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The article carefully dances around the question how the textiles end up in Ghana. Also why can't Ghana manage the issue locally, with import tariffs or somethi

by zokier 3y ago

The article carefully dances around the question how the textiles end up in Ghana. Also why can't Ghana manage the issue locally, with import tariffs or something of that kind? > 70% ends up in ditches and drains, leaching dyes into the sea and rivers, and covering beaches with vast tangles of clothing. This is prime example of something that sounds more issue with local environmental regulations and their enforcement. And if the problem is corruption then just adding more money in the mix doesn't exactly sound like a solution

nradov 3y ago
Realistically Ghana just doesn't have the resources to strictly enforce local environmental rules. It's a poor country. They are asking for help.
actionfromafar 3y ago
Before outside environmental dumping, you were a poor country with n problems. After environmental dumping, you are now a country with n + 1 problems. Is it unfair to say to upstream "please stop"? Edit: (Or as it turns out, please pay more to handle this trash for you, it's getting out of hand here.)
- zokier 3y ago
  > Is it unfair to say to upstream "please stop"? Is anyone currently forcing Ghana to accept these textiles? If they really want to stop textile waste importing then why wouldn't they start with local legislation first? You don't need EU regulations to do import control I'd understand if they'd ask for EUs help for stopping illegal imports or something to that effect, but that doesn't seem to be the case here.
  - cthalupa 3y ago
    >Is anyone currently forcing Ghana to accept these textiles? No, and the super-importers bringing it all in are making a killing off of it. > If they really want to stop textile waste importing then why wouldn't they start with local legislation first? You don't need EU regulations to do import control Because the government of Ghana is currently incapable of or unwilling to handle it. My guess is there's enough money flowing from the people at the top towards the government to stop it, but that's a guess based off of a general distrust of politicians. I do, however, think it's fair to say that if we know that selling this stuff to Ghana is harming the everyday person there and that they are not capable of putting a stop to it - and the everyday person obviously is not - then there is a moral responsibility to not do it. I don't know that increasing the cost is going to do much to stop it, though - this largely just puts more money in the pockets of the people that have already shown they don't care about properly disposing of the portion of clothing that doesn't end up in the secondhand market. Assigning some small portion of that to the government or funding for cleanup won't change that. Placing requirements that make sure that it is only sold to importers that can make sure the waste portion is actually disposed of in a way that is ecologically friendly seems like a better solution. Obviously this would increase the price as well, but the primary goal of "Not ruining the local ecology and harming the people that have to live near it all" is going to be better served.
    - shakow 3y ago
      > then there is a moral responsibility to not do it. If you want to regulate international trade along a sense of ‶moral responsibility″, you will hit a lot of walls; the main one being ‶whose definition of moral responsibility?″, and the second one being ‶geez, virtually no country actually fills my definition of morally responsible trade″. Because if you cut out Ghana, good luck cutting out the whole of Africa, probably most of South America, quite a lot of EU countries, Russia, China, India, Malaysia, Indonesia, ...
    - zokier 3y ago
      > I don't know that increasing the cost is going to do much to stop it, though - this largely just puts more money in the pockets of the people that have already shown they don't care about properly disposing of the portion of clothing that doesn't end up in the secondhand market. Assigning some small portion of that to the government or funding for cleanup won't change that. That in broad strokes aligns with my feelings too, that is why I'm so critical of this sort of special case regulatory fees no matter how well intentioned.
      - actionfromafar 3y ago
        The supply may decrease.
oliwarner 3y ago
Import tariffs and enforcing regulations are expensive. That might not be intuitive but while Ghanaian companies are being payed to handle the waste, they're going to do everything they can to smuggle it in. More expense means less money to process waste properly. Countering all that is expensive. It's vastly cheaper for the government to ask other governments to stop exporting clothing waste to Ghanaian waste processing companies. Literally a phone call or three. As soon as they're not funding this, or they're only funding approved waste processing, the problem vanishes.

by zokier 3y ago

nradov 3y ago

Realistically Ghana just doesn't have the resources to strictly enforce local environmental rules. It's a poor country. They are asking for help.

actionfromafar 3y ago

Before outside environmental dumping, you were a poor country with n problems. After environmental dumping, you are now a country with n + 1 problems. Is it unfair to say to upstream "please stop"? Edit: (Or as it turns out, please pay more to handle this trash for you, it's getting out of hand here.)

zokier 3y ago
> Is it unfair to say to upstream "please stop"? Is anyone currently forcing Ghana to accept these textiles? If they really want to stop textile waste importing then why wouldn't they start with local legislation first? You don't need EU regulations to do import control I'd understand if they'd ask for EUs help for stopping illegal imports or something to that effect, but that doesn't seem to be the case here.
- cthalupa 3y ago
  >Is anyone currently forcing Ghana to accept these textiles? No, and the super-importers bringing it all in are making a killing off of it. > If they really want to stop textile waste importing then why wouldn't they start with local legislation first? You don't need EU regulations to do import control Because the government of Ghana is currently incapable of or unwilling to handle it. My guess is there's enough money flowing from the people at the top towards the government to stop it, but that's a guess based off of a general distrust of politicians. I do, however, think it's fair to say that if we know that selling this stuff to Ghana is harming the everyday person there and that they are not capable of putting a stop to it - and the everyday person obviously is not - then there is a moral responsibility to not do it. I don't know that increasing the cost is going to do much to stop it, though - this largely just puts more money in the pockets of the people that have already shown they don't care about properly disposing of the portion of clothing that doesn't end up in the secondhand market. Assigning some small portion of that to the government or funding for cleanup won't change that. Placing requirements that make sure that it is only sold to importers that can make sure the waste portion is actually disposed of in a way that is ecologically friendly seems like a better solution. Obviously this would increase the price as well, but the primary goal of "Not ruining the local ecology and harming the people that have to live near it all" is going to be better served.
  - shakow 3y ago
    > then there is a moral responsibility to not do it. If you want to regulate international trade along a sense of ‶moral responsibility″, you will hit a lot of walls; the main one being ‶whose definition of moral responsibility?″, and the second one being ‶geez, virtually no country actually fills my definition of morally responsible trade″. Because if you cut out Ghana, good luck cutting out the whole of Africa, probably most of South America, quite a lot of EU countries, Russia, China, India, Malaysia, Indonesia, ...
  - zokier 3y ago
    > I don't know that increasing the cost is going to do much to stop it, though - this largely just puts more money in the pockets of the people that have already shown they don't care about properly disposing of the portion of clothing that doesn't end up in the secondhand market. Assigning some small portion of that to the government or funding for cleanup won't change that. That in broad strokes aligns with my feelings too, that is why I'm so critical of this sort of special case regulatory fees no matter how well intentioned.
    - actionfromafar 3y ago
      The supply may decrease.

oliwarner 3y ago

Import tariffs and enforcing regulations are expensive. That might not be intuitive but while Ghanaian companies are being payed to handle the waste, they're going to do everything they can to smuggle it in. More expense means less money to process waste properly. Countering all that is expensive. It's vastly cheaper for the government to ask other governments to stop exporting clothing waste to Ghanaian waste processing companies. Literally a phone call or three. As soon as they're not funding this, or they're only funding approved waste processing, the problem vanishes.