5 ms·

Most health insurance doesn't cover weight loss treatment without a condition like T2D, heart issues, etc. If you're fat enough that it's damaging your health y

Most health insurance doesn't cover weight loss treatment without a condition like T2D, heart issues, etc. If you're fat enough that it's damaging your health you're extremely unlikely to be able to lose it without significant support through medicine, nutritionists, etc.

johngladtj 3y ago
Losing weight doesn't cost money.
- EatingWithForks 3y ago
  If you're that fat you're statistically unlikely to lose weight without medical intervention of some sort, even something as basic as talking to a fucking nutritionist about portion sizes.
  - Gordonjcp 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - EatingWithForks 3y ago
      Statistically, if a person is so obese for so long they get T2D, they are not going to go into remission just from googling weight loss or following whatever they find on the internet (doubly so if they fall into some crank Liver King style nonsense). That's just the facts. It's been studied over and over again for many years at this point.
    - tstrimple 3y ago
      I honestly don't understand responses like this. We're presented with systemic issues, and your "solution" is just "personal responsibility"? Something which has demonstrably failed and lead us to the situation we're in today? Do you often think that doing more of the same thing will lead to different results? Since we're in a technology forum. Let's say you're a product owner and your app is suffering from severe performance issues. Would a "solution" of telling the developers of the app "just write code more efficiently! Use Google if you have to!" be acceptable to you? Do you think it would produce the results you want?
      - rixthefox 3y ago
        I think a better analogy to use would be a very slow loading app. Say your app takes 5 minutes to load the first page and 1 minute to switch between pages after that. Instead of blaming the developers, blame the users for expecting too much of the app. Personal responsibility and all that. It's the users fault they are using the app during peak times. If they really needed access to X part of the app they should have done it before it got busy.
        tstrimple 3y ago
        I used the app dev side because I think it's more illustrative. There are various teams with various competing priorities who have collectively developed a product which is horribly slow. No individual developer is at fault. Some are efficient with their code, and some are less so. But there is no architecture team or mature SDLC to handle cross cutting concerns or a foundational platform for everyone to build from. Everyone is free to do their own thing and write code the way they want use whatever standards they can find on Google. In that world, just telling the devs to write more efficient code is insufficient to correct the course. The systemic problems that have developed require systemic solutions. A blanket "just do better" has never been useful to anyone.
      - Gordonjcp 3y ago
        [flagged]
        tstrimple 3y ago
        And your "solution" is completely meaningless because it's been proven to not work across societies. It's like saying the solution to world hunger is easy. Everyone should just feed themselves! Want world peace? Everyone should just be more peaceful! It's completely useless rhetoric with absolutely no value in the conversation. Are you actually incapable of looking at these things as systems with a large number of variables and broad societal impact?
        Gordonjcp 3y ago
    - George83728 3y ago
      They use the internet and find people who tell them that it's not their fault. It's the fault of vegetables for being so expensive, even though vegetables are cheaper than junkfood. It's the fault of food deserts, even though they live in walking/driving range of half a dozen full-sized super markets. It's the fault of their genes, even all 8 of their great grandparents were fit. It's anybody/anything's fault, except their own. And so they stay fat, and join the ranks of those who perpetuate these fat-excusing myths (on full display throughout this discussion section.)
  - yibg 3y ago
    I sympathize with how hard it is to lose weight, but at some point personal responsibility kicks in right?
    - EatingWithForks 3y ago
      When you're that obese you're well beyond personal responsibility. Personal responsibility is enjoying a big thanksgiving dinner and then eating light for the next week or so, or eating some salads for a bit to have a hot girl summer. Obesity is increasingly looking more like a hormone disorder (the latest "miracle" weight loss drugs are all hormone-regulating) or an eating disorder of some sort and should be addressed as such.
    - nradov 3y ago
      Personal responsibility is great, but we're all paying for patients with type-2 diabetes (and other lifestyle related chronic conditions). We pay in terms of higher taxes for Medicare/Medicaid, higher premiums for private commercial insurance, and higher charges from providers trying to cover losses from indigent patients who default on medical debt. People are unlikely to suddenly become more responsible so what is your solution?
