4 ms·

KDE Developers in Germany Planning for Plasma 6.0

71 points by profwalkstr 3y ago

7e 3y ago
[flagged]
bitL 3y ago
What is missing to have Plasma providing a full experience on Linux phones or tablets, e.g. PinePhone/Tab2?
- yarg 3y ago
  The biggest problem is probably driver integration for machines targeted at android. Bitch of a problem to have to constantly patch between them, and you're not getting any support from the vendors.
  - hedora 3y ago
    My pinebook pro seems to like plasma. Presumably that’s true of the pinetab, right?
    - yarg 3y ago
      I don't really know to be honest. But there's this that might be worth reading: https://tuxphones.com/purism-librem-5-vs-pine64-pinephone-linux-smartphone-comparison/ https://tuxphones.com/purism-librem-5-vs-pine64-pinephone-li... > On the other hand, Pine64 opted for a community-based approach: they provide the base hardware and OS to users and developers, and the community develops the needed software to make it run. postmarketOS and (Ubports) Ubuntu Touch developers have already ported their OS to the PinePhone development kits, and KDE Plasma Mobile will be the primary desktop designed for this phone. About $10 for each device will be donated to open source projects.
htag 3y ago
I've been using Linux long enough that I was around for KDE 3 and KDE 4. I did not enjoy using them, but I love 5. I'm nervous about this upgrade. I can't think of anything I want that would merit a major version upgrade.
- cardanome 3y ago
  Oh, KDE 3.5 was amazing. When KDE 4 came, I packed my stuff and never looked back. Good to hear KDE 5 is doing fine at least, let us hope for the best. I get that many people are more excited about rewriting stuff than fixing bugs but oh man is the risk is rarely ever worth it. If you have a good thing going, don't kill your golden goose.
  - fmntf 3y ago
    I feel the same. The widgets/cashew stuff was totally insane.
- kps 3y ago
  People used to look forward to software updates. How did it come to this?
  - II2II 3y ago
    I get the impression that attitudes are starting to shift back to anticipation, but I suspect that many people are still leery due to the disruptive changes brought by KDE 4, Gnome 3, and Python 3 (to name three projects that immediately come to my mind). Of course, those weren't the only products affected and open source software wasn't the only thing affected. The years around 2010 felt a bit like the early 1990's, with the distinct difference that disruptive change in the early 1990's brought with it quality of life improvements that were more often well received. Now that software is starting to mature again (at least in my mind, and at least with open source projects), changes are more welcome. Watching updates is more interesting because the bullet points look interesting from a utility standpoint rather than a drama standpoint.
  - Barrin92 3y ago
chickenimprint 3y ago
When are they finally going to move on to CSDs like GNOME?
- kps 3y ago
  Never, I hope. I want my window management to be consistent across windows.
nmstoker 3y ago
I'm keen to see a fairly minimal change with KDE6 / Plasma 6 - so much is working great in KDE5 / Plasma 5 that it would be a shame to suffer reversions but presumably the odd one or two will crop up. The only things I can think of I'd like tweaked are: 1. to make shifting pinned icons about more initiative (I must have the wrong mental model of editing the desktop layout as I always end up flailing around with something that seems like it should be trivially easy!) 2. Sort out Baloo: perhaps off by default and ideally to have better handling of exceptionally large compressed files (these usually result in it going into an hours long process of chugging away often with little to show afterwards!)
- franga2000 3y ago
  Throw in better handling of network shares for non-KIO apps and finally fixing that bug where the text cursor randomly decides to jump forward or back on Wayland sometimes and their work is done as far as I'm concerned.
- kps 3y ago
  My fantasy wish list: - Let me globally use Meta as default keyboard shortcut modifier. There's code in QT somewhere that does this but it's restricted to MacOS. - Get back custom window icons in the task manager. Apparently Wayland doesn't allow this, so it got disabled for X11 too. I used to identify my n terminal windows by icon, but now they all look the same. - A way to persistently attach shortcuts to select particular windows (again, said terminals). You can manually set shortcuts, but they don't persist. I used to have some scripting based on inspecting window titles, but it was fragile some update broke it. - In Dolphin, Mac-style column view and ‘quick look’. (On the bright side, Dolphin will now let you disable the focus-follows-mouse behaviour of the preview panel; that just missed 23.04 though.)
hulitu 3y ago
CADT again. Did they fixed the bugs in 5 ? Or are they rushing to be ahead of Gnome GTK 5 ?
solarkraft 3y ago
I don't hate KDE, I love many many things about it. But have they ever considered moving their software beyond alpha quality before releasing a new major version? A major reason I'm not putting any more time into KDE is the expectation that it'll never be stable.
- solarkraft 3y ago
  I know this is an incredibly snarky, cynical and just negative take, but that's how I felt when I was trying to use Plasma Wayland. That it was on a touch device made the experience considerably worse, but a lot of the UI glitches would likely have happened without it. A friend of mine has a collection of KDE glitches that look like the ones I experienced, but are completely different. Every KDE update blog post talks about bug fixes, but during the time I had been using KDE I couldn't sense any improvement. It's like they either fixed a minute subset of bugs or kept putting in new ones.
  - solarkraft 3y ago
    Oh yeah, what I saw of Kirigami ... kind of sucked. From what I could tell (purely from use!) they have at least 3 different UI toolkits: Qt Widgets (the traditional, solid feeling and looking applications), Qml with Qt controls (looks mostly traditional, but has some weirdness around scrolling, sometimes it's extremely spongy) and Kirigami, which is the worst of them all with the weirdness of Qml-based apps AND a look different from the standard platform theme (kind of like material design but with the proportions being all off). There might be some configurations/frameworks in between these because some applications would have normal touchpad scrolling, but were then also scrollable by just dragging the mouse cursor (touch scrolling was hit and miss in Qt Widgets apps, Dolphin for instance just wouldn't do it, touch-based right clicks are of course another horror). Ideally I'd be totally behind Kirigami, I like the idea and I like Qml quite a lot too. But the UX was HORRIBLE.

