4 ms·

Imagine an iPod-like scrubwheel positioned so that your thumb can scroll while your hands are at 10 and 2.

by derefr 4y ago

gonzo41 4y ago
Imagine paying attention to the road and not needing to look at radio to be able to do everything.
ninkendo 4y ago
It’s the distraction of having to pay attention to where you are in the UI navigation that sucks… tactile buttons on the wheel wouldn’t fix this if you only get to use them as a proxy for the same UI navigation. Physical buttons for common car features should be non-modal and not context dependent, and in a consistent location you can memorize without looking. You should be able to pause the music without having to navigate to some UI submenu first. Same with climate control, volume, etc.
midoridensha 4y ago
Which is useless when you put your hands at 9 and 3 like you're supposed to.
- defrost 4y ago
  ... with the caveat that > 10 and 2 o’clock is no longer recommended because it can be dangerous in vehicles with smaller steering wheels and equipped with airbags. (Source: https://driving-tests.org/beginner-drivers/how-to-hold-a-steering-wheel/ https://driving-tests.org/beginner-drivers/how-to-hold-a-ste...) and the implication that otherwise the trad 10 and 2 position recommended for decades is still 100% A-OK.
  - imafish 4y ago
    Not sure about GP - but in my country they teach the 9 and 3 position when you take your license. I’ve always thought 10 and 2 was an American thing.
    - defrost 4y ago
      I'm in Australia (and wrote the comment above yours) and was taught to drive (late 1970s) using a higher hand position - "ten and two" but without that phrasing. Also to always have two hands on the wheel, sliding it through one hand by a solid grip of the other .. all centred about off bitumen rough road driving with unexpected dips, cambers, holes that might catch you by surprise. I suspect the higher hand position gives a greater advantage in older vehicles with direct under geared mechanical steering as there's more travel from the hand griping position downwards around the arc before "running out of travel" and having to move that hand .. ie better control on bad roads with odd cambers etc.
      - seb1204 4y ago
        As a fellow Australian I can agree and see some good points in this. However I also think it no longer applies to post 2020 cars in a city/urban environment.
    - FactualActuals 4y ago
      When I was in driver's ed in high school in America, there was a push to teach 8 and 4. As far as I am aware, teaching students 10 and 2 has long since been phased out supposedly due to the increase of arm injuries in the event of an accident. 9 and 3 wasn't recommended to us because if your air bag deploys, your right arm will smash into your passenger or the passenger air bag. 8 and 4 is supposed to be safer but it comes with the caveat that you have to steer your car a specific way. That being said, I prefer 9 and 3 and it's hard to find drivers in America that don't use this position as their default.
      - midoridensha 4y ago
        9 & 3 is the best for control, but you're right, it's worse in case the airbag deploys. 10 & 2, I imagine, is even worse, since you always have an arm in front of the airbag in that case, so your arm might be propelled into your face if it goes off. 8 & 4 helps, but seems pretty bad for control, but on highway trips it's more relaxing I think.
  - jjav 4y ago
    9 & 3 is superior if you think about it, as it is symmetrical and thus gives you the optimal control regardless of how much you need to turn either way. It's what we teach for both street car control and track performance driving (been a performance driving instructor for over 20 years). That said, if someone absolutely has their heart set on 10 & 2, that is still better than 98% of drivers out there with random single hand steering placement, so it's ok. The absolute worst is single handed cross placement (e.g. right hand on 10'oclock). Please never do that, you stand zero chance of being able to do a controlled quick correction or emergency manouver if you have to.

Imagine an iPod-like scrubwheel positioned so that your thumb can scroll while your hands are at 10 and 2.

by derefr 4y ago

Imagine an iPod-like scrubwheel positioned so that your thumb can scroll while your hands are at 10 and 2.

gonzo41 4y ago

Imagine paying attention to the road and not needing to look at radio to be able to do everything.

ninkendo 4y ago

It’s the distraction of having to pay attention to where you are in the UI navigation that sucks… tactile buttons on the wheel wouldn’t fix this if you only get to use them as a proxy for the same UI navigation. Physical buttons for common car features should be non-modal and not context dependent, and in a consistent location you can memorize without looking. You should be able to pause the music without having to navigate to some UI submenu first. Same with climate control, volume, etc.

midoridensha 4y ago

Which is useless when you put your hands at 9 and 3 like you're supposed to.

defrost 4y ago
... with the caveat that > 10 and 2 o’clock is no longer recommended because it can be dangerous in vehicles with smaller steering wheels and equipped with airbags. (Source: https://driving-tests.org/beginner-drivers/how-to-hold-a-steering-wheel/ https://driving-tests.org/beginner-drivers/how-to-hold-a-ste...) and the implication that otherwise the trad 10 and 2 position recommended for decades is still 100% A-OK.
- imafish 4y ago
  Not sure about GP - but in my country they teach the 9 and 3 position when you take your license. I’ve always thought 10 and 2 was an American thing.
  - defrost 4y ago
    I'm in Australia (and wrote the comment above yours) and was taught to drive (late 1970s) using a higher hand position - "ten and two" but without that phrasing. Also to always have two hands on the wheel, sliding it through one hand by a solid grip of the other .. all centred about off bitumen rough road driving with unexpected dips, cambers, holes that might catch you by surprise. I suspect the higher hand position gives a greater advantage in older vehicles with direct under geared mechanical steering as there's more travel from the hand griping position downwards around the arc before "running out of travel" and having to move that hand .. ie better control on bad roads with odd cambers etc.
    - seb1204 4y ago
      As a fellow Australian I can agree and see some good points in this. However I also think it no longer applies to post 2020 cars in a city/urban environment.
  - FactualActuals 4y ago
    When I was in driver's ed in high school in America, there was a push to teach 8 and 4. As far as I am aware, teaching students 10 and 2 has long since been phased out supposedly due to the increase of arm injuries in the event of an accident. 9 and 3 wasn't recommended to us because if your air bag deploys, your right arm will smash into your passenger or the passenger air bag. 8 and 4 is supposed to be safer but it comes with the caveat that you have to steer your car a specific way. That being said, I prefer 9 and 3 and it's hard to find drivers in America that don't use this position as their default.
    - midoridensha 4y ago
      9 & 3 is the best for control, but you're right, it's worse in case the airbag deploys. 10 & 2, I imagine, is even worse, since you always have an arm in front of the airbag in that case, so your arm might be propelled into your face if it goes off. 8 & 4 helps, but seems pretty bad for control, but on highway trips it's more relaxing I think.
- jjav 4y ago
  9 & 3 is superior if you think about it, as it is symmetrical and thus gives you the optimal control regardless of how much you need to turn either way. It's what we teach for both street car control and track performance driving (been a performance driving instructor for over 20 years). That said, if someone absolutely has their heart set on 10 & 2, that is still better than 98% of drivers out there with random single hand steering placement, so it's ok. The absolute worst is single handed cross placement (e.g. right hand on 10'oclock). Please never do that, you stand zero chance of being able to do a controlled quick correction or emergency manouver if you have to.