    - antifa 3y ago
      The optimal amount of helping hands and second chances are greater than zero.
- anonymouskimmer 3y ago
  No, it just requires constantly feeling hunger pains. Along with bouts of lightheadedness, distraction, and things of that nature. There are a variety of reasons people get fat, and a variety of reasons people stay fat. Treating the specific reasons for the specific people is a lot safer, and easier, than just having people eat less. For me, I'm a stress eater. I need more money, and better credentials, and then I can get career tracked in a way that will reduce my stress enough to eat better. Exercise does help, and I should be doing more. I exercise best (most consistently) with machines, but don't have the cash flow for a gym membership anymore. I also exercised great with rollerblading, but the serious accidents I had doing that make it a bad idea without an indoor rink, and the nearest indoor rink is both expensive and a ways away. I have to drive to work, so I try parking about a 10 minute walk away and walking uphill. It's something, at least.
  - George83728 3y ago
    > No, it just requires constantly feeling hunger pains. No it doesn't, just eat more filling foods with lots of fiber. Veggies are cheaper than dirt, far cheaper than junk food, and far more sating. Junk food is engineered to leave you feeling hungry, to encourage you to buy more. Stop buying junk food completely; no more chips, colas or frozen pizzas. Buy vegetables, particularly the leafy ones, and eat as much as it takes to make yourself feel full. You'll lose weight and save money at the same time.
    - anonymouskimmer 3y ago
      I eat "double fiber" bread and take 4 tablespoons of whole psyllium husk per day. The chips are a good idea, but my diet is already so limited to PB&J, hummus and cheese and mixed green sandwiches, and the occasional whole grain rotini + prego chunky garden (and mixed greens), oatmeal, apples, frozen blueberries, bananas, and the occasional frozen quinoa dish that chips and occasional ice cream or Italian ice are a nice change of pace. I haven't had a soda or the like since, I think pre-COVID. I just eat too much, and don't exercise enough. I could probably use more water, too, but I don't like using the restroom at work. I do find that when I'm working I can often not eat without feeling and hunger pains, but I usually make up for that by eating a lot at night when I get home.
- lghh 3y ago
  At a minimum, it costs time. Many people don't have time. The less money you're able to spend on it, the more time it will probably cost you.
- simonw 3y ago
  > Losing weight doesn't cost money. I'm pretty sure it does. Unhealthy food is a lot cheaper.
  - hello_computer 3y ago
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angus_Barbieri%27s_fast https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angus_Barbieri%27s_fast https://archive.org/details/fastingcure00sincgoog/page/n9/mode/2up https://archive.org/details/fastingcure00sincgoog/page/n9/mo...
- throw0101b 3y ago
  > Losing weight doesn't cost money. It can if you live in a food desert: > USDA’s Economic Research Service previously identified more than 6,500 food desert tracts in the United States based on 2000 Census and 2006 data on locations of supermar- kets, supercenters, and large grocery stores. In this report, we examine the socioeconomic and demographic characteristics of these tracts to see how they differ from other census tracts and the extent to which these differences influence food desert status. Relative to all other census tracts, food desert tracts tend to have smaller populations, higher rates of abandoned or vacant homes, and residents who have lower levels of education, lower incomes, and higher unemployment. Census tracts with higher poverty rates are more likely to be food deserts than otherwise similar low-income census tracts in rural and in very dense (highly populated) urban areas. For less dense urban areas, census tracts with higher concentrations of minority populations are more likely to be food deserts, while tracts with substantial decreases in minority populations between 1990 and 2000 were less likely to be identified as food deserts in 2000. * PDF: https://www.ers.usda.gov/webdocs/publications/45014/30940_err140.pdf https://www.ers.usda.gov/webdocs/publications/45014/30940_er... * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_desert https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_desert
- nebula8804 3y ago
  But it requires massive willpower to overcome those first few days of cravings, pain and mental anguish and then extended willpower to keep it going for at least 30 days so you can build some tolerance to the new reality of clean eating and exercise...and then even more willpower after losing all the weight not to fall back into a bad habit and refill all those dormant empty fat cells that your body does not destroy for at least 7 years. Combine that with the fact that a lot of people are living paycheck to paycheck/working multiple jobs to survive and may not have access to clean nutritious foods without extended effort and you see how we ended up in this situation.