71 points by profwalkstr 3y ago

7e 3y ago

[flagged]

bitL 3y ago

What is missing to have Plasma providing a full experience on Linux phones or tablets, e.g. PinePhone/Tab2?

yarg 3y ago
The biggest problem is probably driver integration for machines targeted at android. Bitch of a problem to have to constantly patch between them, and you're not getting any support from the vendors.
- hedora 3y ago
  My pinebook pro seems to like plasma. Presumably that’s true of the pinetab, right?
  - yarg 3y ago
    I don't really know to be honest. But there's this that might be worth reading: https://tuxphones.com/purism-librem-5-vs-pine64-pinephone-linux-smartphone-comparison/ https://tuxphones.com/purism-librem-5-vs-pine64-pinephone-li... > On the other hand, Pine64 opted for a community-based approach: they provide the base hardware and OS to users and developers, and the community develops the needed software to make it run. postmarketOS and (Ubports) Ubuntu Touch developers have already ported their OS to the PinePhone development kits, and KDE Plasma Mobile will be the primary desktop designed for this phone. About $10 for each device will be donated to open source projects.

htag 3y ago

I've been using Linux long enough that I was around for KDE 3 and KDE 4. I did not enjoy using them, but I love 5. I'm nervous about this upgrade. I can't think of anything I want that would merit a major version upgrade.

cardanome 3y ago
Oh, KDE 3.5 was amazing. When KDE 4 came, I packed my stuff and never looked back. Good to hear KDE 5 is doing fine at least, let us hope for the best. I get that many people are more excited about rewriting stuff than fixing bugs but oh man is the risk is rarely ever worth it. If you have a good thing going, don't kill your golden goose.
- fmntf 3y ago
  I feel the same. The widgets/cashew stuff was totally insane.
kps 3y ago
People used to look forward to software updates. How did it come to this?
- II2II 3y ago
  I get the impression that attitudes are starting to shift back to anticipation, but I suspect that many people are still leery due to the disruptive changes brought by KDE 4, Gnome 3, and Python 3 (to name three projects that immediately come to my mind). Of course, those weren't the only products affected and open source software wasn't the only thing affected. The years around 2010 felt a bit like the early 1990's, with the distinct difference that disruptive change in the early 1990's brought with it quality of life improvements that were more often well received. Now that software is starting to mature again (at least in my mind, and at least with open source projects), changes are more welcome. Watching updates is more interesting because the bullet points look interesting from a utility standpoint rather than a drama standpoint.
- Barrin92 3y ago

