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> but it's legal to fiddle with a damn computer screen, because it's part of the car. In Germany it is only legal to operate a touch screen while driving for e

> but it's legal to fiddle with a damn computer screen, because it's part of the car. In Germany it is only legal to operate a touch screen while driving for essential functions with only a brief glance. For example, a judgement was handed down against a Tesla driver who tried to switch up the interval of the windscreen wiper via touchscreen and ran off the road in the process. Source: https://www.burhoff.de/asp_weitere_beschluesse/inhalte/5723.htm https://www.burhoff.de/asp_weitere_beschluesse/inhalte/5723.... (in German)

dontlaugh 4y ago
Which would have never happened if the car had normal physical controls for that function. Mine has a little rocker on the wiper stalk.
- epistasis 4y ago
  If you know ahead of time how to do it. If you are in a new car, discovering which of 12 different switches, knobs, and dials adjusts the wiper speed is somewhat baffling. I always spend 5 minutes in a new rental car trying to memorize how to do this, but if it's been a couple days since I rented the car and I'm trying to do it for the first time, it is not something that I try to attempt to adjust while still on the road.
  - dontlaugh 4y ago
    Sure. But for physical controls it's generally easy to discover as well. Indeed it only takes a few minutes in an unfamiliar car, after which it's easy to use the controls with at most a passing glance.
ClumsyPilot 4y ago
The judgement should have been against tesla, not the customer. Wipers are essential and should not require fiddling
- phpisthebest 4y ago
  Sounds like the driver was attempting to adjust non-critical features of wipers not turning them off and on We should be very careful not to include the kitchen sink in with "essential" items. Turning the wipers off and on, is critical, adjusting delay timings is not
  - Aeolun 4y ago
    Depends on how hard the rain is pouring down.
  - kurisufag 4y ago
    my 2003 Honda Accord allows you to change wiper interval the same way you enable/disable it -- moving the right-hand stick a notch. setting it to a high speed will fuck up the wipers when there is little rain, a /low/ speed will be useless when there is appreciable rain, and when driving you often move from one to another.
  - randallsquared 4y ago
    Shortening a delay timing has the same effect as turning the wiper on in some rain conditions.
    - naravara 4y ago
      I can't help but feel like we've made a mistake by concentrating so many of the people who design our standard software UX patterns in California. From Tesla designing car interfaces that don't understand how wipers need to work to Apple designing weather apps that don't clearly communicate wind chill to smartphones that require use of the touchscreen to answer a phone call rendering it impossible to answer while wearing gloves. It's like they only understand the concept of weather from TV shows set in New York.
      - martyvis 4y ago
        This is comedy gold!
galangalalgol 4y ago
I didn't believe it could be that nad, but I looked up the video at Tesla and you really have to go to the touchscreen to speed up the wiper. That should absolutely be illegal. Does it have some autosense feature so that you usually don't have to ise it?
- zaroth 4y ago
  It does have an auto mode. But also, you can now adjust wiper speed / interval on the steering wheel in a Tesla without using the touchscreen. Feature was actually added a just a few weeks ago in a software update.
  - martyvis 4y ago
    I'm sure it's the type of thing in an Elon meeting he would say "Surely we can think of a solution better than relying on drivers to provide meaningful input to the desired outcome?"
    - zaroth 4y ago
      Surely the ideal is the wiper is always moving at the perfectly desired speed and interval without any human intervention required.
      - Lio 4y ago
        That's the UX designer's trap. Yes, in theory it would be best to have the perfect speed without intervention but there isn't one perfect speed for the conditions. The speed the driver wants changes from driver to driver and might depend not just on how much rain is coming down but on the amount of traffic on the road, proximity to pedestrians, eye sight and time of day and any number of other factors. It's always going to be better to have an automatic system that can be tweaked by the driver because everyone is different. The more easily the driver can do that without thinking the better.
  - vel0city 4y ago
    Does changing the speed using the wheel require either knowing a menu layout or looking at a screen to know what the wheel control is actually controlling at the moment?

dontlaugh 4y ago

Which would have never happened if the car had normal physical controls for that function. Mine has a little rocker on the wiper stalk.

epistasis 4y ago
If you know ahead of time how to do it. If you are in a new car, discovering which of 12 different switches, knobs, and dials adjusts the wiper speed is somewhat baffling. I always spend 5 minutes in a new rental car trying to memorize how to do this, but if it's been a couple days since I rented the car and I'm trying to do it for the first time, it is not something that I try to attempt to adjust while still on the road.
- dontlaugh 4y ago
  Sure. But for physical controls it's generally easy to discover as well. Indeed it only takes a few minutes in an unfamiliar car, after which it's easy to use the controls with at most a passing glance.

ClumsyPilot 4y ago

The judgement should have been against tesla, not the customer. Wipers are essential and should not require fiddling

phpisthebest 4y ago
Sounds like the driver was attempting to adjust non-critical features of wipers not turning them off and on We should be very careful not to include the kitchen sink in with "essential" items. Turning the wipers off and on, is critical, adjusting delay timings is not
- Aeolun 4y ago
  Depends on how hard the rain is pouring down.
- kurisufag 4y ago
  my 2003 Honda Accord allows you to change wiper interval the same way you enable/disable it -- moving the right-hand stick a notch. setting it to a high speed will fuck up the wipers when there is little rain, a /low/ speed will be useless when there is appreciable rain, and when driving you often move from one to another.
- randallsquared 4y ago
  Shortening a delay timing has the same effect as turning the wiper on in some rain conditions.
  - naravara 4y ago
    I can't help but feel like we've made a mistake by concentrating so many of the people who design our standard software UX patterns in California. From Tesla designing car interfaces that don't understand how wipers need to work to Apple designing weather apps that don't clearly communicate wind chill to smartphones that require use of the touchscreen to answer a phone call rendering it impossible to answer while wearing gloves. It's like they only understand the concept of weather from TV shows set in New York.
    - martyvis 4y ago
      This is comedy gold!

galangalalgol 4y ago

I didn't believe it could be that nad, but I looked up the video at Tesla and you really have to go to the touchscreen to speed up the wiper. That should absolutely be illegal. Does it have some autosense feature so that you usually don't have to ise it?

zaroth 4y ago
It does have an auto mode. But also, you can now adjust wiper speed / interval on the steering wheel in a Tesla without using the touchscreen. Feature was actually added a just a few weeks ago in a software update.
- martyvis 4y ago
  I'm sure it's the type of thing in an Elon meeting he would say "Surely we can think of a solution better than relying on drivers to provide meaningful input to the desired outcome?"
  - zaroth 4y ago
    Surely the ideal is the wiper is always moving at the perfectly desired speed and interval without any human intervention required.
    - Lio 4y ago
      That's the UX designer's trap. Yes, in theory it would be best to have the perfect speed without intervention but there isn't one perfect speed for the conditions. The speed the driver wants changes from driver to driver and might depend not just on how much rain is coming down but on the amount of traffic on the road, proximity to pedestrians, eye sight and time of day and any number of other factors. It's always going to be better to have an automatic system that can be tweaked by the driver because everyone is different. The more easily the driver can do that without thinking the better.
- vel0city 4y ago
  Does changing the speed using the wheel require either knowing a menu layout or looking at a screen to know what the wheel control is actually controlling at the moment?