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> Unlike some other companies’ approaches, Dell seems to be asking workers who live within an hour’s commute to work from the office for three days per week, ra

> Unlike some other companies’ approaches, Dell seems to be asking workers who live within an hour’s commute to work from the office for three days per week, rather than specific job roles. Hour during rush hour or hour as measured by Google Maps without traffic data? So they're basically asking people to spend 40 hours a month, unpaid, in their car going to and from work with no compensation?

karolist 4y ago
You are free to live closer if you want to work there, not saying it's right or wrong, just not the 40 hour constant you bring up.
- verall 4y ago
  The 40 hours is interesting because it seems like you could also live further from work and it would go down to 0 hours.
- mschuster91 4y ago
  > You are free to live closer if you want to work there How? Most people can barely make rent as it is, the problem is that almost everywhere the large employers are in the city centers and people can't reasonably move close to there.
- theshrike79 4y ago
  I know multiple people first hand who moved away from their expensive homes to cheaper and bigger ones during the pandemic when WFH became a standard. There are exactly zero ways you can force those people from their homes back to city apartments. Their kids go to school in the new city, their SOs might have in-person jobs there, they have a huge yard and better quality of living. Some of them theoretically work under an hour away from their current job. If companies force WFH, they will just quit and find a new remote-only job.
  - pif 4y ago
    [flagged]
  - Gigachad 4y ago
    >If companies force WFH, they will just quit and find a new remote-only job. Cool, and I'll apply for the now open position as I have great train access to the city.
    - jen20 4y ago
      Dell is in Round Rock which has precisely zero train options besides the model railway exhibition each December, so unless you’re one of the Borrowers, you’re talking crap.
      - TexanFeller 4y ago
        Round Rock is near where a lot of those large and cheap houses are in the first place. The people in small and expensive apartments downtown moved near Round Rock or Cedar Park during the pandemic.
        jen20 4y ago
        It’s where they _were_ before the pandemic. All the way out to Leander costs princely sums for cookie cutter suburbs these days. I doubt Dell have adjusted their pay to accommodate that.
      - verall 4y ago
        Our model railway runs hourly but it doesn't go to round rock :P
      - Gigachad 4y ago
        I was talking generally about most companies, but if Dell does have an office in the middle of nowhere, then I guess they will have problems.
andy_ppp 4y ago
I didn’t see them lowering salaries when WFH was implemented in the first place so I don’t think that they should raise salaries when removing it. A few people I know had WFH written into their contracts so I guess they would be able to renegotiate or keep home working. In the end this has always been about manager/owner power, not about getting work done or doing the right thing by your employees.
- jjeaff 4y ago
  I remember at least proposals from companies like Facebook talking about lowering salaries for people moving to lower cost of living areas. Not sure how broadly it was implemented.
WheatMillington 4y ago
You're not forced to live at the outside edge of the given commute.
hnlmorg 4y ago
You say this like it’s a new and offensive idea when in fact this has been the norm for as long as paid workforce has been concept. With regards to hybrid jobs: you can get a job closer to home, but there is a reason why house prices are more expensive in tech hubs and why wages are lower where housing is cheaper. So you can either have cheaper housing but lower income, higher income but higher house prices, or have both but pay the penalty with you time (ie longer commutes). This is how it’s always been and why fully remote jobs have been a great life hack. But you can’t really complain about having to spend you own time commuting should you have a hybrid role.
- georgemcbay 4y ago
  > this has been the norm for as long as paid workforce has been concept. Just because something has been done for a long time doesn't mean it's fair or right. The standard work week was once 12-14 hours a day, 6 days a week. Things change. > But you can’t really complain about having to spend you own time commuting should you have a hybrid role. Of course you can. You can complain about anything, and sometimes with very good reasons. Ultimately employers are free to demand that employees RTO with no travel time compensation if they want, but it's silly to say this is something the employees can't complain about.
  - shjake 4y ago
    So one person buys/rents an expensive house just to be closer to the office and not have to commute. Somebody else makes the decision to live 1.5 hours away to save money. How would travel time compensation work in this situation? Why would companies not discriminate implicitly or explicitly against employees who live further away?
    - georgemcbay 4y ago
      I am not advocating for travel time compensation; I am advocating for the right to complain in general. I work from home the vast majority of the time currently with very occasional visits to the office. The office for me is 15 minutes away. I would never accept a job that required a greater than 20-minute single direction commute, so travel time compensation is not on my radar of things to worry about.
thepostman0 4y ago
The real bind is fitting travel around family life that changed since 2020, kids going to different schools and spouse changing jobs means work life balance is shared differently for most people. I can see the issue going beyond pay, people can't be into places at once, but you can put the hours in when remote spread over the day.
u801e 4y ago
Maybe employees should take that into account. If work hours are from 9 am through 5 pm, then the commute starts at 9 am and again at 4 pm.
- flakeoil 4y ago
  If you don't want to work, you don't have to. Why don't you just resign instead and stay in bed 9-5?
  - whateveracct 4y ago
    I do work and quitting time is 1pm every day :) not a bad way to make a lot of money

karolist 4y ago

You are free to live closer if you want to work there, not saying it's right or wrong, just not the 40 hour constant you bring up.

