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>France give plenty of incentives for couples to have children,I think this year the national budget is more than 5 billion plenty of incentives for couples to

>France give plenty of incentives for couples to have children,I think this year the national budget is more than 5 billion plenty of incentives for couples to have children when you are poor yes. when you are in the middle class you'll get some but not all. for instance a first child would get you 180 euros per month (if your household earns less than 36k otherwise you get 0 and still pay high tax unlike poor people). diapers and milk for a month is already way more than that especially with inflated prices of today. > And if you're rich enough to not qualify for direct help, the tax breaks your child provides you is greater than the maximum amount the poorest families get for a child so. let's do france. the tax break is of a maximum of 1500 euros for a child. I don't know if you have children but I guarantee this costs much more than that so lets take the best example that will fit your narrative: someone who earns 35k household in france. he'll get 2160 euros/year + tax rebate of 700 euros. that will be the government help he would get. I round it to 3k euros a year for a child... now if your household earns 40k or more you'll get 700 euros rebate a year. and if you earn much more the max is 1500euros from tax rebate. knowing that rich people send their kids to expensive childcare, schools, buy more expensive goods. so for lower income families and people in midle class below 35k youll get 3k/year. knowing you need to move to a bigger apartment and seeing the cost of cities like paris your 3k euros are gone. so yeah. it is not worth it financially to have a child in France. EXCEPT if you are really poor and unemployed. compare that to korea who now gives 755$ per month per child and has a similar economy size/salaries

orwin 3y ago
>> for instance a first child would get you 180 euros per month (if your household earns less than 36k otherwise you get 0 and still pay high tax unlike poor people) No, you have the right amount (i actually think it's a bit less for young children, i have to check but 180 should be the money you get for kids over 12 or something like that), but the "tranche 1" is for taxable income under 71k, not 36k. Then, if your taxable income is under 100k (a bit less i think), you get half the anount (so 90), and over 100k you get half again (so 45). But you still get money, even if you are a high earner. > the tax break is of a maximum of 1500 euros for a child. I don't know if you have children but I guarantee this costs much more than that Gp said that it was only for the poor, i said it was not. I totally agree it's not enough. > and if you earn much more the max is 1500euros from tax rebate. knowing that rich people send their kids to expensive childcare, schools, buy more expensive goods. No, the daycare, even private ones, are "conventionné", and the CAF (and municipality) is paying at least half the cost (in some area it's 90%, but most likely it's 60%). If you're rich enough, ou can pay a baby-sitter, and half their salary is another tax-break. It's the same for the school. Unless you send them to unsanctionned school (and this is your right, but you cannot complain), the state is paying the teachers, the municipailty the sport and probably the 90% of the bus. If you're poor enough, sport is free, museums are free, music school is free (and obviously school "cost" (200 euros) is taking care of by the CAF). Free meals too (i think it was like 70 euros for 31 * 5 meals until my 14 anniversary). Ah, and Youth camps are mostly free too! (but limited access, and defunded in the past ten years). 100 euros vacations in the Alps, on the azure coast, or kayaking down a river, for two weeks. Good memories. Anyway, the subject was that EU was against natalist politics, i think we can say France have a natalist politics (less and less funded, true), that my familly benefited from, so GP was wrong. The details do not really matter.

orwin 3y ago

>> for instance a first child would get you 180 euros per month (if your household earns less than 36k otherwise you get 0 and still pay high tax unlike poor people) No, you have the right amount (i actually think it's a bit less for young children, i have to check but 180 should be the money you get for kids over 12 or something like that), but the "tranche 1" is for taxable income under 71k, not 36k. Then, if your taxable income is under 100k (a bit less i think), you get half the anount (so 90), and over 100k you get half again (so 45). But you still get money, even if you are a high earner. > the tax break is of a maximum of 1500 euros for a child. I don't know if you have children but I guarantee this costs much more than that Gp said that it was only for the poor, i said it was not. I totally agree it's not enough. > and if you earn much more the max is 1500euros from tax rebate. knowing that rich people send their kids to expensive childcare, schools, buy more expensive goods. No, the daycare, even private ones, are "conventionné", and the CAF (and municipality) is paying at least half the cost (in some area it's 90%, but most likely it's 60%). If you're rich enough, ou can pay a baby-sitter, and half their salary is another tax-break. It's the same for the school. Unless you send them to unsanctionned school (and this is your right, but you cannot complain), the state is paying the teachers, the municipailty the sport and probably the 90% of the bus. If you're poor enough, sport is free, museums are free, music school is free (and obviously school "cost" (200 euros) is taking care of by the CAF). Free meals too (i think it was like 70 euros for 31 * 5 meals until my 14 anniversary). Ah, and Youth camps are mostly free too! (but limited access, and defunded in the past ten years). 100 euros vacations in the Alps, on the azure coast, or kayaking down a river, for two weeks. Good memories. Anyway, the subject was that EU was against natalist politics, i think we can say France have a natalist politics (less and less funded, true), that my familly benefited from, so GP was wrong. The details do not really matter.