5 ms·

I think the article says: "Some scientists think that sometimes it may be better to tell your immune system to take it slow, such that you have fewer symptoms c

I think the article says: "Some scientists think that sometimes it may be better to tell your immune system to take it slow, such that you have fewer symptoms caused by the immune response". We are already doing this, no? Every time we take medication that lowers our fever during an infection (antipyretic ), we trade a bit of immune response for a much more comfortable illness. The other aspect of this is that carrying more pathogen, for longer, increases the chance that you will infect others.

giantg2 3y ago
"increases the chance that you will infect others." Or that it could do more damage, depending on the type of infection. For example, HPV os though to only lead to cancer for those who have a persistent infection for a few years.
chrisan 3y ago
Ya, you aren't suppose to take an OTC pain reliever around the covid vaccine as it could reduce your immune response
- gautamdivgi 3y ago
  Not sure why you got downvoted. But I believe you’re right. I did read that you should not take the otc pain reliever before the shot but can do so when symptoms develop after the shot.
  - wholinator2 3y ago
    Off topic but I'm curious. I've seen lots of people telling others they've been downvoted. How are you able to tell? Are you using a specific app or just the website, is there a number like reddit or just the slight greying seen in soon to die posts. Just curious since i have no ability to see downvotes
    - throwawayadvsec 3y ago
      comments get progressively more greyed out then hidden when they receive downvotes
    - msrenee 3y ago
      Some apps don't show the greying out.
ryanbrunner 3y ago
Doesn't it also increase the odds that you'll create new variants of the illness? I remember a lot of theorizing that some COVID variants developed in immunocompromised individuals who hosted the virus for months.
echelon 3y ago
Every immune cell recruitment and proliferation event gets you closer to the Hayflick limit. You cause damage to your body through inflammation. You invoke deleterious pathways that normally sit idle. Getting sick primes the immune system for defense, but it is also damaging to healthspan.
- sudosysgen 3y ago
  Don't most immune cells derive from stem cells? Stem cells express telomerase so they aren't really subject to the Hayflick limit.
- nradov 3y ago
  Inflammation isn't necessarily damaging. In some cases it actually accelerates the healing process. The Hayflick limit really isn't relevant here.
scotty79 3y ago
I think the jury is still out whether the fever is beneficial of harmful for the recovery process in most common illnesses. My personal theory is that fever arose as a specific mechanism against specific pathogen that humanity encountered some time in the past. Probably very lethal. The only people who survived were ones that were getting fever when encountering large number of various antigens. That pathogen I think is long gone and most human pathogens are completely not influenced by the fever. But the mechanism largely remained. Or perhaps fever works against bacteria so if you keep yourself isolated when you are having viral disease it's useless, but if you still contact people when virally ill maybe fever protects you from secondary bacterial infection to some degree.
- MrVandemar 3y ago
  Most organisms function within a given temperature range. For example, try dropping the temperature to 0C or raising it to 60C and see how you like it. Fever, I suspect, is the body trying to exceed the operating temperature range of the pathogen to either kill or impede it. I don't know if there has been any research on this that either confirms my genius theory or disproves my rambling uninformed delusion.
  - tharkun__ 3y ago
    Your parent knows that and says as much but says he believes all the pathogens this actually helps against are "long gone". It's the conventional wisdom on fever, not your genius theory or suspicion. The body also does not go into fever mode for every kind of infection so I personally think that it's quite adapted to only "fevering" for the right kinds of pathogens, as in: yes it does still help/do something but there can of course be "imposters" that make you go into fever mode without it helping much. Some people get fever that goes way too high and kills the host if we didn't have Ibuprofen and the like (or herbal remedies to the same effect). If none of those were available, the genes affecting this would naturally die out/become less prevalent. Which is along the lines of the article that "letting diseases run their course" might be beneficial in that sense.
lamontcg 3y ago
> The other aspect of this is that carrying more pathogen, for longer, increases the chance that you will infect others. There's no evidence of this tradeoff.

giantg2 3y ago

"increases the chance that you will infect others." Or that it could do more damage, depending on the type of infection. For example, HPV os though to only lead to cancer for those who have a persistent infection for a few years.

chrisan 3y ago

Ya, you aren't suppose to take an OTC pain reliever around the covid vaccine as it could reduce your immune response

gautamdivgi 3y ago
Not sure why you got downvoted. But I believe you’re right. I did read that you should not take the otc pain reliever before the shot but can do so when symptoms develop after the shot.
- wholinator2 3y ago
  Off topic but I'm curious. I've seen lots of people telling others they've been downvoted. How are you able to tell? Are you using a specific app or just the website, is there a number like reddit or just the slight greying seen in soon to die posts. Just curious since i have no ability to see downvotes
  - throwawayadvsec 3y ago
    comments get progressively more greyed out then hidden when they receive downvotes
  - msrenee 3y ago
    Some apps don't show the greying out.

ryanbrunner 3y ago

Doesn't it also increase the odds that you'll create new variants of the illness? I remember a lot of theorizing that some COVID variants developed in immunocompromised individuals who hosted the virus for months.

echelon 3y ago

Every immune cell recruitment and proliferation event gets you closer to the Hayflick limit. You cause damage to your body through inflammation. You invoke deleterious pathways that normally sit idle. Getting sick primes the immune system for defense, but it is also damaging to healthspan.

sudosysgen 3y ago
Don't most immune cells derive from stem cells? Stem cells express telomerase so they aren't really subject to the Hayflick limit.
nradov 3y ago
Inflammation isn't necessarily damaging. In some cases it actually accelerates the healing process. The Hayflick limit really isn't relevant here.

scotty79 3y ago

I think the jury is still out whether the fever is beneficial of harmful for the recovery process in most common illnesses. My personal theory is that fever arose as a specific mechanism against specific pathogen that humanity encountered some time in the past. Probably very lethal. The only people who survived were ones that were getting fever when encountering large number of various antigens. That pathogen I think is long gone and most human pathogens are completely not influenced by the fever. But the mechanism largely remained. Or perhaps fever works against bacteria so if you keep yourself isolated when you are having viral disease it's useless, but if you still contact people when virally ill maybe fever protects you from secondary bacterial infection to some degree.

MrVandemar 3y ago
Most organisms function within a given temperature range. For example, try dropping the temperature to 0C or raising it to 60C and see how you like it. Fever, I suspect, is the body trying to exceed the operating temperature range of the pathogen to either kill or impede it. I don't know if there has been any research on this that either confirms my genius theory or disproves my rambling uninformed delusion.
- tharkun__ 3y ago
  Your parent knows that and says as much but says he believes all the pathogens this actually helps against are "long gone". It's the conventional wisdom on fever, not your genius theory or suspicion. The body also does not go into fever mode for every kind of infection so I personally think that it's quite adapted to only "fevering" for the right kinds of pathogens, as in: yes it does still help/do something but there can of course be "imposters" that make you go into fever mode without it helping much. Some people get fever that goes way too high and kills the host if we didn't have Ibuprofen and the like (or herbal remedies to the same effect). If none of those were available, the genes affecting this would naturally die out/become less prevalent. Which is along the lines of the article that "letting diseases run their course" might be beneficial in that sense.

lamontcg 3y ago

> The other aspect of this is that carrying more pathogen, for longer, increases the chance that you will infect others. There's no evidence of this tradeoff.