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“PayPal forcing me to have a cellphone to access my account”
- aww_dang 3y agoSo many companies are insisting on adding the extra vulnerability of sim-swapping. I imagine on the aggregate level there might be less fraud? Or is it just the need to harvest more and more data? The way things are going, I wouldn't be surprised to see PayPal insist upon a mobile app install next.
- slv77 3y agoMalicious bots have gotten sophisticated enough that SMS verification and velocity controls are one of the few ways to manage Sybil attacks. Device and IP based systems can’t cope with the onslaught.
- toomuchtodo 3y agoWe really need some smart card cryptographic mechanisms for those without a smart phone, similar to Estonia’s smart card digital ID system. Asking everyone to have a smart phone to be identity proofed is simply not reasonable.
- UncleMeat 3y agoSMS works with dumb phones.
- toomuchtodo 3y agoSMS is not a secure authenticator for identity proofing due to SIM swapping/hijacks/etc.
- donmcronald 3y agoI’ve always assumed bad actors buy SIM cards and mobile numbers in huge quantities. Isnt that a lot cheaper than having to buy devices? Regardless, requiring phone numbers impacts a lot of real customers in a negative way.
- slv77 3y agoThe bad actors do buy SIM cards in large quantities and there are services that will rent out the numbers for SMS verification. It substantially raises the cost for someone that wants to register 100,000 fraudulent accounts without linking accounts based on phone numbers.
- landemva 3y agoSome concert venues are requiring axs.com mobile app to show the ticket QR code for entry and parking. I found out after I had purchased tickets.
- mips_r4300i 3y agoThis is also true for all venues through Ticketmaster (which is probably over 2/3 of them). A couple years ago, they moved from static barcodes to live, rolling 2d barcodes that expire every 30 seconds. It does work pretty well to prevent duping/fraud, but it absolutely requires a phone to enter the venue.
- JoeAltmaier 3y agoThey are ubiquitous. Old guy at the cafe counter has one he got for $1. So maybe not the societal problem it might have been decades ago. I mean, if you need a PayPal account then you must have a dollar.
- nehal3m 3y agoIt would force you into a contract with one or more third parties though, at least a carrier and a handset maker. Maybe Google or Apple as well.
- aww_dang 3y agoAnd if you live in a foreign country and bank in another country, what then? Fly back to your "home" country to sign in and stop rebills?
- lioeters 3y agoThis got me too, they locked me out of my account with close to a thousand dollars. I tell people every chance I get to avoid PayPal, they're a horrible company. Most of the time I hear back, "Yeah I know."
- malermeister 3y agoI'm locked out of my paypal account right now because they decided to enable 2fa on an ancient phone number I had in there from years ago out of nowhere. I don't have access to that number anymore and there's no way to change it.
- happymellon 3y agoI have the same issue with my Apple account. They have my email on file but won't help because the number doesn't match anymore. Just one more reason to not return to the iDevices.
- tail_exchange 3y agoSeems interesting that smartphones are so ubiquitous nowadays that companies are happier to just drop customers that don't have them than adjusting their business strategy. We seem to be moving towards a future where not having a smartphone is just as unthinkable as not having a bank account or electricity.
- pessimizer 3y agoEventually we'll reach a point where the police search for you if your phone is off for too long, and ticket you for wasting police time when they find you.
- eternityforest 3y agoSounds like an amazing feature already if it was an opt-in service you could turn on and off when you're going to a place where you expect murderers.
- hammyhavoc 3y agoThere's plenty of places that are dangerous, which police are known not to go into because wearing a police uniform is an invitation for trouble. You'd also likely be long dead before anybody investigated your disappearance in this hypothetical scenario.
- aww_dang 3y agoImagine thinking that dropping expats and international travelers is a good move though.
- londgine 3y agowhy imagine? Many banks worldwide currently simply don't allow Americans to open an account with them.
