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Within rounding error, no chicken or pigs are raised this way today
by rmorey 3y ago
Within rounding error, no chicken or pigs are raised this way today
- Gordonjcp 3y agoIn your country.
- rmorey 3y agoSorry, good point - worldwide it's only ~90% that are factory farmed https://www.sentienceinstitute.org/global-animal-farming-estimates https://www.sentienceinstitute.org/global-animal-farming-est...
- marcosdumay 3y ago> However, there is substantial uncertainty in these figures No kidding. They could start by using a single (and known) definition for "factory farmed". Unless you are in the business of refining that data, this study is useless.
- rmorey 3y agoit’s not useless, it’s just not that conclusive. Im pretty confident in saying a significant majority of animals raised for slaughter worldwide are done so in conditions commonly described as “factory farms”. We can quibble about the definitions all we want, but this is the dominant mode of raising animals for slaughter, that is clear to me
- marcosdumay 3y ago> in conditions commonly described as “factory farms” Except that this phrase doesn't mean anything.
- rmorey 3y agohope this helps: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intensive_animal_farming https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intensive_animal_farming
- marcosdumay 3y agoThere is no reason at all to believe that the dozens of definitions that study used for "factory farm" fits the few ones stated on that wikipedia link. And there is no overwhelming problem that applies to all of the few definitions on your wikipedia link either.
- rmorey 3y agoYou said the phrase was meaningless, I disagree completely with that. We also disagree on the study, but that's a much more reasonable disagreement.
- marcosdumay 3y agoAs your wikipedia link shows, people commonly describe as "factory farm" anything from places where animals go indoor in the winter all the way to places where the animals have no space to move. Or places that create a lot of sessile animals are placed. Or places where animals are gathered to eat. Or places engineered to be comfortable for animals that don't move a lot. And that is only if you stay within the reasonable people. Almost everybody with an impulsion to talk about this subject uses unreasonable definitions. How is a single name that applies to all that still meaningful?
- rmorey 3y agoFine, let’s say “factory farming” is not a useful term. Do you have any suggestions for how we should talk about / classify modern farming practices? I genuinely appreciate this discussion
- cute_boi 3y agoIn a capitalist world where a small number of individuals possess significant wealth, the idea of free chicken is nothing but a myth. For the majority of people, money is the top priority and they will invariably choose it over any other option.
- the_af 3y agoFree range chicken exist (or sometimes a slightly less free version of this, let's not split hairs). Their meat and eggs are more expensive. I don't know if they are economically feasible large scale though.
- cfn 3y agoThey are feasible, lookup Joel Salatin for an example.
- the_af 3y agoThanks, will do! Because this is HN, where someone is sure to nitpick and/or take my next statement to logical extremes, I must be very careful about how I word this. I will regret it, but here I go: I like eating chicken. I know lots of tasty recipes. I understand this involves killing the animal. Yes, I don't do it myself, but I could if I wanted -- I'm not squeamish. But factory chicken make me uneasy, it seems well past the inhumane line, almost like an extermination camp for chicken. I think free range chicken are happier, for whatever degree of "happiness" their tiny bird brains can understand. I like thinking that the chicken I eat lived a happy if short life trampling on actual grass and all that "breeze in their feathers" stuff. Yes, in the end it still involves killing them, but I think it's way better.
- nuancebydefault 3y agoIndeed if they had a happy life where they did not need to suppress their instincts too much (roaming, scratching the ground, picking with their becks for tiny life in the soil) and getting killed in an instance, why would you feel bad about the killing&eating parts?
- cfn 3y agoKilling a chicken is hard, I have done that many times and I it never get easier. After all it is a living thing and you feel it is distressed, angry and in fear. I know people that are impervious to that but I am not and understand why you would feel bad about eating animals.