4 ms·

It's kind of funny to see these announcements when their stock price is at a near all-time high.

zht 3y ago
need the extra cash to for dividends/buybacks to push it to ATH
strangattractor 3y ago
So the people that gain the most income from stock decide to limit the income of those who don't. So their salaries effectively increase.
- heywhatupboys 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - refulgentis 3y ago
    anti capitalist? hardly
  - norir 3y ago
    What is with this blatant pro capitalist bulls... almost everywhere for the last two centuries
    - heywhatupboys 3y ago
      because capitalism works. Any other system, not including its moral lacks, has failed and lead to corruption and poverty. Capitalism has carried more people out of poverty in the past 30 years than any other form of progress. With it freedom has been brought
  - strangattractor 3y ago
    First time I have ever been called "anti capitalist" and I've been called many things:} Believe it or not there are employees of M$ that do not receive stock as compensation. Those of us (I include myself) that do live in the capitalist/libertarian bubble and get such things tend to forget that. These non-shareholders are also the ones most impacted by inflation and tend to work hourly. I was not trying to imply there is some grand conspiracy. I was however trying to point out how the incentives of large companies are structured and are often skewed. God forbid any of those non-shareholders try to form a union. Maybe it would be good if more people in the bubble walked a mile in some one else's shoes.
  - AtlasBarfed 3y ago
    Oh boy, the ownership society from Bush Jr. I own 100 stock and are paid 150,000 - coder I own 1,000,000 stock and are paid 1$ and 150,000 stock - CEO - CEO: "I am freezing wages" - Stock goes up 10% Year to Year (say 100->110$) - inflation was 10% coder: salary is effectively 135k, ($15k loss), stock went up 1k CEO: salary is down to 90 cents (10 cent loss), stock went up $10,000,000) HN commenter who apparently things they are some great economist but quite obviously can't do basic math: "But everyone gets to own stock!!!" So to the meat, does the employee have the option to be 100% compensated in stock? NO. The CEO is effectively compensated that way, and LOVES IT because the effective tax rate on long term capital gains is 15%. You know, I would have LOVED to have been compensated in 50% stock or some equivalent with stock options (backdate me pleeeze like the CEO of UHG got to!) So maybe I'd take your dumb comment at face value if everyone got to participate in the great executive tax fraud, but... we don't.
    - heywhatupboys 3y ago
      the employee could just buy stock for his/her wage
BulgarianIdiot 3y ago
What's funny about it. Employees also get stock options.
- mikestew 3y ago
  Stock grants, not options. Pedantry aside, those grants are being cut, too.
  - pb7 3y ago
    It’s actually not that pedantic, it’s like calling JavaScript “Java”. For stock options to be profitable the stock has go up. Stock grants are simply cash in a currency that may be more or less valuable than originally granted.
    - BulgarianIdiot 3y ago
      Employees get both options and grants, depending on their position and so on. And stock does go up. It's Microsoft. Otherwise you can... just not use the option. The purpose is to encourage employees to help the company and raise the stock. In theory at least.
      - pb7 3y ago
        Thanks for explaining it but I know how it works better than most here, hence the comment. If you get $100K in stock options at a certain price and the price doubles, you make $100K. If it stays the same, you make nothing. If you leave, you have a certain period of time to exercise or you lose your options. If you get $100K in stock and the prices doubles you make $200K. If it stays the same, you make $100K. If you leave the day it vests, you keep it. They’re not at all similar except in the fact that they’re securities. Using them interchangeably is a great sign to ignore any financial commentary from that person. I’m only here because I see this mistake in every single thread that has anything to do with compensation. Engineers need to get financial education.
        3y ago
WalterBright 3y ago
It's still 10% below its all time high. 20% if you factor in inflation.
- bagacrap 3y ago
  As a percentage of the SP500, it's never been higher. This is important because (a) economic performance is relative (b) the most likely thing (or at least the most advisable thing) for anyone who receives MSFT RSUs is to immediately sell them and use the proceeds to buy more diversified investments.
  - WalterBright 3y ago
    The reason people became rich off of MSFT is because they didn't diversify by selling their winner.
    - Tommstein 3y ago
      It can only go up forever!