- Broken_Hippo 3y agoDo you think that international travelers don't have mobile phones? Really? Same for expats - most immigrants I meet have mobile phones. (I am an immigrant, and meet a fair amount of other immigrants, from various backgrounds, various income levels, and various sorts of jobs). I had to look up to see if the country I'm in even offered residential landline service, honestly. Not everyone has a smartphone, but that's not what is required. Just a mobile phone that can receive an SMS - and phones have been doing that for 25 years or something.
- chatmasta 3y agoThe most annoying part of company support forums like this, other than the total lack of response from actual company representatives, is the bootlicking simps who show up in the replies to defend the company. What kind of person does this? What possible reward do they expect for defending the user-hostile decisions of multinational billion dollar corporations?
- xattt 3y agoOn the same note, what the hell is up with the cottage industry of volunteers on Microsoft’s community site who claim to be some self-assigned title?
- bombcar 3y agoIt’s so common that I have to believe someone somewhere is selling it as a path to a job, probably in foreign countries.
- edandersen 3y agoIt used to be a potential route to Microsoft MVP too I believe.
- chatmasta 3y agoDare I ask what's a Microsoft MVP?
- RealStickman_ 3y agoMinimum Viable Pawn
- yoshamano 3y agoanswers.microsoft.com is an insufferable hive of scum and villainy where everyone cares about replying to your question but no one cares about answering your question. 10 times out of 10 you're better off walking outside and screaming your issue into the void then you are posting about it. Also, microsoft.com's general propensity to hijack the back button with their login.microsoftonline.com redirects is just that annoying little cherry on top.
- aaron695 3y ago[dead]
- charlieyu1 3y agoPayPal was the pioneer of e-commerce once upon a time, but now it is better to forget them for good.
- raincole 3y agoFor many of us there aren't other viable choices.
- mikecoles 3y agoCash, coin, and barter all work. Money orders for the few times something isn't available locally.
- charlieyu1 3y agoNow I’m curious about the possible use case, direct bank transfers or most virtual finance apps charge less than PayPal now, unlike the early 2000s. And if you want privacy instead, PayPal is far worse than crypto
- raincole 3y agoInternational bank transfer is much slower and (for smaller amount) more expensive than PayPal. No other PayPal-like finance apps cover as much countries as PayPal.
- mrwnmonm 3y agoI was just thinking about that. I like the idea of getting rid of my phone. But looks like you can't do that now.
- anonzzzies 3y agoGetting rid of paypal is not a bad idea anyway; some day they will ‘disappoint’ you too (and steal some money). It’s in their dna. After that you can get rid of your phone. Although all banks in my country need a mobile phone (and some a modern smartphone) too; not sure how that is elsewhere.
- thedailymail 3y agoIt is possible, but it raises the difficulty setting of many otherwise trivial life tasks. I'm in my fifties and have never owned a mobile phone, initially because I don't like phone calls, but more recently out of general cussedness. (I do use an ipad.) The number of services for which a phone number for 2FA or confirmation by SMS is mandatory is definitely on the rise. I guess at some point going phoneless may become the equivalent of trying to live without a bank account. But for now, it remains just barely doable.
- pipeline_peak 3y ago> What kind of person does this? Possibly Employees pretending to be customers
- rgavuliak 3y agoDon't you guys have phones?
- justinclift 3y agoNot everyone does. For example, I used to live in a part of the UK with no mobile towers, and thus no reception. So if I really, absolutely had to make a phone call at some point I could then travel to a different town + buy a new sim card / phone number to make the call with. Meanwhile Vodafone (UK) expires mobile phone numbers after 3 months of inactivity. So, that "new" phone number would tend to be expired when I next needed to use it. This happened several times. :/
- rickstanley 3y agoYeah, you guys all have phone right?
- anankaie 3y agoThe one I ran into recently was Discord. I use Skype to front all of my SMS. Unfortunately, the SMS-in numbers are not tagged "mobile", so Discord refuses to accept them. Their "solution" is for me to register another account and hope I do not need to provide my phone number... Despite my specifically pointing out that the only reason I need to do this is that Discord allows their servers to require this kind of verification. Ah well, guess I cannot be a Discord user.