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Most discussions about this topic somehow seem to assume that people enjoy returning stuff. They don’t. It’s effort One of the key unresolved problems in fashi
by thesumofall 3y ago
Most discussions about this topic somehow seem to assume that people enjoy returning stuff. They don’t. It’s effort
One of the key unresolved problems in fashion retail remains the crazy, unreliable sizing systems. Just because you are size $X at one brand, doesn’t mean you’re size $X at another. Also, the majority of brands only cater to average body proportions. Slim feet? Tall? Good luck!
- teambob 3y agoMy experience exactly
- pharmakom 3y agoI have noticed more stores giving actual garment measurements on their site (as opposed to a near meaningless size that is several inches off due to vanity sizing!)
- danpalmer 3y agoEven measurements aren’t really an accurate indicator for most garments. The manufacturing tolerances for anything below designed fashion are just too large. When stuff is hand made (by experts, not just for the marketing label of “hand made”) then they tend to be accurate enough, but the stuff most people buy in shops is never going to have a reliable fit unless the whole supply chain is overhauled. And that’s not to mention how for changes as the fabrics age and are washed. That’s a whole extra load of complexity. Edit, to give an illustrative example. When cutting out pieces for a garment, the cutting will typically be done on a band saw (or fabric cutting equivalent). For most garments the fabric will be stacked 10-20 sheets high so that many pieces are cut in one go. A person shoving 20 layers of fabric through a saw in a few seconds is never going to be accurate. Contrast this to a high end garment where it might be 2-5 layers carefully guided through a saw by someone who can take a minute to get it right, that’s just far more likely to hit the targets.
- thesumofall 3y agoThat explains a lot! Always wondered why even when given precise measurements garments would still be way off
- shortcake27 3y agoI don’t know why but this still doesn’t work. Recently I needed to buy some thermals. According to MacPac’s sizing guide, with actual measurements, I’m an XS. When I tried them on in person, I’m a medium. Two sizes off.
- emodendroket 3y agoI mean, that's not helpful if all my other clothes are vanity sized.
- atoav 3y agoI know art students that routinely order stuff, use it for one film/show and return it. Because that's possible.
- Etrnl_President 3y ago[dead]
- shortcake27 3y ago> Just because you are size $X at one brand, doesn’t mean you’re size $X at another In my experience it’s worse than that. Buying from the same brand, sometimes even the same item (or its successor), results in wildy different fitment. I’ve strictly returned to brick and mortar. It’s so much more convenient buying something that fits.
- pcthrowaway 3y agoI've bought the same shirt from the same brand in the same size, only to find it didn't fit well. The difference? The "Made in XXX" country had changed. Agreed, trying to buy clothes online is a nightmare
- optionalsquid 3y agoI just had to return a couple of shoes: I thought I was being smart by ordering the exact same brand, model, and size again, but when they showed up they fit my feet like vises. In the end I also went to a brick and mortar store.
- shortcake27 3y agoThis happened to me with Asics. The Kayano 17 was the best running shoe I’ve ever had, so I replaced them with the Kayano 23. You’d think a newer version of the same shoe would fit the same. Nope. I actually kept them because I’m stubborn, but anything longer than 10k and I get terrible blisters even after putting hundreds of kms on them. I’ve had the same issue with Adidas as well. I just can’t understand why they change the fitment for the next version of the same shoe. Who does that benefit?
- okillbite 3y agoBuy several sizes, return the ones that don't fit. This seems a bit nonsensical to me however I am reliably informed that this is the modern way.
- nikole9696 3y agoI would love to be able to go into a brick and mortar store for my clothes. Unfortunately, most of the brands I buy only carry petite sizes online, or have an extremely limited petite selection which my 90 year old neighbor would love. I'm 5 feet tall. I can't buy a shirt or pants meant for someone who is 5'6". Tailoring doesn't change the proportions of where the neck and sleeve holes are or how the crotch fits; you can't just lop 4 inches off the bottom of something. So, I'm stuck with online shopping and wildly dumb sizing.
- balaji1 3y agoIf there was no free returns, both customers and sellers will ensure better fit before sale occurs.
