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A big factor in the decline of internet media companies that nobody talks about—every single dominant social platform (except this one) now aggressively penaliz

A big factor in the decline of internet media companies that nobody talks about—every single dominant social platform (except this one) now aggressively penalizes external links in their algorithms. This should be illegal for any dominant platform IMO, external links are the lifeblood of a free and open internet. They are the only release valve from the walled gardens the inevitably result from human power-law clustering and network effects.

flappyeagle 3y ago
What are you on about? I have to link to external websites from mine? Lost the plot on this one.
- karaterobot 3y ago
  Can't tell if you're joking, but it seems pretty clear. If you are a news outlet, reporting on something written by someone else — for example, a government report, a scientific article, even a tweet — it makes sense to link to that external resource in the article. Yet, many websites refuse to do that, because it takes eyeballs away from the ads they're serving. I'd cite a reference supporting what I'm saying here, but I don't want you to stop reading my comment and go to a new page, just take my word for it.
- tester457 3y ago
  Facebook, Twitter, Elon etc have said external links rank more poorly in the algorithm. That is why facebook is rampant with people stealing others videos and reposting it on the platform.
  - flappyeagle 3y ago
    There is nothing wrong with this. They get to moderate what’s on their website. If I don’t want X on my website, I can downrank it. Doesn’t matter if that thing is “hate speech”, “porn”, “links to other websites”, “off-topic comments”
candiddevmike 3y ago
Social media became better at curating news than the news sites themselves, IMO, and most folks end up just reading comments or quotes in the comments. There's also too much noise on most media outlets. I think most media outlets should look at LWN as a model for sustainability: niche stories, hyper focused on what their audience is interested in.
- willdough 3y ago
  What is LWN?
  - detaro 3y ago
    https://lwn.net/ https://lwn.net/
- incone123 3y ago
  How are you defining 'better'?
- HPsquared 3y ago
  Even when I'm on an actual newspaper's site, I only briefly check the headline and give the article a token perfunctory skim, then spend the bulk of my time reading the comments.
  - HDThoreaun 3y ago
    This feels like a gigantic mistake to me. The comments generally have the least facts and most bias. Another link on HN front page right now is about companies being fined by the government for creating millions of fake personas to comment on social media and news site. With the article you at lest know the author is real.
- karaterobot 3y ago
  This, is such a succinct summary of what is wrong with the news that I am upvoting it even if you didn't mean it that way. To be clear: the curation social media does is perverse, because it bubbles the worst, most salacious and panicked stories to the top. Reading comments and quotes without having the context of the article itself is a great way to wind up angry and misinformed. If you're a news outlet, designing your news coverage to support this is unethical, and results in a cultural death spiral. Hyper-focusing on what your audience is interested in is good business, but bad journalism, and freedom of the press is enshrined in law so they can inform us rather than just give us the content we crave.
sclarisse 3y ago
What do you mean no one talks about it? The media itself (and occasionally even the United States government) were taking about it a lot as they lamented the rise of Fake News and the election of Donald Trump. They asked for it, and suggested if they didn’t get it there might be heavy handed regulation. Facebook gave it to them. A sample. "What Facebook Did to American Democracy" — The Atlantic https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/10/what-facebook-did/542502/ https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/10/what-... "Facebook Has Been a Disaster for the World" — The New York Times https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/18/opinion/facebook-democracy.html https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/18/opinion/facebook-democrac... "Mark Zuckerberg Has Set Our Democracy on Fire" — The Nation https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/zuckerberg-facebook-political-advertising/ https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/zuckerberg-facebo... "Can Mark Zuckerberg Fix Facebook Before It Breaks Democracy?" — The New Yorker https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2018/09/17/can-mark-zuckerberg-fix-facebook-before-it-breaks-democracy https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2018/09/17/can-mark-zucke... "Facebook harms children and weakens democracy: ex-employee" — BBC https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-58805965 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-58805965 “Fighting Digital Disinformation” - Warren for Senate https://elizabethwarren.com/plans/fighting-digital-disinformation https://elizabethwarren.com/plans/fighting-digital-disinform...
- 908B64B197 3y ago
  All of these media organizations are in direct competition with Facebook for advertising revenue (and are losing pretty badly). They all have a vested interest in Facebook usage dropping.
  - sclarisse 3y ago
    That’s fine there’s more. Were we talking Buzzfeed? “How Facebook Failed To Prevent Stop The Steal” https://www.buzzfeednews.com/amphtml/craigsilverman/facebook-failed-stop-the-steal-insurrection https://www.buzzfeednews.com/amphtml/craigsilverman/facebook... “I have blood on my hands” https://www.buzzfeednews.com/amphtml/craigsilverman/facebook-ignore-political-manipulation-whistleblower-memo https://www.buzzfeednews.com/amphtml/craigsilverman/facebook...

