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Language discussions are unpleasent and waste of time Ive seen like hundreds of discussions like that Java vs c# vs rust vs go vs kotlin It is always heavy o

Language discussions are unpleasent and waste of time Ive seen like hundreds of discussions like that Java vs c# vs rust vs go vs kotlin It is always heavy of emotions, unverified claims (performance especially) and dependent on what stuff do you value. This kind of discussion requires wide knowledge, hands on experience, curiosity and open mindness. All of those 4 are really desirable itself, so together even more and are really rare! >I prefer to work with an excellent software engineer, who doesn't tie their identity to a specific language or technology (e.g. would prefer a great hacker than someone who identifies as a "Ruby developer" or "JS developer.") Why it matters to you how somebody calls himself? Is this "single lang programmer" insult variation? Especially when you are aware that concepts are above languages >For all my advocacy in this post, it may surprise you to hear that I believe it takes years to be excellent at a language. It's not just syntax, it's soil and atmosphere: common bug flows and how to spot them, footguns, tooling, Agree! Many people do not get it, they are always like "you can learn langs after your first within a month" or so >Functional programmers insisted without evidence that their programs were More Correct. Hah

bsenftner 3y ago
Throw in the fact that most programmers are terrible communicators, and we get complete nonsense non-debates that are little more than emotional cry fests.
klibertp 3y ago
> Many people do not get it, they are always like "you can learn langs after your first within a month" or so In my experience: half a year minimum, and only after your 10th. The amount of uninteresting trivia that you need to wade through on your way to concepts you already know is vast, much greater than you'd remember from 10 years back when you learned your previous language. More then 10 languages I already know do help, in that I can easily pick up any language in a matter of days, but... that's only if we're talking about the language[1]. Developing a skill in using that language, including absorbing the specific culture (books read, talks given, whose blogs to read, which Discord/Slack/#freenode to visit, and so on) and learning the details of the ecosystem (from stdlib to common libraries to frameworks, to the details of implementation, the FFI, and so on) and it's a lot of things to learn. Well, at least I know that my next language will be a lot easier to learn, thanks to a revolution in the rubber duck industry, which gave us a duck that can - sometimes convincingly - pretend to understand what we're saying. And sometimes even gives you a hint that turns out to be real! Oh, the progress... [1] As long as there's no genuinely innovative features in that language. Which, sadly, seems to be the case 95% of the time.

bsenftner 3y ago

Throw in the fact that most programmers are terrible communicators, and we get complete nonsense non-debates that are little more than emotional cry fests.

klibertp 3y ago

> Many people do not get it, they are always like "you can learn langs after your first within a month" or so In my experience: half a year minimum, and only after your 10th. The amount of uninteresting trivia that you need to wade through on your way to concepts you already know is vast, much greater than you'd remember from 10 years back when you learned your previous language. More then 10 languages I already know do help, in that I can easily pick up any language in a matter of days, but... that's only if we're talking about the language[1]. Developing a skill in using that language, including absorbing the specific culture (books read, talks given, whose blogs to read, which Discord/Slack/#freenode to visit, and so on) and learning the details of the ecosystem (from stdlib to common libraries to frameworks, to the details of implementation, the FFI, and so on) and it's a lot of things to learn. Well, at least I know that my next language will be a lot easier to learn, thanks to a revolution in the rubber duck industry, which gave us a duck that can - sometimes convincingly - pretend to understand what we're saying. And sometimes even gives you a hint that turns out to be real! Oh, the progress... [1] As long as there's no genuinely innovative features in that language. Which, sadly, seems to be the case 95% of the time.