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I don’t know if this outcome is good for end users but happy to see Tim Sweeney lose.

mproud 3y ago
I’m surprised more people aren’t talking about Epic here. They basically are whining and complaining they have to pay the 30% fee for making more than $1 million sales, even though other stores are already doing that. To me, this was never about consumer freedom. This was about lost revenue to Epic.
- cubefox 3y ago
  This is like saying the sky is green because Hitler said the sky is blue.
  - MBCook 3y ago
    (Avoiding Godwin…) Tons of people here hate Apple, but the GP’s point that Epic is not a very sympathetic defendant is very true. They’re not some small developer losing 30% that could help feed their family, they’re a huge company that is (arguably) exploiting children. They weren’t hurt by a sudden Apple price hike, they agreed to all the terms fairly then unilaterally said “screw you, my money!” In about the most blatant way possible. And it’s pretty obvious this isn’t because they want to save 30%, it’s because they want to be the store charging others a big percentage and taking game sales revenue. The moment they win this they would have launched suits against the console makers to try to get their way there too. Epic clearly only cared about themselves and only wrapped themselves in the cloak of “help all developers” for PR purposes. I suspect a lot of people don’t care one bit about Epic. They just happen to be the name on the plaintiff’s chair.
    - cubefox 3y ago
      My point was that somebody not being sympathetic doesn't mean they are wrong. There are strong arguments to the effect that Apple being able to force (what is effectively) a 30% tax through AppStore exclusivity is misusing their market power. This argument doesn't depend in any way on whether Epic has a clean slate, just as the sky doesn't get any less blue just because Hi...Trump said it was blue.
- pb7 3y ago
  Considering Epic is one of the most exploitative companies that just got slapped with a massive judgment for their dark patterns involving children, of course it was never about consumer freedom for them.
- somenameforme 3y ago
  And users. Epic was passing a 20% discount on to users, which was still profitable because it was less than the 30% Apple demands. The big issue is Apple is the only platform that's completely locked down. If Fortnite was kicked off of the Google Play store it'd be no big deal since they could simply tell users how to install it. On PC, it's not even offered on Steam. It's only Apple where getting kicked off the App Store is a death sentence, because they make it practically impossible for their users to install software otherwise. This is almost certainly why Apple is set to start allowing sideloading. Regardless of how this case turns out, Apple obviously knows they're walking on very thin ice over something really quite silly. I expect on Android > 99% of installs are still driven by the App Store. Sideloading is a liberty very few will take advantage of, so long as your main terms for developers are reasonably fair.
  - scarface74 3y ago
    > The big issue is Apple is the only platform that's completely locked down As long as you don’t include consoles who Epic didn’t go after.

I’m surprised more people aren’t talking about Epic here. They basically are whining and complaining they have to pay the 30% fee for making more than $1 million sales, even though other stores are already doing that. To me, this was never about consumer freedom. This was about lost revenue to Epic.

cubefox 3y ago
This is like saying the sky is green because Hitler said the sky is blue.
- MBCook 3y ago
  (Avoiding Godwin…) Tons of people here hate Apple, but the GP’s point that Epic is not a very sympathetic defendant is very true. They’re not some small developer losing 30% that could help feed their family, they’re a huge company that is (arguably) exploiting children. They weren’t hurt by a sudden Apple price hike, they agreed to all the terms fairly then unilaterally said “screw you, my money!” In about the most blatant way possible. And it’s pretty obvious this isn’t because they want to save 30%, it’s because they want to be the store charging others a big percentage and taking game sales revenue. The moment they win this they would have launched suits against the console makers to try to get their way there too. Epic clearly only cared about themselves and only wrapped themselves in the cloak of “help all developers” for PR purposes. I suspect a lot of people don’t care one bit about Epic. They just happen to be the name on the plaintiff’s chair.
  - cubefox 3y ago
    My point was that somebody not being sympathetic doesn't mean they are wrong. There are strong arguments to the effect that Apple being able to force (what is effectively) a 30% tax through AppStore exclusivity is misusing their market power. This argument doesn't depend in any way on whether Epic has a clean slate, just as the sky doesn't get any less blue just because Hi...Trump said it was blue.
pb7 3y ago
Considering Epic is one of the most exploitative companies that just got slapped with a massive judgment for their dark patterns involving children, of course it was never about consumer freedom for them.
somenameforme 3y ago
And users. Epic was passing a 20% discount on to users, which was still profitable because it was less than the 30% Apple demands. The big issue is Apple is the only platform that's completely locked down. If Fortnite was kicked off of the Google Play store it'd be no big deal since they could simply tell users how to install it. On PC, it's not even offered on Steam. It's only Apple where getting kicked off the App Store is a death sentence, because they make it practically impossible for their users to install software otherwise. This is almost certainly why Apple is set to start allowing sideloading. Regardless of how this case turns out, Apple obviously knows they're walking on very thin ice over something really quite silly. I expect on Android > 99% of installs are still driven by the App Store. Sideloading is a liberty very few will take advantage of, so long as your main terms for developers are reasonably fair.
- scarface74 3y ago
  > The big issue is Apple is the only platform that's completely locked down As long as you don’t include consoles who Epic didn’t go after.