5 ms·

The lightning cable has whatever you want on the other end. The only thing needed is a cable. I only want 1 port on my phone. I don't really care what that port

The lightning cable has whatever you want on the other end. The only thing needed is a cable. I only want 1 port on my phone. I don't really care what that port is. I'm very uncomfortable with government mandated ports.

tankenmate 4y ago
Using the lightning cable has more onerous standardisation and compliance requirements (not all of which are purely technical requirements) than USB. This is one of the reasons that there is less availability of lightning port accessories.
- detourdog 4y ago
  Please elaborate. Whatever onerous issues I have with a lightening port pale in comparison to the usability of any USB port of comparable size. I understand standards and think many are great.
  - tankenmate 4y ago
    It's called the "Made for iPhone" program; if your device doesn't comply and you don't pay Apple then your lightning port cable / device is limited in the power it can draw / supply (1A @ 5v I think), and data speeds (480Mbps from memory). It has a yearly fee as well as a per connector fee (so pass through cables attract double that cost); it used to be USD4 per connector but that was nearly 10 year ago so it's probably higher these days.
    - detourdog 4y ago
      I don't have a problem with vendors doing this. I prefer standards but since one side of the cable is a standard I think it is fine. Implementing ports cost money . Developing for Apple customers costs money. One can choose their market based on costs. I understand the lightening standard show it's age and is in need of an upgrade. Why the EU is involved in the decision making process is lost to me.
      - tankenmate 4y ago
        The EU's stance is primarily about e-waste, and secondarily about lower costs through competition. Having one standard does a good job of achieving both; lower costs through economies of scale, and less waste because when you get a new phone you don't need to replace all your accessories. It's not perfect but it is better than the alternatives. Having one gate keeper (for example "Made for iPhone" USDx per device / cable) profiting off this isn't good and isn't conscionable from a public policy perspective; it would amount to a private benefit imposed tax.
        detourdog 3y ago
        The gatekeeper is only minding their own product and customers. I don't buy the e-waste issue. The only extra thing the lightening cable creates is the very cable itself. How much e-waste does a cable with a single type of connector create? The whole thing makes no sense to me. I certainly don't see a moral problem.
        tankenmate 3y ago
        I realise you don't buy the e-waste issue, but the EU does; I don't mean this in any derogatory way, but the EU cares more about e-waste than you do. Primarily in an economic fashion; waste is costly at a government and social level. Also in the EU it is an political cost as the EU public actively votes on this issue (various green parties are in government in various coalitions in various governments as well as having a sizeable influence through the EU parliament either as primary green parties or green leaning parties). EU politics is far more nuanced that US politics, mainly because proportional representation which is exceedingly common as opposed to first past the post like in the US and UK. So the EU are, in effect, voting in their own self interest. And again it's not just the cables, but the chargers as well; the EU forced mobile phone companies to stop packaging chargers with phones as well.
croes 4y ago
Isn't the same true for USB-C? Apple just blocks to lock you in their ecosystem. Can I use a USB stick over lighting port? Last time I tried it was quite a hussle.
- detourdog 4y ago
  One needs an adaptor but hardly impossible. https://support.apple.com/en-gb/guide/iphone/iph95baac91f/ios https://support.apple.com/en-gb/guide/iphone/iph95baac91f/io... It never occurred to me to do that but it's nice to have the option. https://www.bestbuy.com/site/searchpage.jsp?id=pcat17071&st=lightning+flash+drive https://www.bestbuy.com/site/searchpage.jsp?id=pcat17071&st=...
- detourdog 4y ago
  Or Apple provided a small, uni-oriented, high-speed interface when none existed. They were raked over the coals for dropping the 30 pin connector and promised to wait a long time before switching. Meanwhile USB-C was developed and the EU decided to interfere. What I wish is we stopped developing at parallel interfaces.
ohgodplsno 4y ago
In keeping in line with your stance, I hope that you are also uncomfortable with the government mandating your power sockets, your lightbulb plugs, the 120V/240 running through your power lines, the pipings running through your house, the bands used by phones, and much more. That, or you could accept that USBC is fine and that there is absolutely no needed improvement that cannot be done in the form of USB-C. Slapping magnets on USBC is not prohibited if that's what your heart desires. In the mean time, you'll live with charging your phone with 100W, I promise.
- detourdog 4y ago
  When my phone port has lethal power I can see where the government should step in. The fact that you see a port simply as way to charge instead of study in usability is why I dismiss this argument.
- irusensei 4y ago
  > That, or you could accept that Serial SCSI is fine and that there is absolutely no needed improvement that cannot be done in the form of Serial SCSI. Slapping magnets on Serial SCSI is not prohibited if that's what your heart desires. There.
  - detourdog 4y ago
    I was going to make the same argument using parallel.
- mardifoufs 4y ago
  Ah the good old "if you are in favor of a government regulation, you ought to be in favor of all government regulations!" fallacy By your own logic, you couldn't oppose the government forcing every GPU to have a VGA port, or every NVMe drive to have a sata port because hey do you also oppose standardizing 240v???
  - ohgodplsno 4y ago
    Thank you for making the perfect argument! My GPU does in fact have a VGA port. Also an HDMI, and a DisplayPort. See how that works ? The government does not mandate that there will be only one USBC port and nothing else. If you want to play with Thunderfire v5 Turbo Proprietary Edition, feel free to! Just slap in a USBC too.
vel0city 4y ago
> The lightning cable has whatever you want on the other end. The lightning cable has whatever Apple wants on the other end.
- detourdog 4y ago
  So far so good for me. Please share what you need on the end of a lightening cable that can't be found.
  - oittaa 4y ago
    More than 30 watts of power, more than USB 2.0 data rate, etc... These apple fanatics are so funny when they keep insisting that their shitty 2010 tech is bleeding edge.
    - detourdog 4y ago
      Nobody is insisting the cutting edge technology from 10 years ago is superior to today’s. I’m arguing that whatever company should be free to choose I/O interfaces without supervision.
      - anigbrowl 4y ago
        But you were given specific examples of where your preferred tech falls short of others - examples that you asked for - and you chose to ignore them and switch to a different argument. That's kinda rude.
        detourdog 4y ago
        Sorry about that. Yes USB-2 is the limiting factor. I don't think it is quite as bad as you stated. They made 2 statements one about the tech being 13 years old. I agreed that the tech was 13 years old. Admitting that I felt I was implying the limits of the lightening port were dated and had technical limits. I guess if the original poster hadn't made the gratuitous comment I would have been more focused on answering their valid comments. This is a good lesson for me to not be trolled and others to not make gratuitous comments. Finally apologizing if someone feels one has been rude.
anigbrowl 4y ago
I only want 1 port on my phone. OK, just buy phones with one port. I think you're just experiencing FOMO because it's possible that you could end up with a port that's not The Best or having to buy a less aesthetic phone.
- detourdog 4y ago
  I think I'm experiencing uncalled for government regulation. I would rather have no port change in the next 10 years. I'm not asking for change the EU is.

