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What advice is meme worthy? Can you be more specific? You are just saying it's not good, that you would not advise to follow him, etc... > The proliferation o

What advice is meme worthy? Can you be more specific? You are just saying it's not good, that you would not advise to follow him, etc... > The proliferation of his perspective has, quite literally, been a pain in my ass daily trying to re-teach misguided fundamentals Again can you give an example? I feel like he gives sound advice, but I just recently discovered him.

belmont_sup 3y ago
For those that are using open source js software to build web applications and are able to pick apart and understand what each tool does, his choice of tools are actually tried and true. Even a C# developer building with aspnet has to reach out to many of these tools: grafana, some hosting service, some log/error monitoring tool. But at the same time, I think a lot of comments here are pointing at the glaring reminder of how obscenely complex development for the web can be in the JS ecosystem (for new or non-js devs). Why point new engs to remix, prisma, mailgun, insert 3rd party tool when it’s so much better to give them the Ruby on Rails approach? Aspnet, Ruby on Rails, and similar frameworks in all languages including JS frameworks incorporate nearly all the tools mentioned but without requiring someone to wire it up themselves (or to understand the wiring).
- ponyous 3y ago
  > But at the same time, I think a lot of comments here are pointing at the glaring reminder of how obscenely complex development for the web can be in the JS ecosystem Absolutely agree, this has nothing to do with Kent. > but without requiring someone to wire it up themselves That's the whole point of the stack - that you don't need to wire all of that tech yourself.
lucasyvas 3y ago
For one, Remix, actually. If you're "just trying to ship", the recommendation should probably be Rails, Django, or Next.js at this point. Flavour of the month technology is cool, but it's not mature enough to put in the "just ship it category." His preferences are always bleeding edge, hip things. And that's not the kind of stuff you build on when you want to buck up and ship an idea. It might be good stuff, but using what you know and what is stable is the only choice when you're trying to get things done. SQLite, yes. LiteFS on fly.io? Why? Just run bloody SQLite on a server and get it over with. He historically caters to a beginner crowd, but totally skips fundamentals - then we all get know-it-alls that we have to bring back down to reality. It's not so much the technology he likes, but the way he pitches it is extremely problematic. He pitches niche, complicated stuff and tries to pass it off as basics. No thank you.
- andrewsjustin 3y ago
  Tired of people calling Remix "flavor of the week". It's been acquired by Shopify, is actively being iterated on and is by no means another JS flavor of the week. I think it's proven itself in that sense so far. Having worked for several years at a startup on rails, I can really confidently say the DX experience with Remix is no match.. I don't understand people in this thread complaining about niche complicated stuff when at the end of the day.. it's all just javascript, there's no magic.. The amount of abstractions, opinions, and siloed "you kinda just have to know that's the way it works" sort of knowledge that come with working with Rails is far beyond that of working with Remix. Would be curious to know how much time folks here have actually spent building with Remix. It's just good, give it a try. Personally, I've learned a lot from Kent. I think his content is mostly quite good, I also don't find him to be someone who's sole mission is to make money and sell his product like a lot of folks in this thread have claimed. He gives a lot, for free, and contributes a lot.
  - 0xblinq 3y ago
    Exactly what one of the creators/marketers of remix would say, with a just crated account. Remix might be good if you want to use React, but it's ages away from what the Rails or Laravel ecosystem will provide you. Things such as official (or de facto) solutions for ORM, validation, sending (or receiving!) emails, authentication, writing custom utility commands, translations, i18n, background jobs, queues, admin dashboards, etc have a clear and either an official or de fact solution. That makes part of the "development experience" because developer experience is not just saving a script and seeing it refreshing in the browser. There's a lot more to it, like not having to reinvent the wheel at each step or tying together 10k third party libraries. Remix, Next.js, blitz, whatever... those are all great solutions if all you have to build is a landing page with a form, or if you already have a proper backend in place, or if you have a team of several dozens/hundreds engineers and a ton of money to reinvent the wheel. For solo or small teams or constrained budgets, nothing beats Rails or Laravel. There's a reason many of those frameworks wanna be called "Rails for JavaScript"... because none of them are anything close on their own name. Closest one is Adonis, and it's still a thousand miles behind regarding features, community, third party packages, being future proof and being battle proven.

