5 ms·

Yes but it’s not a lie to say it was phased out in the 70s. Your comment would be more substantial and useful if you made whatever nuance you’re trying to highl

by dcow 3y ago

Yes but it’s not a lie to say it was phased out in the 70s. Your comment would be more substantial and useful if you made whatever nuance you’re trying to highlight clear.

justin66 3y ago
> Yes but it’s not a lie to say it was phased out in the 70s I don't understand why you would write that, particularly after having read my comments and throwaway2037's comment on this thread. "This is a chemical that is currently produced in various forms by companies and used by people in 2023" and "it was phased out in the 1970s" would seem to be mutually contradictory facts. There's no "nuance" involved. I get that we're not giving you essay-length analysis here, but... I give up. edit: the LMGTFY for "who makes trichloroethylene": https://www.thomasnet.com/products/trichloroethylene-87673604-1.html https://www.thomasnet.com/products/trichloroethylene-8767360...
- dcow 3y ago
  Mass, widespread, unchecked use and subsequent dumping of the chemical was phased out because that practice was understood to be harmful to people and the environment. The fact that it is now used in a controlled and regulated manner is entirely different. You either missed this nuance, or you are deliberately being obtuse to make a point that "it's technically still used" which, obviously, is true, and also doesn't contradict the fact that it was phased out in the 70s once found to be poisonous.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- sophacles 3y ago
  You're ignoring the modifier - "generally phased out" is not the same statement as "completely phased out". For example: Generally people don't make their own clothes, is a true statement even though there's still plenty of people who make their own clothes.
  - justin66 3y ago
    Indeed. Reading these replies I can see that the real issue is one of adverbs.
krageon 3y ago
If the poster you responded to is right, it is in fact a lie to say it was phased out in any meaningful manner. I don't see this comment as unhelpful - if the use just didn't stop, that's that. What is there to discuss? It was poison, it's still poison. it's in picrin [1], which is a spot cleaning solvent. You can buy that today. A paper from 2020 indicates that it is still used and not banned [2] [1] https://www.a-1products.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/Picrin-GHS-SDS.pdf https://www.a-1products.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/Picri... [2] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7941732/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7941732/
- justin66 3y ago
  It's a component in some solvents a consumer might use, as you noted, but it's also used in manufacturing, in areas where a trace amount might end up in a consumer product but the major problem is for the people who are exposed to it during that item's manufacture. (or for the people who have to deal with the manufacturer's waste)
- throwaway2037 3y ago
  Good point about spot cleaning. I didn't know that. Here is what Google told me about it: Trichloroethylene has been a long-standing chemical utilized in dry cleaning and spot removal processes, but its safety towards dry cleaners' health has been questioned in recent years. In 2012, California enacted a ban on using TCE or TCE-based products for dry cleaning.

by dcow 3y ago

Yes but it’s not a lie to say it was phased out in the 70s. Your comment would be more substantial and useful if you made whatever nuance you’re trying to highlight clear.

justin66 3y ago

> Yes but it’s not a lie to say it was phased out in the 70s I don't understand why you would write that, particularly after having read my comments and throwaway2037's comment on this thread. "This is a chemical that is currently produced in various forms by companies and used by people in 2023" and "it was phased out in the 1970s" would seem to be mutually contradictory facts. There's no "nuance" involved. I get that we're not giving you essay-length analysis here, but... I give up. edit: the LMGTFY for "who makes trichloroethylene": https://www.thomasnet.com/products/trichloroethylene-87673604-1.html https://www.thomasnet.com/products/trichloroethylene-8767360...

dcow 3y ago
Mass, widespread, unchecked use and subsequent dumping of the chemical was phased out because that practice was understood to be harmful to people and the environment. The fact that it is now used in a controlled and regulated manner is entirely different. You either missed this nuance, or you are deliberately being obtuse to make a point that "it's technically still used" which, obviously, is true, and also doesn't contradict the fact that it was phased out in the 70s once found to be poisonous.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
sophacles 3y ago
You're ignoring the modifier - "generally phased out" is not the same statement as "completely phased out". For example: Generally people don't make their own clothes, is a true statement even though there's still plenty of people who make their own clothes.
- justin66 3y ago
  Indeed. Reading these replies I can see that the real issue is one of adverbs.

krageon 3y ago

If the poster you responded to is right, it is in fact a lie to say it was phased out in any meaningful manner. I don't see this comment as unhelpful - if the use just didn't stop, that's that. What is there to discuss? It was poison, it's still poison. it's in picrin [1], which is a spot cleaning solvent. You can buy that today. A paper from 2020 indicates that it is still used and not banned [2] [1] https://www.a-1products.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/Picrin-GHS-SDS.pdf https://www.a-1products.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/Picri... [2] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7941732/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7941732/

justin66 3y ago
It's a component in some solvents a consumer might use, as you noted, but it's also used in manufacturing, in areas where a trace amount might end up in a consumer product but the major problem is for the people who are exposed to it during that item's manufacture. (or for the people who have to deal with the manufacturer's waste)
throwaway2037 3y ago
Good point about spot cleaning. I didn't know that. Here is what Google told me about it: Trichloroethylene has been a long-standing chemical utilized in dry cleaning and spot removal processes, but its safety towards dry cleaners' health has been questioned in recent years. In 2012, California enacted a ban on using TCE or TCE-based products for dry cleaning.