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I think Euro-socialism is what most of those kids want, whether they are aware of putting it in those terms or not. The culture wars seem to dictate that there

I think Euro-socialism is what most of those kids want, whether they are aware of putting it in those terms or not. The culture wars seem to dictate that there are huge contingents of tankies among the youth, but that doesn't really seem to be the case on the ground (i.e. not on Twitter). The DSA, the biggest, by far, left-org in the US appears, at least to me, to be pushing a platform indistinguishable from a Euro model.

WC3w6pXxgGd 4y ago
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bequanna 4y ago
European socialism isn't bad. But how does it work when you have such varied cultures like the US? Outside of some existential threat like war, it doesn't seem at all possible for everyone in the US to start rowing in the same direction.
- OkayPhysicist 4y ago
  What about a "varied culture" prevents a nationalization of the health insurance industry? It's about presentation: If pitched as "We're offering better health insurance at a lower price than your existing plan" the vast majority of people would be on board. It would take a political miracle because of our thoroughly corrupted political system, but once it existed as an option, I have no doubt that trying to kill it would be political suicide. The problem is that our far right party is A-Ok with working class people going broke from healthcare costs, and poor people just dying, and our center-right party has pretty much adopted a platform of "We won't make things any worse".
- teh64 4y ago
  Europe, of course, being a totally homogenous culture? This argument that America is too culturally diverse or too big for something to work has got to be the most uninformed, "the world consists of america and other", ever.
int_19h 4y ago
I don't think there's a coherent political goal for the Western activist left. There's a laundry list of wishes, and a general vague notion that they can't be obtained "because capitalism". From there it quickly devolves into guillotine memes and such, but I don't think there are many people who are even well versed in Marxism or other hard left ideologies and actively pursuing their goals - it's mostly just venting.
- beepbooptheory 4y ago
  I think this is right. I would just say Euro-socialism is itself a laundry list of hotfixes over capitalism.

WC3w6pXxgGd 4y ago

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bequanna 4y ago

European socialism isn't bad. But how does it work when you have such varied cultures like the US? Outside of some existential threat like war, it doesn't seem at all possible for everyone in the US to start rowing in the same direction.

OkayPhysicist 4y ago
What about a "varied culture" prevents a nationalization of the health insurance industry? It's about presentation: If pitched as "We're offering better health insurance at a lower price than your existing plan" the vast majority of people would be on board. It would take a political miracle because of our thoroughly corrupted political system, but once it existed as an option, I have no doubt that trying to kill it would be political suicide. The problem is that our far right party is A-Ok with working class people going broke from healthcare costs, and poor people just dying, and our center-right party has pretty much adopted a platform of "We won't make things any worse".
teh64 4y ago
Europe, of course, being a totally homogenous culture? This argument that America is too culturally diverse or too big for something to work has got to be the most uninformed, "the world consists of america and other", ever.

int_19h 4y ago

I don't think there's a coherent political goal for the Western activist left. There's a laundry list of wishes, and a general vague notion that they can't be obtained "because capitalism". From there it quickly devolves into guillotine memes and such, but I don't think there are many people who are even well versed in Marxism or other hard left ideologies and actively pursuing their goals - it's mostly just venting.

beepbooptheory 4y ago
I think this is right. I would just say Euro-socialism is itself a laundry list of hotfixes over capitalism.