belmont_sup 3y ago

For those that are using open source js software to build web applications and are able to pick apart and understand what each tool does, his choice of tools are actually tried and true. Even a C# developer building with aspnet has to reach out to many of these tools: grafana, some hosting service, some log/error monitoring tool. But at the same time, I think a lot of comments here are pointing at the glaring reminder of how obscenely complex development for the web can be in the JS ecosystem (for new or non-js devs). Why point new engs to remix, prisma, mailgun, insert 3rd party tool when it’s so much better to give them the Ruby on Rails approach? Aspnet, Ruby on Rails, and similar frameworks in all languages including JS frameworks incorporate nearly all the tools mentioned but without requiring someone to wire it up themselves (or to understand the wiring).

ponyous 3y ago
> But at the same time, I think a lot of comments here are pointing at the glaring reminder of how obscenely complex development for the web can be in the JS ecosystem Absolutely agree, this has nothing to do with Kent. > but without requiring someone to wire it up themselves That's the whole point of the stack - that you don't need to wire all of that tech yourself.

lucasyvas 3y ago

For one, Remix, actually. If you're "just trying to ship", the recommendation should probably be Rails, Django, or Next.js at this point. Flavour of the month technology is cool, but it's not mature enough to put in the "just ship it category." His preferences are always bleeding edge, hip things. And that's not the kind of stuff you build on when you want to buck up and ship an idea. It might be good stuff, but using what you know and what is stable is the only choice when you're trying to get things done. SQLite, yes. LiteFS on fly.io? Why? Just run bloody SQLite on a server and get it over with. He historically caters to a beginner crowd, but totally skips fundamentals - then we all get know-it-alls that we have to bring back down to reality. It's not so much the technology he likes, but the way he pitches it is extremely problematic. He pitches niche, complicated stuff and tries to pass it off as basics. No thank you.

andrewsjustin 3y ago
Tired of people calling Remix "flavor of the week". It's been acquired by Shopify, is actively being iterated on and is by no means another JS flavor of the week. I think it's proven itself in that sense so far. Having worked for several years at a startup on rails, I can really confidently say the DX experience with Remix is no match.. I don't understand people in this thread complaining about niche complicated stuff when at the end of the day.. it's all just javascript, there's no magic.. The amount of abstractions, opinions, and siloed "you kinda just have to know that's the way it works" sort of knowledge that come with working with Rails is far beyond that of working with Remix. Would be curious to know how much time folks here have actually spent building with Remix. It's just good, give it a try. Personally, I've learned a lot from Kent. I think his content is mostly quite good, I also don't find him to be someone who's sole mission is to make money and sell his product like a lot of folks in this thread have claimed. He gives a lot, for free, and contributes a lot.
- 0xblinq 3y ago
  Exactly what one of the creators/marketers of remix would say, with a just crated account. Remix might be good if you want to use React, but it's ages away from what the Rails or Laravel ecosystem will provide you. Things such as official (or de facto) solutions for ORM, validation, sending (or receiving!) emails, authentication, writing custom utility commands, translations, i18n, background jobs, queues, admin dashboards, etc have a clear and either an official or de fact solution. That makes part of the "development experience" because developer experience is not just saving a script and seeing it refreshing in the browser. There's a lot more to it, like not having to reinvent the wheel at each step or tying together 10k third party libraries. Remix, Next.js, blitz, whatever... those are all great solutions if all you have to build is a landing page with a form, or if you already have a proper backend in place, or if you have a team of several dozens/hundreds engineers and a ton of money to reinvent the wheel. For solo or small teams or constrained budgets, nothing beats Rails or Laravel. There's a reason many of those frameworks wanna be called "Rails for JavaScript"... because none of them are anything close on their own name. Closest one is Adonis, and it's still a thousand miles behind regarding features, community, third party packages, being future proof and being battle proven.