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How deep do you take that though? The reason why bison were gone doesn’t change the fact that they were nearly were at the time and that the introduction of hip

by lovich 3y ago

How deep do you take that though? The reason why bison were gone doesn’t change the fact that they were nearly were at the time and that the introduction of hippos were a replacement. If you need to have every side fact explained in detail, then you’re going to have an extremely long, probably book length discussion on any given topic. I think “bison had become nearly extinct” is accurate enough to show why hippos as a meat source were even a topic of discussion

boplicity 3y ago
> How deep do you take that though? The literal reason they were even thinking about importing hippos was because "bison had become nearly extinct." It's not exactly going "deep" to spend one or two sentences on why they'd gone extinct. Without the genocide, this very likely wouldn't have happened. It's the direct cause, and not a "side fact." I'm confused why you would think otherwise.
- nonethewiser 3y ago
  I posted this article because it highlighted the interesting details about the plan the best, but others suggested meat monopolies were the actual reason. I dont think Bison were a staple prior to 1900 or anything. If we want to talk about a glaring omission, its that.
  - boplicity 3y ago
    >I dont think Bison were a staple prior to 1900 or anything. You've been misinformed. Bison was the "was the principal food source for Indigenous Peoples of the Plains.[0]" Indigenous people depended on bison for food; bison were slaughtered wholesale in order to make life as hard as possible for indigenous people to live. This was quite intentional, and extremely horrible. And yes, it sucks, and is uncomfortable to think about. Doesn't mean we should ignore it, though. [0] http://traditionalanimalfoods.org/mammals/hoofed/page.aspx?id=6136 http://traditionalanimalfoods.org/mammals/hoofed/page.aspx?i...
    - whimsicalism 3y ago
      they are clearly talking about the US as a whole and the collapse of bison population was multi-causal, attributing it all to an effort to get rid of native americans is frankly ahistorical. Bison decline was already decidedly in the cards by the time colonizers started large-scale hunting of them, due to the introduction of the horse and the rifle among tribal communities (the popular depiction of plains native americans as long-term bison hunters is a western conjuration not based in reality). [0] there is a tendency in pop (progressive) history journalism to use the fact that someone said something as evidence that this was the primary motivator for why people did the things they did. (see, for instance, the 1492 project). [0]: https://www.counterpunch.org/2021/06/09/what-role-did-native-americans-and-horses-play-in-the-decline-of-bison/ https://www.counterpunch.org/2021/06/09/what-role-did-native...

by lovich 3y ago

boplicity 3y ago

> How deep do you take that though? The literal reason they were even thinking about importing hippos was because "bison had become nearly extinct." It's not exactly going "deep" to spend one or two sentences on why they'd gone extinct. Without the genocide, this very likely wouldn't have happened. It's the direct cause, and not a "side fact." I'm confused why you would think otherwise.

nonethewiser 3y ago
I posted this article because it highlighted the interesting details about the plan the best, but others suggested meat monopolies were the actual reason. I dont think Bison were a staple prior to 1900 or anything. If we want to talk about a glaring omission, its that.
- boplicity 3y ago
  >I dont think Bison were a staple prior to 1900 or anything. You've been misinformed. Bison was the "was the principal food source for Indigenous Peoples of the Plains.[0]" Indigenous people depended on bison for food; bison were slaughtered wholesale in order to make life as hard as possible for indigenous people to live. This was quite intentional, and extremely horrible. And yes, it sucks, and is uncomfortable to think about. Doesn't mean we should ignore it, though. [0] http://traditionalanimalfoods.org/mammals/hoofed/page.aspx?id=6136 http://traditionalanimalfoods.org/mammals/hoofed/page.aspx?i...
  - whimsicalism 3y ago
    they are clearly talking about the US as a whole and the collapse of bison population was multi-causal, attributing it all to an effort to get rid of native americans is frankly ahistorical. Bison decline was already decidedly in the cards by the time colonizers started large-scale hunting of them, due to the introduction of the horse and the rifle among tribal communities (the popular depiction of plains native americans as long-term bison hunters is a western conjuration not based in reality). [0] there is a tendency in pop (progressive) history journalism to use the fact that someone said something as evidence that this was the primary motivator for why people did the things they did. (see, for instance, the 1492 project). [0]: https://www.counterpunch.org/2021/06/09/what-role-did-native-americans-and-horses-play-in-the-decline-of-bison/ https://www.counterpunch.org/2021/06/09/what-role-did-native...