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As is typical, many of the pieces were primed to lead to the Web outcome, and Berners-Lee was the right person in the right place at the right time. It certainl

As is typical, many of the pieces were primed to lead to the Web outcome, and Berners-Lee was the right person in the right place at the right time. It certainly could have been someone else. Just as another company would have done some variation (better or worse) of what Apple did with the iPhone (most of the pieces were ready to do it well and Jobs saw that). The more intriguing question is how things might have occurred differently, if the beginnings were derived from a different set of factors & actors. It could have been a lot more obnoxiously commercial from the beginning (AOL & CompuServe style).

tudorw 3y ago
Xanadu
- mixmastamyk 3y ago
  A place… where nobody dared to go…
  - tannhaeuser 3y ago
    A million lights are dancing and there you are
- themadturk 3y ago
  now we are here...
- jdougan 3y ago
  I wonder how that would have worked if the Autodesk situation had been more gentle. eg. they had xu88/Green/Classic working well enough for actual usage while they built out xu92/Gold.
  - tudorw 3y ago
    not sure, but I think with AI's help to codify and code, we could build it now :)
    - jdougan 3y ago
      I've been looking deeply at the existing Xanadu docs so I have a pretty good sense of how it all was supposed to work. Could I get a look at the stuff you did with the LLM? I want to see what it gets wrong as there is a lot of misleading data out there on Xanadu and Enfilades. (contact info in bio)
      - tudorw 3y ago
        https://github.com/tudorw/Xanadonot https://github.com/tudorw/Xanadonot it's all on a public repo, it's basically an unfiltered chat between me and gpt, someone more familiar tried some of the python code and said it ran so...would love to hear your feedback :)
macintux 3y ago
My belief has been that sure, someone would have created a device like the iPhone, but remembering just how consumer-hostile the phone manufacturers and carriers were at the time, it would have: * required a carrier-specific App Store * been just one of 20 models sold by the manufacturer * gathered dust in their awful retail stores because the salespeople had no idea how to use it or incentive to sell it Not only did Apple create the device, but they threw their entire weight behind it (and of course had a built-in fan base eager to try it), and committed to its success. Even Google with Android was experimenting with multiple form factors, and would not have demonstrated that level of commitment to a single one.
- Tijdreiziger 3y ago
  I think you just described Symbian.
- adventured 3y ago
  I also think it was invaluable that the iPhone app system was heavily secured (app approvals/reviews/restrictions) and or closed in the early years. Consumers were coming from a terrible Windows stretch where viruses plagued the mass PC systems connected to the Internet. They mostly didn't have to worry about that while learning how to best utilize the iPhone in their day to day lives. Apple made several excellent pro-consumer choices that many other companies would not have (including squeezing the telecom companies; which at the time, Apple & Co were nowhere near the size they are now, pushing around big telecom was no small feat).
- tjoff 3y ago
  That is a very US specific problem though. It would have been easy to make a store for java apps present on other platforms as well. Could even have been a java app itself or a homepage.
- rkagerer 3y ago
  Don't forget it was preceeded by the iPod, which had a momentum of popularity Apple could build on. As well, the original iPhone was a very different device - in my opinion the platform didn't realize its potential until they opened it up to third party apps and the App Store. I still think Palm squandered their decade headstart and I actually like their UI so much better. What could have been if only they hadn't made such terrible business decisions...
detourdog 3y ago
I'm actually trying to pickup up the pre-personal computer design ideas and design an analog type computer as if the pc never happened. I believe it is these types of questions that drives the cycle of development.

tudorw 3y ago

Xanadu

mixmastamyk 3y ago
A place… where nobody dared to go…
- tannhaeuser 3y ago
  A million lights are dancing and there you are
themadturk 3y ago
now we are here...
jdougan 3y ago
I wonder how that would have worked if the Autodesk situation had been more gentle. eg. they had xu88/Green/Classic working well enough for actual usage while they built out xu92/Gold.
- tudorw 3y ago
  not sure, but I think with AI's help to codify and code, we could build it now :)
  - jdougan 3y ago
    I've been looking deeply at the existing Xanadu docs so I have a pretty good sense of how it all was supposed to work. Could I get a look at the stuff you did with the LLM? I want to see what it gets wrong as there is a lot of misleading data out there on Xanadu and Enfilades. (contact info in bio)
    - tudorw 3y ago
      https://github.com/tudorw/Xanadonot https://github.com/tudorw/Xanadonot it's all on a public repo, it's basically an unfiltered chat between me and gpt, someone more familiar tried some of the python code and said it ran so...would love to hear your feedback :)

macintux 3y ago

My belief has been that sure, someone would have created a device like the iPhone, but remembering just how consumer-hostile the phone manufacturers and carriers were at the time, it would have: * required a carrier-specific App Store * been just one of 20 models sold by the manufacturer * gathered dust in their awful retail stores because the salespeople had no idea how to use it or incentive to sell it Not only did Apple create the device, but they threw their entire weight behind it (and of course had a built-in fan base eager to try it), and committed to its success. Even Google with Android was experimenting with multiple form factors, and would not have demonstrated that level of commitment to a single one.

Tijdreiziger 3y ago
I think you just described Symbian.
adventured 3y ago
I also think it was invaluable that the iPhone app system was heavily secured (app approvals/reviews/restrictions) and or closed in the early years. Consumers were coming from a terrible Windows stretch where viruses plagued the mass PC systems connected to the Internet. They mostly didn't have to worry about that while learning how to best utilize the iPhone in their day to day lives. Apple made several excellent pro-consumer choices that many other companies would not have (including squeezing the telecom companies; which at the time, Apple & Co were nowhere near the size they are now, pushing around big telecom was no small feat).
tjoff 3y ago
That is a very US specific problem though. It would have been easy to make a store for java apps present on other platforms as well. Could even have been a java app itself or a homepage.
rkagerer 3y ago
Don't forget it was preceeded by the iPod, which had a momentum of popularity Apple could build on. As well, the original iPhone was a very different device - in my opinion the platform didn't realize its potential until they opened it up to third party apps and the App Store. I still think Palm squandered their decade headstart and I actually like their UI so much better. What could have been if only they hadn't made such terrible business decisions...

detourdog 3y ago

I'm actually trying to pickup up the pre-personal computer design ideas and design an analog type computer as if the pc never happened. I believe it is these types of questions that drives the cycle of development.