johngladtj 3y ago

Losing weight doesn't cost money.

EatingWithForks 3y ago
If you're that fat you're statistically unlikely to lose weight without medical intervention of some sort, even something as basic as talking to a fucking nutritionist about portion sizes.
- Gordonjcp 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - EatingWithForks 3y ago
    Statistically, if a person is so obese for so long they get T2D, they are not going to go into remission just from googling weight loss or following whatever they find on the internet (doubly so if they fall into some crank Liver King style nonsense). That's just the facts. It's been studied over and over again for many years at this point.
  - tstrimple 3y ago
    I honestly don't understand responses like this. We're presented with systemic issues, and your "solution" is just "personal responsibility"? Something which has demonstrably failed and lead us to the situation we're in today? Do you often think that doing more of the same thing will lead to different results? Since we're in a technology forum. Let's say you're a product owner and your app is suffering from severe performance issues. Would a "solution" of telling the developers of the app "just write code more efficiently! Use Google if you have to!" be acceptable to you? Do you think it would produce the results you want?
    - rixthefox 3y ago
      I think a better analogy to use would be a very slow loading app. Say your app takes 5 minutes to load the first page and 1 minute to switch between pages after that. Instead of blaming the developers, blame the users for expecting too much of the app. Personal responsibility and all that. It's the users fault they are using the app during peak times. If they really needed access to X part of the app they should have done it before it got busy.
      - tstrimple 3y ago
        I used the app dev side because I think it's more illustrative. There are various teams with various competing priorities who have collectively developed a product which is horribly slow. No individual developer is at fault. Some are efficient with their code, and some are less so. But there is no architecture team or mature SDLC to handle cross cutting concerns or a foundational platform for everyone to build from. Everyone is free to do their own thing and write code the way they want use whatever standards they can find on Google. In that world, just telling the devs to write more efficient code is insufficient to correct the course. The systemic problems that have developed require systemic solutions. A blanket "just do better" has never been useful to anyone.
    - Gordonjcp 3y ago
      [flagged]
      - tstrimple 3y ago
        And your "solution" is completely meaningless because it's been proven to not work across societies. It's like saying the solution to world hunger is easy. Everyone should just feed themselves! Want world peace? Everyone should just be more peaceful! It's completely useless rhetoric with absolutely no value in the conversation. Are you actually incapable of looking at these things as systems with a large number of variables and broad societal impact?
        Gordonjcp 3y ago
  - George83728 3y ago
    They use the internet and find people who tell them that it's not their fault. It's the fault of vegetables for being so expensive, even though vegetables are cheaper than junkfood. It's the fault of food deserts, even though they live in walking/driving range of half a dozen full-sized super markets. It's the fault of their genes, even all 8 of their great grandparents were fit. It's anybody/anything's fault, except their own. And so they stay fat, and join the ranks of those who perpetuate these fat-excusing myths (on full display throughout this discussion section.)
- yibg 3y ago
  I sympathize with how hard it is to lose weight, but at some point personal responsibility kicks in right?
  - EatingWithForks 3y ago
    When you're that obese you're well beyond personal responsibility. Personal responsibility is enjoying a big thanksgiving dinner and then eating light for the next week or so, or eating some salads for a bit to have a hot girl summer. Obesity is increasingly looking more like a hormone disorder (the latest "miracle" weight loss drugs are all hormone-regulating) or an eating disorder of some sort and should be addressed as such.
  - nradov 3y ago
    Personal responsibility is great, but we're all paying for patients with type-2 diabetes (and other lifestyle related chronic conditions). We pay in terms of higher taxes for Medicare/Medicaid, higher premiums for private commercial insurance, and higher charges from providers trying to cover losses from indigent patients who default on medical debt. People are unlikely to suddenly become more responsible so what is your solution?