tankenmate 4y ago

Using the lightning cable has more onerous standardisation and compliance requirements (not all of which are purely technical requirements) than USB. This is one of the reasons that there is less availability of lightning port accessories.

detourdog 4y ago
Please elaborate. Whatever onerous issues I have with a lightening port pale in comparison to the usability of any USB port of comparable size. I understand standards and think many are great.
- tankenmate 4y ago
  It's called the "Made for iPhone" program; if your device doesn't comply and you don't pay Apple then your lightning port cable / device is limited in the power it can draw / supply (1A @ 5v I think), and data speeds (480Mbps from memory). It has a yearly fee as well as a per connector fee (so pass through cables attract double that cost); it used to be USD4 per connector but that was nearly 10 year ago so it's probably higher these days.
  - detourdog 4y ago
    I don't have a problem with vendors doing this. I prefer standards but since one side of the cable is a standard I think it is fine. Implementing ports cost money . Developing for Apple customers costs money. One can choose their market based on costs. I understand the lightening standard show it's age and is in need of an upgrade. Why the EU is involved in the decision making process is lost to me.
    - tankenmate 4y ago
      The EU's stance is primarily about e-waste, and secondarily about lower costs through competition. Having one standard does a good job of achieving both; lower costs through economies of scale, and less waste because when you get a new phone you don't need to replace all your accessories. It's not perfect but it is better than the alternatives. Having one gate keeper (for example "Made for iPhone" USDx per device / cable) profiting off this isn't good and isn't conscionable from a public policy perspective; it would amount to a private benefit imposed tax.
      - detourdog 3y ago
        The gatekeeper is only minding their own product and customers. I don't buy the e-waste issue. The only extra thing the lightening cable creates is the very cable itself. How much e-waste does a cable with a single type of connector create? The whole thing makes no sense to me. I certainly don't see a moral problem.
        tankenmate 3y ago
        I realise you don't buy the e-waste issue, but the EU does; I don't mean this in any derogatory way, but the EU cares more about e-waste than you do. Primarily in an economic fashion; waste is costly at a government and social level. Also in the EU it is an political cost as the EU public actively votes on this issue (various green parties are in government in various coalitions in various governments as well as having a sizeable influence through the EU parliament either as primary green parties or green leaning parties). EU politics is far more nuanced that US politics, mainly because proportional representation which is exceedingly common as opposed to first past the post like in the US and UK. So the EU are, in effect, voting in their own self interest. And again it's not just the cables, but the chargers as well; the EU forced mobile phone companies to stop packaging chargers with phones as well.

