to we won't be dealing with the root of the problem.

cm2012 3y ago

Weight loss surgeries are an incredible tool with great research to back them up. Until the recent invention of semaglutides, they were the only tool that works for doctor prescribed weight loss (telling people to eat right and diet doesn't help outcomes at all, its more or less a waste of time).

josephcsible 3y ago
> telling people to eat right and diet doesn't help outcomes at all That's only because they don't listen to what you tell them. When people actually do eat right and diet, that works to lose weight 100% of the time.
- cm2012 3y ago
  Yes, but that's pointless as a policy for doctors and healthcare in general.
- simiones 3y ago
  No, it's because people can't just fight what their body tells them they need for any significant amount of time. It is incredibly difficult to lose weight for anything more than a year or two, and in fact very rarely happens - at least without surgery.
  - chiefalchemist 3y ago
    > it's because people can't just fight what their body tells them they need for any significant amount of time. Yes, the body is saying "nourish me" and they're feeding it food that is high-calorie and low-nutrient. So the body keeps asking "nourish me". And they feed it the same thing. We shouldn't be so quick to blame the body for the mind making poor decisions. > It is incredibly difficult to lose weight for anything more than a year or two, and in fact very rarely happens But why is that? Have they developed new better habits, or simply put the proven bad ones on hold? Is the whole family / household in on the effort, or is it usually one very obese person trying to change, while the obese and overweight under the same roof aren't making any effort (to change diet, exercise, and TV watching* routines). The point is, we are known creatures of habit. We are also creatures known to conform to the surrounding norms. If the norms of the house are counter-productive then yes you're going to lose. If the norms once you leave the house (or turn on the TV) are against you, that doesn't help either (but it's a bit less impactful). I understand it's a complicated social issue. But the biology and psychology / behavior aspects are fairly well known and documented. People don't want to believe that all that good tasting food is bad for them. They don't want to give up the idea that ice cream is for daily consumption (not limited to special occasions). Etc. I agree. It's not easy. But the denial doesn't make it any easier. * My parents loved to watching cooking shows, and their diet reflected it. I wish I had $20 for every time I said, "Food is for nutrition, not a pleasure center...Rachael Ray is not your friend." I'd like to add that Oprah spent years pushing the idea of "love yourself" (regardless of how unhealthy that might be) now has a diet-friendly food line (a la Weight Watchers). And yet no one stops to say, wait didn't she help normalize this problem?

notShabu 3y ago

I think each generation tries to be more "real" than the previous generation. At first social media allowed us to express "who we really are" by providing us tools to present "who we think we are". This was more "real" in contrast to the suit & tie professional persona many were shoehorned into. (Which was more "real" in contrast to traditional work-husband/housewife roles, since it was theoretically gender-blind) Now social media personas feel too "fake". Being physically fit in the real world is one of the only hard-to-fake ways to stand out as "special" now.

TekMol 3y ago

Can you stay lean without looking emaciated at any age? It seems many people get a belly as they age, but the face still looks normal. Can you prevent this with a diet or will your face look haggard?

uoaei 3y ago
You will look spindly if you remain sedentary and eat fewer calories, yes. Importantly, you can eat the same amount of food if you eat things that aren't laced with sugar and have higher fiber content. This is a good rule of thumb for cutting the excess calories when you're first starting out. The trick is to metabolize the food you eat. You do that with exercise, primarily cardio. Then your body's new homeostatic program also involves "supporting the frame of the body during physical movement" and you begin to develop some muscle, preventing the emaciated look.
- TekMol 3y ago
  develop some muscle, preventing the emaciated look Muscle in the face?
  - algoatecorn 3y ago
    With a reasonable amount of muscle mass, you don't need to reach as low of a body fat percentage to look fit. With regard to your original comment, yes there are millions of people who remain fit, lean, and without a "belly", as you put it, in older age.
nine_k 3y ago
Human body is built to be economical. If you don't use muscles regularly, they degenerate to the size sufficient for your normal load. If you want to look athletic, the only way is to be athletic, that is, spend significant effort working your muscles, proving to your body that you actually have a use for them. For most people it means a gym, or a barbell at home, or some kind of athletic sports, several days a week. If, on top of that, you don't want a belly (which is a normal way for the body to store some energy reserve near the center of gravity), you also need to limit your intake of carbs.