  - antifa 3y ago
    The optimal amount of helping hands and second chances are greater than zero.
anonymouskimmer 3y ago
No, it just requires constantly feeling hunger pains. Along with bouts of lightheadedness, distraction, and things of that nature. There are a variety of reasons people get fat, and a variety of reasons people stay fat. Treating the specific reasons for the specific people is a lot safer, and easier, than just having people eat less. For me, I'm a stress eater. I need more money, and better credentials, and then I can get career tracked in a way that will reduce my stress enough to eat better. Exercise does help, and I should be doing more. I exercise best (most consistently) with machines, but don't have the cash flow for a gym membership anymore. I also exercised great with rollerblading, but the serious accidents I had doing that make it a bad idea without an indoor rink, and the nearest indoor rink is both expensive and a ways away. I have to drive to work, so I try parking about a 10 minute walk away and walking uphill. It's something, at least.
- George83728 3y ago
  > No, it just requires constantly feeling hunger pains. No it doesn't, just eat more filling foods with lots of fiber. Veggies are cheaper than dirt, far cheaper than junk food, and far more sating. Junk food is engineered to leave you feeling hungry, to encourage you to buy more. Stop buying junk food completely; no more chips, colas or frozen pizzas. Buy vegetables, particularly the leafy ones, and eat as much as it takes to make yourself feel full. You'll lose weight and save money at the same time.
  - anonymouskimmer 3y ago
    I eat "double fiber" bread and take 4 tablespoons of whole psyllium husk per day. The chips are a good idea, but my diet is already so limited to PB&J, hummus and cheese and mixed green sandwiches, and the occasional whole grain rotini + prego chunky garden (and mixed greens), oatmeal, apples, frozen blueberries, bananas, and the occasional frozen quinoa dish that chips and occasional ice cream or Italian ice are a nice change of pace. I haven't had a soda or the like since, I think pre-COVID. I just eat too much, and don't exercise enough. I could probably use more water, too, but I don't like using the restroom at work. I do find that when I'm working I can often not eat without feeling and hunger pains, but I usually make up for that by eating a lot at night when I get home.
lghh 3y ago
At a minimum, it costs time. Many people don't have time. The less money you're able to spend on it, the more time it will probably cost you.
simonw 3y ago
> Losing weight doesn't cost money. I'm pretty sure it does. Unhealthy food is a lot cheaper.
- hello_computer 3y ago
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angus_Barbieri%27s_fast https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angus_Barbieri%27s_fast https://archive.org/details/fastingcure00sincgoog/page/n9/mode/2up https://archive.org/details/fastingcure00sincgoog/page/n9/mo...
throw0101b 3y ago
> Losing weight doesn't cost money. It can if you live in a food desert: > USDA’s Economic Research Service previously identified more than 6,500 food desert tracts in the United States based on 2000 Census and 2006 data on locations of supermar- kets, supercenters, and large grocery stores. In this report, we examine the socioeconomic and demographic characteristics of these tracts to see how they differ from other census tracts and the extent to which these differences influence food desert status. Relative to all other census tracts, food desert tracts tend to have smaller populations, higher rates of abandoned or vacant homes, and residents who have lower levels of education, lower incomes, and higher unemployment. Census tracts with higher poverty rates are more likely to be food deserts than otherwise similar low-income census tracts in rural and in very dense (highly populated) urban areas. For less dense urban areas, census tracts with higher concentrations of minority populations are more likely to be food deserts, while tracts with substantial decreases in minority populations between 1990 and 2000 were less likely to be identified as food deserts in 2000. * PDF: https://www.ers.usda.gov/webdocs/publications/45014/30940_err140.pdf https://www.ers.usda.gov/webdocs/publications/45014/30940_er... * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_desert https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_desert
nebula8804 3y ago
But it requires massive willpower to overcome those first few days of cravings, pain and mental anguish and then extended willpower to keep it going for at least 30 days so you can build some tolerance to the new reality of clean eating and exercise...and then even more willpower after losing all the weight not to fall back into a bad habit and refill all those dormant empty fat cells that your body does not destroy for at least 7 years. Combine that with the fact that a lot of people are living paycheck to paycheck/working multiple jobs to survive and may not have access to clean nutritious foods without extended effort and you see how we ended up in this situation.