zht 3y ago

need the extra cash to for dividends/buybacks to push it to ATH

So the people that gain the most income from stock decide to limit the income of those who don't. So their salaries effectively increase.

heywhatupboys 3y ago
[flagged]
- refulgentis 3y ago
  anti capitalist? hardly
- norir 3y ago
  What is with this blatant pro capitalist bulls... almost everywhere for the last two centuries
  - heywhatupboys 3y ago
    because capitalism works. Any other system, not including its moral lacks, has failed and lead to corruption and poverty. Capitalism has carried more people out of poverty in the past 30 years than any other form of progress. With it freedom has been brought
- strangattractor 3y ago
  First time I have ever been called "anti capitalist" and I've been called many things:} Believe it or not there are employees of M$ that do not receive stock as compensation. Those of us (I include myself) that do live in the capitalist/libertarian bubble and get such things tend to forget that. These non-shareholders are also the ones most impacted by inflation and tend to work hourly. I was not trying to imply there is some grand conspiracy. I was however trying to point out how the incentives of large companies are structured and are often skewed. God forbid any of those non-shareholders try to form a union. Maybe it would be good if more people in the bubble walked a mile in some one else's shoes.
- AtlasBarfed 3y ago
  Oh boy, the ownership society from Bush Jr. I own 100 stock and are paid 150,000 - coder I own 1,000,000 stock and are paid 1$ and 150,000 stock - CEO - CEO: "I am freezing wages" - Stock goes up 10% Year to Year (say 100->110$) - inflation was 10% coder: salary is effectively 135k, ($15k loss), stock went up 1k CEO: salary is down to 90 cents (10 cent loss), stock went up $10,000,000) HN commenter who apparently things they are some great economist but quite obviously can't do basic math: "But everyone gets to own stock!!!" So to the meat, does the employee have the option to be 100% compensated in stock? NO. The CEO is effectively compensated that way, and LOVES IT because the effective tax rate on long term capital gains is 15%. You know, I would have LOVED to have been compensated in 50% stock or some equivalent with stock options (backdate me pleeeze like the CEO of UHG got to!) So maybe I'd take your dumb comment at face value if everyone got to participate in the great executive tax fraud, but... we don't.
  - heywhatupboys 3y ago
    the employee could just buy stock for his/her wage

BulgarianIdiot 3y ago

What's funny about it. Employees also get stock options.

mikestew 3y ago
Stock grants, not options. Pedantry aside, those grants are being cut, too.
- pb7 3y ago
  It’s actually not that pedantic, it’s like calling JavaScript “Java”. For stock options to be profitable the stock has go up. Stock grants are simply cash in a currency that may be more or less valuable than originally granted.
  - BulgarianIdiot 3y ago
    Employees get both options and grants, depending on their position and so on. And stock does go up. It's Microsoft. Otherwise you can... just not use the option. The purpose is to encourage employees to help the company and raise the stock. In theory at least.
    - pb7 3y ago
      Thanks for explaining it but I know how it works better than most here, hence the comment. If you get $100K in stock options at a certain price and the price doubles, you make $100K. If it stays the same, you make nothing. If you leave, you have a certain period of time to exercise or you lose your options. If you get $100K in stock and the prices doubles you make $200K. If it stays the same, you make $100K. If you leave the day it vests, you keep it. They’re not at all similar except in the fact that they’re securities. Using them interchangeably is a great sign to ignore any financial commentary from that person. I’m only here because I see this mistake in every single thread that has anything to do with compensation. Engineers need to get financial education.
      - 3y ago

WalterBright 3y ago

It's still 10% below its all time high. 20% if you factor in inflation.

bagacrap 3y ago
As a percentage of the SP500, it's never been higher. This is important because (a) economic performance is relative (b) the most likely thing (or at least the most advisable thing) for anyone who receives MSFT RSUs is to immediately sell them and use the proceeds to buy more diversified investments.
- WalterBright 3y ago
  The reason people became rich off of MSFT is because they didn't diversify by selling their winner.
  - Tommstein 3y ago
    It can only go up forever!