blanketcitrus 3y ago

[flagged]

somewhereoutth 3y ago

The one issue I could not see a workaround for while living in the US was the food (short of getting *everything" flown in from the EU). That is why there is an obesity epidemic, the food is poison - and it is the entire chain, from confectionery in the grocery store to a meal at a high-end restaurant. Back in the EU, everyday I am grateful for the simple, good, food that I can get even without making much effort - whether that be street food from a kiosk, or something I put together at home from basic supermarket ingredients. I am lucky in that my body tells me what is good/bad food and what/how much it needs. It remains a mystery to me how others lose control of their weight.

cudgy 3y ago
Are you saying that there are not supermarkets with basic wholesome ingredients from which to make healthy meals in the United States? That you were unable to buy grass-fed organic beef, pasture raised chicken, and organic vegetables and fruits? Where did you find this wasteland in the US? I have yet to see one that cannot provide these basic ingredients.
- bluefirebrand 3y ago
  For a substantial amount of Americans that is exactly what is happening. https://moveforhunger.org/harsh-reality-food-deserts-america https://moveforhunger.org/harsh-reality-food-deserts-america
  - cudgy 3y ago
    “[I]n urban areas, the U.S Department of Agriculture considers a food desert an area with no ready access to a store with fresh and nutritious food options within one mile.” One mile? With such a definition of the term “food desert”, no wonder so many people are defined as being in one. Living more than one mile from a grocery store is hardly a “desert”. Most grocery stores deliver food now too, so even lack of ambulatory faculties is a poor reason to not cook wholesome meals for one’s family. This study appears to have been created to create alarm about a possibly nonexistent or virtually nonexistent issue.

archsurface 3y ago

Presumably plastic surgery next for kids. Trickle down, like eg mobile phones, at first for a few adults, then many adults, a few children, then many children. As things become cheaper they spread to the younger; things including practices. Enter moral philosophy, a topic too big for chit chat.

archsurface 3y ago
Great discussion.

Beaver117 3y ago

Surgery is just a bandaid on a systemic problem. We still don't even know why we are obese! Certain groups say carbs are the devil (what about Japan, China who eat a lot of rice and keep their obesity rates very low?). Other groups say it's saturated fats (what about the thousands of years history we have of eating fats? Obesity is a very recent problem). You will probably get fatter living in a suburb driving everywhere rather than say NYC. But that's not enough to explain the difference between countries. What about pollutants? The food, the water, the air, the feed for animals, the antibiotics, pesticides, seed oils, microplastics?

cudgy 3y ago

“[I]n urban areas, the U.S Department of Agriculture considers a food desert an area with no ready access to a store with fresh and nutritious food options within one mile.” One mile? With such a definition of the term “food desert”, no wonder so many people are defined as being in one. Living more than one mile from a grocery store is hardly a “desert”. Most grocery stores deliver food now too, so even lack of ambulatory faculties is a poor reason to not cook wholesome meals for one’s family. This study appears to have been created to create alarm about a possibly nonexistent or virtually nonexistent issue. Edit: Sorry, I top-posted this accidentally. This comment is referring to a study that another user posted here regarding lack of access to food supplies in the US.

29083011397778 3y ago
Respectfully, I think you might have gotten used to the sas state America has ended up in. I'm in a reasonably sized city, and have fresh groceries less than half a mile away. My parents live in a suburban, approaching rural area - and have multiple grocery stores within a mile. Hell, I had fresh produce within a mile in a very small town in Alberta, at both apartments I lived in. I can see the argument if most people were actually living someplace rural - but they aren't. Living in a city that's also a food desert sounds like it misses the point of what a city is for, to be honest.
HEmanZ 3y ago
I think the problem with “food deserts” (kind of dramatic term but that’s probably the point) is that they are significant hurdles for the working class (maybe they can order, but can they justify that in their budget?) and serious issues for the very poor who don’t have transportation. The important question is how many impoverished or nearly impoverished people live in a food desert.

deathlight 3y ago

Is it covered by medicare/medicaid?