flappyeagle 3y ago

What are you on about? I have to link to external websites from mine? Lost the plot on this one.

karaterobot 3y ago
Can't tell if you're joking, but it seems pretty clear. If you are a news outlet, reporting on something written by someone else — for example, a government report, a scientific article, even a tweet — it makes sense to link to that external resource in the article. Yet, many websites refuse to do that, because it takes eyeballs away from the ads they're serving. I'd cite a reference supporting what I'm saying here, but I don't want you to stop reading my comment and go to a new page, just take my word for it.
tester457 3y ago
Facebook, Twitter, Elon etc have said external links rank more poorly in the algorithm. That is why facebook is rampant with people stealing others videos and reposting it on the platform.
- flappyeagle 3y ago
  There is nothing wrong with this. They get to moderate what’s on their website. If I don’t want X on my website, I can downrank it. Doesn’t matter if that thing is “hate speech”, “porn”, “links to other websites”, “off-topic comments”

candiddevmike 3y ago

Social media became better at curating news than the news sites themselves, IMO, and most folks end up just reading comments or quotes in the comments. There's also too much noise on most media outlets. I think most media outlets should look at LWN as a model for sustainability: niche stories, hyper focused on what their audience is interested in.

willdough 3y ago
What is LWN?
- detaro 3y ago
  https://lwn.net/ https://lwn.net/
incone123 3y ago
How are you defining 'better'?
HPsquared 3y ago
Even when I'm on an actual newspaper's site, I only briefly check the headline and give the article a token perfunctory skim, then spend the bulk of my time reading the comments.
- HDThoreaun 3y ago
  This feels like a gigantic mistake to me. The comments generally have the least facts and most bias. Another link on HN front page right now is about companies being fined by the government for creating millions of fake personas to comment on social media and news site. With the article you at lest know the author is real.
karaterobot 3y ago
This, is such a succinct summary of what is wrong with the news that I am upvoting it even if you didn't mean it that way. To be clear: the curation social media does is perverse, because it bubbles the worst, most salacious and panicked stories to the top. Reading comments and quotes without having the context of the article itself is a great way to wind up angry and misinformed. If you're a news outlet, designing your news coverage to support this is unethical, and results in a cultural death spiral. Hyper-focusing on what your audience is interested in is good business, but bad journalism, and freedom of the press is enshrined in law so they can inform us rather than just give us the content we crave.

sclarisse 3y ago

What do you mean no one talks about it? The media itself (and occasionally even the United States government) were taking about it a lot as they lamented the rise of Fake News and the election of Donald Trump. They asked for it, and suggested if they didn’t get it there might be heavy handed regulation. Facebook gave it to them. A sample. "What Facebook Did to American Democracy" — The Atlantic https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/10/what-facebook-did/542502/ https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/10/what-... "Facebook Has Been a Disaster for the World" — The New York Times https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/18/opinion/facebook-democracy.html https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/18/opinion/facebook-democrac... "Mark Zuckerberg Has Set Our Democracy on Fire" — The Nation https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/zuckerberg-facebook-political-advertising/ https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/zuckerberg-facebo... "Can Mark Zuckerberg Fix Facebook Before It Breaks Democracy?" — The New Yorker https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2018/09/17/can-mark-zuckerberg-fix-facebook-before-it-breaks-democracy https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2018/09/17/can-mark-zucke... "Facebook harms children and weakens democracy: ex-employee" — BBC https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-58805965 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-58805965 “Fighting Digital Disinformation” - Warren for Senate https://elizabethwarren.com/plans/fighting-digital-disinformation https://elizabethwarren.com/plans/fighting-digital-disinform...

908B64B197 3y ago
All of these media organizations are in direct competition with Facebook for advertising revenue (and are losing pretty badly). They all have a vested interest in Facebook usage dropping.
- sclarisse 3y ago
  That’s fine there’s more. Were we talking Buzzfeed? “How Facebook Failed To Prevent Stop The Steal” https://www.buzzfeednews.com/amphtml/craigsilverman/facebook-failed-stop-the-steal-insurrection https://www.buzzfeednews.com/amphtml/craigsilverman/facebook... “I have blood on my hands” https://www.buzzfeednews.com/amphtml/craigsilverman/facebook-ignore-political-manipulation-whistleblower-memo https://www.buzzfeednews.com/amphtml/craigsilverman/facebook...