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As California has shown multiple times, dependence on electricity alone can be disastrous.

8note 3y ago
Dependence on the electricity is fine, dependence on the grid alone can be disastrous. Depending on two different grid's is better whether the second one is gas or your own electricity generation
blindriver 3y ago
California's strategy for electricity is non-existent. We have been perpetually at peak electricity use since 25+ years since I came here. Meanwhile electricity use from EVs has soared, and we don't have enough electricity for everything. AND we attempted to shut down nuclear power plants but that appears to be on hold for now. Plus, I'm paying over $0.50/kWh when I hit Tier 3, which I hit after 2 charges of my EV. Everything is untenable. There is no strategy at all. It's just a mess of ideology and dogma but no science or logic, it's infuriating!
- ricardobayes 3y ago
  Well, holy smokes, I thought electricity was cheap in the US.
  - annexrichmond 3y ago
    It could have been, but ideologues won’t stop talking about wind turbines vs fossil fuels. Over 30% of California’s grid comes from renewable resources, which seems great, but appears to have come at a cost.
  - bluGill 3y ago
    For most of us it is cheap. I don't know what is going on in California, but they are not typical.
  - jandrewrogers 3y ago
    California is not typical and their situation is largely self-inflicted. In many other parts of the US it is still very cheap.
  - thebiss 3y ago
    It's highly regional. Per kWh, Connecticut pays twice as much as New Jersey, on average. Boston pays three times what Arizona pays. The government updates price tables monthly: https://www.eia.gov/electricity/monthly/epm_table_grapher.php?t=epmt_5_6_a https://www.eia.gov/electricity/monthly/epm_table_grapher.ph...
- dragonwriter 3y ago
  > AND we attempted to shut down nuclear power plants but that appears to be on hold for now. California has had a grand total of four nuclear power plant, three are decommissioned, the fourth has is scheduled to have its two reactors be decommissioned in 2029 and 2030. The “on hold” description for the 5-year extension (the schedule used to be 2024/2025) is inaccurate: it was contingent on replacements being identified and operational, those have been identified but were delayed by factors including a temporary tariff on relevant components, but are expected to be operational well before the 2029 date.
- px43 3y ago
  What's the rooftop solar situation where you're at? I live in Oregon and maybe a fifth of the houses in my neighborhood have rooftop solar. A friend of mine in California mentioned that their rooftop solar setup fully covered all their usage and had them selling about 30% of their power generation back to the grid. Seems like an obvious win in California.
- danny_codes 3y ago
  Reminder that pg&e is a for-profit monopoly. Reminder that this is the dumbest way of organizing an energy company imaginable. I literally can't think of anything so stupid. You know they make profit. They steal about 16 billion a year. Think about how much infra improvement we could do with 16 billion. We could nationalize those assholes today.
newZWhoDis 3y ago
Just because California sucks at something doesn’t mean it’s a bad idea. Just like with Texas and wind turbines that lacked basic winterization, implementation details matter.
- r00fus 3y ago
  Please don't promote falsehoods. Texas power outage wasn't due to wind turbines. It was due to gas plants freezing and being unable to operate. Of course Gov. Abbot decides to blame green energy when that's literally what prevented even more blackouts. [1] "Power equipment in Texas was not winterized, leaving it vulnerable to extended periods of cold weather.[44][45] Natural gas power generating facilities had equipment freeze up and faced shortages of fuel. Texas Governor Greg Abbott and some other politicians initially said renewable energy sources were the cause for the power outages, citing frozen wind turbines as an example of their unreliability.[46] Viral images of a helicopter de-icing a wind turbine said to be in Texas were actually taken in 2015 in Sweden.[47] However, wind energy accounts for only 23% of Texas power output;[47] moreover, equipment for other energy sources such as natural gas power generating facilities either freezing up or having mechanical failures were also responsible.[46] " [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021_Texas_power_crisis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021_Texas_power_crisis
  - newZWhoDis 3y ago
    I wasn’t promoting falsehoods, I’m aware that the majority of the grid loss in the Texas storm came from frozen gas wells. Texas also screwed up with their turbines
theshrike79 3y ago
The US power grid is _literally_ ancient. That one huge fire a few years ago was caused when a thick piece of iron WORE THROUGH from 100 years of wear and tear. But the laws have specific exceptions for oil and gas pipelines (one permit and the land owners have to dealwithit), for new electric lines everyone who can even theoretically see them can (and will) complain.

