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I'm convinced there are now multiple generations of engineers that have no idea that it is possible to write software that doesn't require over the air updates

I'm convinced there are now multiple generations of engineers that have no idea that it is possible to write software that doesn't require over the air updates nor telemetry. Have we all forgotten how Nest thermostats turned off the heat in the middle of January 2016 because of a botched software update? (Probably. It was hard to get Google to surface a link without a date due to so much SEO bullshit). https://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/14/fashion/nest-thermostat-glitch-battery-dies-software-freeze.html https://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/14/fashion/nest-thermostat-g...

leipert 3y ago
It’s not necessarily the engineers. Product and Leadership needs the telemetry in order to justify the expenses for their department or team or whatever and therefore justify the existence of those engineers.
leoqa 3y ago
If that happens just jump the low voltage to your wires. Most heat pump setups have two inputs: on/off and heat/cool via the reversing valve.
- bombcar 3y ago
  You can even wire an old style thermostat in parallel if you want, or have it available to slot in.
  - riceart 3y ago
    Note that this doesn’t always work with smart thermostats. From first hand experience, there are some models out there that will generally work fine but will not complete booting up if one of the outputs is detected as closed.
    - bombcar 3y ago
      Yeah, in that case you can get an old thermostat that disconnects easily and wire it somewhere out of the way. (Though replacing a smart thermostat with a mercury switch one is a five minute job if you're comfortable with it.)
dahart 3y ago
Maybe, I guess, but it’d be pretty weird to be an engineer of any kind and not know about local file systems. More likely, both companies and most users want remote updates, and companies certainly love as much telemetry as they can get. At least in this case, ASUS routers all have local firmware install functionality, so this particular case is certainly not an example of engineers not knowing it’s possible to write offline updates. Now if you’re really lamenting the lack of computing devices that cannot be updated remotely by design, that’s a different story, and might be on a ship that sailed a while back. The problem there is that local updates are inconvenient enough for most people that they aren’t done, which is problematic from support and security perspectives, even though there are legit problems with remote updates too…
harry8 3y ago
> It was hard to get Google to surface a link without a date due to so much SEO bullshit Google no longer does search, it does "recommendation" and it sucks hard.
- beebeepka 3y ago
  No longer??? It's been more than a decade. A lot more
  - dotancohen 3y ago
    For some of us, a decade really isn't a long time. Now get off my lawn ))
- mavhc 3y ago
  I just searched [Nest thermostats turned off the heat because of a botched software update] and the first result was correct

leipert 3y ago

It’s not necessarily the engineers. Product and Leadership needs the telemetry in order to justify the expenses for their department or team or whatever and therefore justify the existence of those engineers.

leoqa 3y ago

If that happens just jump the low voltage to your wires. Most heat pump setups have two inputs: on/off and heat/cool via the reversing valve.

bombcar 3y ago
You can even wire an old style thermostat in parallel if you want, or have it available to slot in.
- riceart 3y ago
  Note that this doesn’t always work with smart thermostats. From first hand experience, there are some models out there that will generally work fine but will not complete booting up if one of the outputs is detected as closed.
  - bombcar 3y ago
    Yeah, in that case you can get an old thermostat that disconnects easily and wire it somewhere out of the way. (Though replacing a smart thermostat with a mercury switch one is a five minute job if you're comfortable with it.)

dahart 3y ago

Maybe, I guess, but it’d be pretty weird to be an engineer of any kind and not know about local file systems. More likely, both companies and most users want remote updates, and companies certainly love as much telemetry as they can get. At least in this case, ASUS routers all have local firmware install functionality, so this particular case is certainly not an example of engineers not knowing it’s possible to write offline updates. Now if you’re really lamenting the lack of computing devices that cannot be updated remotely by design, that’s a different story, and might be on a ship that sailed a while back. The problem there is that local updates are inconvenient enough for most people that they aren’t done, which is problematic from support and security perspectives, even though there are legit problems with remote updates too…

harry8 3y ago

> It was hard to get Google to surface a link without a date due to so much SEO bullshit Google no longer does search, it does "recommendation" and it sucks hard.

beebeepka 3y ago
No longer??? It's been more than a decade. A lot more
- dotancohen 3y ago
  For some of us, a decade really isn't a long time. Now get off my lawn ))
mavhc 3y ago
I just searched [Nest thermostats turned off the heat because of a botched software update] and the first result was correct