- thesumofall 3y agoHow would they do this? And what’s the incentive on seller side? By abolishing free returns without a better alternative in place, sellers clearly say that they rather accept lower sales than trying to ensure people receive fitting clothes
- balaji1 3y agoThere was and is a world where “goods once sold, no returns”. Is it predatory on unsuspecting buyers? many times. Is it worse for a slice of the economy? Yes. But free returns is unsustainable. Hence it eats into quality of products sold. Even in the US, there are countless things you cannot return.
- Broken_Hippo 3y agoI disagree. If returns cost them so much they'd do it now. But they don't: It is so much cheaper to produce the garment as it is that it won't change. They already make money from folk buying products and not bothering to return them. No more free returns just means more consumers will be wary of ordering. The better fit stuff won't happen until actual laws are put into place and/or places start punishing manufacturers by refusing to sell their products on their platform, regardless of who is reselling them. I very highly doubt it will affect whether or not returns are free, though.
- nradov 3y agoSeveral start-up companies have attempted to resolve that problem in fashion retail by scanning customers' bodies and building 3D models in order to verify fit. But none of them have really taken off. Besides the technical and manufacturing issues, customers have their own idiosyncratic preferences about how loose or tight they like their clothes for comfort and aesthetics.
- pintxo 3y agoGiven the other comments about the inherent size variability in creating the actual clothing, no wonder anyone trying to measure the customer but not the cloths is riding a dead horse.
- cik 3y agoActually this is resolved entirely, just outside North America. It's incredibly frustrating when North American companies decide thingsike a 34" waist is 36" in one brand and 34" in another - don't get me started about inconsistencies within the brand itself - which is how I used to solve this. Just buy European sized things. Sizes are sizes They're clear. They're clear to the point of your having a ability to measure yourself and always get what you're trying to get. Heck, many of these sites just publish a complete sizing guide, so that you can measure yourself. My introduction to this, having moved from north America, has been eye opening. The standardization has eliminated any chance I ever try a North American made item now.
- usrbinbash 3y agoWhile that is true, many companies over here sell american made brands clothes and those are still, for some unfathomable reason, using the original measurements, starting with waist sizes in inches, which in my personal experience can mean anything from: "Fits as intended" to "Could be used as cover for a Jet Engine".
- Broken_Hippo 3y agoThis doesn't help. I live in northern Europe. I usually buy pants in the store so that I can try them on. I have to try on every single pair, even if they are the same size, style, color, and are sitting on top of each other on a table. The sizes within the same garment aren't consistent, let alone the sizing in different stores. Not to mention that some places only put the European sizes on sites for the European market after using a conversion from whatever sizing system they happen to use. You generally aren't getting a different manufacturer by avoiding a "north american made" item.
- alpaca128 3y ago> Actually this is resolved entirely, just outside North America. I'm European and I have no idea what you're talking about. This simply isn't true, and cannot be true even in theory because our bodies are three-dimensional and clothing sizes are usually single numbers/letters. A single size number will always be insufficient - 95% of jeans that fit my waist are too short and there's no way to know other than trying them. Same with shirts. I can try two shoes in the same size from the same brand and only one fits because the other one was designed for stick figure feet. One of my shoes is size 43, another is size 45 and they're literally the same size. People like making fun of imperial units but what actually deserves all this ridicule and more is the nonsensical chaos that is clothing sizes, numbers that the manufacturers seem to get via dice rolls.
- conductr 3y agoIt’s not that I enjoy returning clothes. It’s that it’s more enjoyable than doing the brick and mortar retail fitting room thing. At multiple stores the logistical burden is too heavy. Retail: I like this shirt on rack, try on two sizes, wait one size I need is sold out. End up settling for another item that I like and has my size in store. Might be third or forth option. I might just say forget it and leave empty handed. Online: I kind of like this shirt, I buy 2 sizes I think might work, try them on when they arrive in my house on my time, if I actually like the fabric/look in person and I’ve identified the size works, I keep one of them and return the other. If I ended up disliking the fabric or something entirely that I couldn’t tell from product pictures I return both. That said, the logistical issues of browsing/shopping online are significant too. I tend to be somewhat brand/store loyal so that’s how I deal with it.