chickenimprint 3y ago

When are they finally going to move on to CSDs like GNOME?

kps 3y ago
Never, I hope. I want my window management to be consistent across windows.

nmstoker 3y ago

I'm keen to see a fairly minimal change with KDE6 / Plasma 6 - so much is working great in KDE5 / Plasma 5 that it would be a shame to suffer reversions but presumably the odd one or two will crop up. The only things I can think of I'd like tweaked are: 1. to make shifting pinned icons about more initiative (I must have the wrong mental model of editing the desktop layout as I always end up flailing around with something that seems like it should be trivially easy!) 2. Sort out Baloo: perhaps off by default and ideally to have better handling of exceptionally large compressed files (these usually result in it going into an hours long process of chugging away often with little to show afterwards!)

franga2000 3y ago
Throw in better handling of network shares for non-KIO apps and finally fixing that bug where the text cursor randomly decides to jump forward or back on Wayland sometimes and their work is done as far as I'm concerned.
kps 3y ago
My fantasy wish list: - Let me globally use Meta as default keyboard shortcut modifier. There's code in QT somewhere that does this but it's restricted to MacOS. - Get back custom window icons in the task manager. Apparently Wayland doesn't allow this, so it got disabled for X11 too. I used to identify my n terminal windows by icon, but now they all look the same. - A way to persistently attach shortcuts to select particular windows (again, said terminals). You can manually set shortcuts, but they don't persist. I used to have some scripting based on inspecting window titles, but it was fragile some update broke it. - In Dolphin, Mac-style column view and ‘quick look’. (On the bright side, Dolphin will now let you disable the focus-follows-mouse behaviour of the preview panel; that just missed 23.04 though.)

hulitu 3y ago

CADT again. Did they fixed the bugs in 5 ? Or are they rushing to be ahead of Gnome GTK 5 ?

solarkraft 3y ago

I don't hate KDE, I love many many things about it. But have they ever considered moving their software beyond alpha quality before releasing a new major version? A major reason I'm not putting any more time into KDE is the expectation that it'll never be stable.

solarkraft 3y ago
I know this is an incredibly snarky, cynical and just negative take, but that's how I felt when I was trying to use Plasma Wayland. That it was on a touch device made the experience considerably worse, but a lot of the UI glitches would likely have happened without it. A friend of mine has a collection of KDE glitches that look like the ones I experienced, but are completely different. Every KDE update blog post talks about bug fixes, but during the time I had been using KDE I couldn't sense any improvement. It's like they either fixed a minute subset of bugs or kept putting in new ones.
- solarkraft 3y ago
  Oh yeah, what I saw of Kirigami ... kind of sucked. From what I could tell (purely from use!) they have at least 3 different UI toolkits: Qt Widgets (the traditional, solid feeling and looking applications), Qml with Qt controls (looks mostly traditional, but has some weirdness around scrolling, sometimes it's extremely spongy) and Kirigami, which is the worst of them all with the weirdness of Qml-based apps AND a look different from the standard platform theme (kind of like material design but with the proportions being all off). There might be some configurations/frameworks in between these because some applications would have normal touchpad scrolling, but were then also scrollable by just dragging the mouse cursor (touch scrolling was hit and miss in Qt Widgets apps, Dolphin for instance just wouldn't do it, touch-based right clicks are of course another horror). Ideally I'd be totally behind Kirigami, I like the idea and I like Qml quite a lot too. But the UX was HORRIBLE.