verall 4y ago
The 40 hours is interesting because it seems like you could also live further from work and it would go down to 0 hours.
mschuster91 4y ago
> You are free to live closer if you want to work there How? Most people can barely make rent as it is, the problem is that almost everywhere the large employers are in the city centers and people can't reasonably move close to there.
theshrike79 4y ago
I know multiple people first hand who moved away from their expensive homes to cheaper and bigger ones during the pandemic when WFH became a standard. There are exactly zero ways you can force those people from their homes back to city apartments. Their kids go to school in the new city, their SOs might have in-person jobs there, they have a huge yard and better quality of living. Some of them theoretically work under an hour away from their current job. If companies force WFH, they will just quit and find a new remote-only job.
- pif 4y ago
  [flagged]
- Gigachad 4y ago
  >If companies force WFH, they will just quit and find a new remote-only job. Cool, and I'll apply for the now open position as I have great train access to the city.
  - jen20 4y ago
    Dell is in Round Rock which has precisely zero train options besides the model railway exhibition each December, so unless you’re one of the Borrowers, you’re talking crap.
    - TexanFeller 4y ago
      Round Rock is near where a lot of those large and cheap houses are in the first place. The people in small and expensive apartments downtown moved near Round Rock or Cedar Park during the pandemic.
      - jen20 4y ago
        It’s where they _were_ before the pandemic. All the way out to Leander costs princely sums for cookie cutter suburbs these days. I doubt Dell have adjusted their pay to accommodate that.
    - verall 4y ago
      Our model railway runs hourly but it doesn't go to round rock :P
    - Gigachad 4y ago
      I was talking generally about most companies, but if Dell does have an office in the middle of nowhere, then I guess they will have problems.

andy_ppp 4y ago

I didn’t see them lowering salaries when WFH was implemented in the first place so I don’t think that they should raise salaries when removing it. A few people I know had WFH written into their contracts so I guess they would be able to renegotiate or keep home working. In the end this has always been about manager/owner power, not about getting work done or doing the right thing by your employees.

jjeaff 4y ago
I remember at least proposals from companies like Facebook talking about lowering salaries for people moving to lower cost of living areas. Not sure how broadly it was implemented.

WheatMillington 4y ago

You're not forced to live at the outside edge of the given commute.

hnlmorg 4y ago

You say this like it’s a new and offensive idea when in fact this has been the norm for as long as paid workforce has been concept. With regards to hybrid jobs: you can get a job closer to home, but there is a reason why house prices are more expensive in tech hubs and why wages are lower where housing is cheaper. So you can either have cheaper housing but lower income, higher income but higher house prices, or have both but pay the penalty with you time (ie longer commutes). This is how it’s always been and why fully remote jobs have been a great life hack. But you can’t really complain about having to spend you own time commuting should you have a hybrid role.

georgemcbay 4y ago
> this has been the norm for as long as paid workforce has been concept. Just because something has been done for a long time doesn't mean it's fair or right. The standard work week was once 12-14 hours a day, 6 days a week. Things change. > But you can’t really complain about having to spend you own time commuting should you have a hybrid role. Of course you can. You can complain about anything, and sometimes with very good reasons. Ultimately employers are free to demand that employees RTO with no travel time compensation if they want, but it's silly to say this is something the employees can't complain about.
- shjake 4y ago
  So one person buys/rents an expensive house just to be closer to the office and not have to commute. Somebody else makes the decision to live 1.5 hours away to save money. How would travel time compensation work in this situation? Why would companies not discriminate implicitly or explicitly against employees who live further away?
  - georgemcbay 4y ago
    I am not advocating for travel time compensation; I am advocating for the right to complain in general. I work from home the vast majority of the time currently with very occasional visits to the office. The office for me is 15 minutes away. I would never accept a job that required a greater than 20-minute single direction commute, so travel time compensation is not on my radar of things to worry about.

thepostman0 4y ago

The real bind is fitting travel around family life that changed since 2020, kids going to different schools and spouse changing jobs means work life balance is shared differently for most people. I can see the issue going beyond pay, people can't be into places at once, but you can put the hours in when remote spread over the day.

u801e 4y ago

Maybe employees should take that into account. If work hours are from 9 am through 5 pm, then the commute starts at 9 am and again at 4 pm.

flakeoil 4y ago
If you don't want to work, you don't have to. Why don't you just resign instead and stay in bed 9-5?
- whateveracct 4y ago
  I do work and quitting time is 1pm every day :) not a bad way to make a lot of money