Dependence on the electricity is fine, dependence on the grid alone can be disastrous. Depending on two different grid's is better whether the second one is gas or your own electricity generation

blindriver 3y ago

California's strategy for electricity is non-existent. We have been perpetually at peak electricity use since 25+ years since I came here. Meanwhile electricity use from EVs has soared, and we don't have enough electricity for everything. AND we attempted to shut down nuclear power plants but that appears to be on hold for now. Plus, I'm paying over $0.50/kWh when I hit Tier 3, which I hit after 2 charges of my EV. Everything is untenable. There is no strategy at all. It's just a mess of ideology and dogma but no science or logic, it's infuriating!

ricardobayes 3y ago
Well, holy smokes, I thought electricity was cheap in the US.
- annexrichmond 3y ago
  It could have been, but ideologues won’t stop talking about wind turbines vs fossil fuels. Over 30% of California’s grid comes from renewable resources, which seems great, but appears to have come at a cost.
- bluGill 3y ago
  For most of us it is cheap. I don't know what is going on in California, but they are not typical.
- jandrewrogers 3y ago
  California is not typical and their situation is largely self-inflicted. In many other parts of the US it is still very cheap.
- thebiss 3y ago
  It's highly regional. Per kWh, Connecticut pays twice as much as New Jersey, on average. Boston pays three times what Arizona pays. The government updates price tables monthly: https://www.eia.gov/electricity/monthly/epm_table_grapher.php?t=epmt_5_6_a https://www.eia.gov/electricity/monthly/epm_table_grapher.ph...
dragonwriter 3y ago
> AND we attempted to shut down nuclear power plants but that appears to be on hold for now. California has had a grand total of four nuclear power plant, three are decommissioned, the fourth has is scheduled to have its two reactors be decommissioned in 2029 and 2030. The “on hold” description for the 5-year extension (the schedule used to be 2024/2025) is inaccurate: it was contingent on replacements being identified and operational, those have been identified but were delayed by factors including a temporary tariff on relevant components, but are expected to be operational well before the 2029 date.
px43 3y ago
What's the rooftop solar situation where you're at? I live in Oregon and maybe a fifth of the houses in my neighborhood have rooftop solar. A friend of mine in California mentioned that their rooftop solar setup fully covered all their usage and had them selling about 30% of their power generation back to the grid. Seems like an obvious win in California.
danny_codes 3y ago
Reminder that pg&e is a for-profit monopoly. Reminder that this is the dumbest way of organizing an energy company imaginable. I literally can't think of anything so stupid. You know they make profit. They steal about 16 billion a year. Think about how much infra improvement we could do with 16 billion. We could nationalize those assholes today.

newZWhoDis 3y ago

Just because California sucks at something doesn’t mean it’s a bad idea. Just like with Texas and wind turbines that lacked basic winterization, implementation details matter.

r00fus 3y ago
Please don't promote falsehoods. Texas power outage wasn't due to wind turbines. It was due to gas plants freezing and being unable to operate. Of course Gov. Abbot decides to blame green energy when that's literally what prevented even more blackouts. [1] "Power equipment in Texas was not winterized, leaving it vulnerable to extended periods of cold weather.[44][45] Natural gas power generating facilities had equipment freeze up and faced shortages of fuel. Texas Governor Greg Abbott and some other politicians initially said renewable energy sources were the cause for the power outages, citing frozen wind turbines as an example of their unreliability.[46] Viral images of a helicopter de-icing a wind turbine said to be in Texas were actually taken in 2015 in Sweden.[47] However, wind energy accounts for only 23% of Texas power output;[47] moreover, equipment for other energy sources such as natural gas power generating facilities either freezing up or having mechanical failures were also responsible.[46] " [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021_Texas_power_crisis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021_Texas_power_crisis
- newZWhoDis 3y ago
  I wasn’t promoting falsehoods, I’m aware that the majority of the grid loss in the Texas storm came from frozen gas wells. Texas also screwed up with their turbines

theshrike79 3y ago

The US power grid is _literally_ ancient. That one huge fire a few years ago was caused when a thick piece of iron WORE THROUGH from 100 years of wear and tear. But the laws have specific exceptions for oil and gas pipelines (one permit and the land owners have to dealwithit), for new electric lines everyone who can even theoretically see them can (and will) complain.