croes 4y ago

Isn't the same true for USB-C? Apple just blocks to lock you in their ecosystem. Can I use a USB stick over lighting port? Last time I tried it was quite a hussle.

detourdog 4y ago
One needs an adaptor but hardly impossible. https://support.apple.com/en-gb/guide/iphone/iph95baac91f/ios https://support.apple.com/en-gb/guide/iphone/iph95baac91f/io... It never occurred to me to do that but it's nice to have the option. https://www.bestbuy.com/site/searchpage.jsp?id=pcat17071&st=lightning+flash+drive https://www.bestbuy.com/site/searchpage.jsp?id=pcat17071&st=...
detourdog 4y ago
Or Apple provided a small, uni-oriented, high-speed interface when none existed. They were raked over the coals for dropping the 30 pin connector and promised to wait a long time before switching. Meanwhile USB-C was developed and the EU decided to interfere. What I wish is we stopped developing at parallel interfaces.

ohgodplsno 4y ago

In keeping in line with your stance, I hope that you are also uncomfortable with the government mandating your power sockets, your lightbulb plugs, the 120V/240 running through your power lines, the pipings running through your house, the bands used by phones, and much more. That, or you could accept that USBC is fine and that there is absolutely no needed improvement that cannot be done in the form of USB-C. Slapping magnets on USBC is not prohibited if that's what your heart desires. In the mean time, you'll live with charging your phone with 100W, I promise.

detourdog 4y ago
When my phone port has lethal power I can see where the government should step in. The fact that you see a port simply as way to charge instead of study in usability is why I dismiss this argument.
irusensei 4y ago
> That, or you could accept that Serial SCSI is fine and that there is absolutely no needed improvement that cannot be done in the form of Serial SCSI. Slapping magnets on Serial SCSI is not prohibited if that's what your heart desires. There.
- detourdog 4y ago
  I was going to make the same argument using parallel.
mardifoufs 4y ago
Ah the good old "if you are in favor of a government regulation, you ought to be in favor of all government regulations!" fallacy By your own logic, you couldn't oppose the government forcing every GPU to have a VGA port, or every NVMe drive to have a sata port because hey do you also oppose standardizing 240v???
- ohgodplsno 4y ago
  Thank you for making the perfect argument! My GPU does in fact have a VGA port. Also an HDMI, and a DisplayPort. See how that works ? The government does not mandate that there will be only one USBC port and nothing else. If you want to play with Thunderfire v5 Turbo Proprietary Edition, feel free to! Just slap in a USBC too.

vel0city 4y ago

> The lightning cable has whatever you want on the other end. The lightning cable has whatever Apple wants on the other end.

detourdog 4y ago
So far so good for me. Please share what you need on the end of a lightening cable that can't be found.
- oittaa 4y ago
  More than 30 watts of power, more than USB 2.0 data rate, etc... These apple fanatics are so funny when they keep insisting that their shitty 2010 tech is bleeding edge.
  - detourdog 4y ago
    Nobody is insisting the cutting edge technology from 10 years ago is superior to today’s. I’m arguing that whatever company should be free to choose I/O interfaces without supervision.
    - anigbrowl 4y ago
      But you were given specific examples of where your preferred tech falls short of others - examples that you asked for - and you chose to ignore them and switch to a different argument. That's kinda rude.
      - detourdog 4y ago
        Sorry about that. Yes USB-2 is the limiting factor. I don't think it is quite as bad as you stated. They made 2 statements one about the tech being 13 years old. I agreed that the tech was 13 years old. Admitting that I felt I was implying the limits of the lightening port were dated and had technical limits. I guess if the original poster hadn't made the gratuitous comment I would have been more focused on answering their valid comments. This is a good lesson for me to not be trolled and others to not make gratuitous comments. Finally apologizing if someone feels one has been rude.

anigbrowl 4y ago

I only want 1 port on my phone. OK, just buy phones with one port. I think you're just experiencing FOMO because it's possible that you could end up with a port that's not The Best or having to buy a less aesthetic phone.

detourdog 4y ago
I think I'm experiencing uncalled for government regulation. I would rather have no port change in the next 10 years. I'm not asking for change the EU is.