4 ms·

The point is that Steam itself is DRM. Even if game itself can work standalone you can't install or update it without Steam client. This is the difference betwe

by SXX 4y ago

The point is that Steam itself is DRM. Even if game itself can work standalone you can't install or update it without Steam client. This is the difference between Steam and GOG.

agentgumshoe 4y ago
What is the Steam client doing that makes it a problem?
- SXX 4y ago
  Like making me login again into Steam at random for whatever reason Valve come up with? I guess there was bug on older macOS where it asked me for password every single time I restarted Steam. Now this is fixed though. There is offline mode, but it's unreliable. I know that some games might run without Steam, but it's not comfortable at all. And yeah It's not a problem. It's just a difference between Steam and DRM-free platforms like GOG.
  - autoexec 4y ago
    > There is offline mode, but it's unreliable. Even when it's working, eventually it stops working and you'll be forced to connect to the internet. I learned this the hard way once. When you're already dealing with the fact that you don't have internet access, having your access to your single player offline games taken from you is just cruel!
- t0bia_s 4y ago
  It's like man in middle that doesn't have to be there. I'm buying games exclusively on GoG because DRM free policy.
  - thaumasiotes 4y ago
    GoG doesn't have a DRM-free policy. DRM is allowed. Has been for quite a while.
    - t0bia_s 4y ago
      GoG galaxy is not must like Steam.
      - thaumasiotes 4y ago
        That depends what you're trying to do.
      - debugnik 4y ago
        Galaxy also has an SDK that devs can choose to require for their game; if they don't it's for lack of adoption. Their docs do admittedly ask devs to make integration optional for the user, but their definition of optional includes "no multiplayer" as well.
        Wowfunhappy 4y ago
        > but their definition of optional includes "no multiplayer" as well. I don't think this is ideal by any means, but I do think it's a reasonable compromise. For better or worse, many/most modern multiplayer games are architected to use a centralized, company-run software. The server software is not built to be deployed by end-users, and getting it to that state would involve very significant engineering effort. It's just not a reasonable ask.
      - flohofwoe 4y ago
        Steam also allows DRM free games, it's probably just not very popular with game developers. One advantage of GoG is that they seem to actually care that old games on their store are actually working on new Windows versions, while on Steam it's more or less a gamble (at least you can return broken games though).
        depressedpanda 4y ago
        In some ways I think we've reached a point where it's easier to run old Windows games on Linux via Wine/Proton, than on the latest version of Windows.
  - maccard 4y ago
    It provides a storefront, authentication, distribution and an updater, at least. That is valuable to a lot of games.
    - t0bia_s 4y ago
      That is service. Not DRM.
- IIsi50MHz 4y ago
  I think Steam requires that the Steam client connect to Steamservers at least once every two weeks, to validate your licenses.
DRW_ 4y ago
How is it different than having to use GOG's website to install a purchase you made or download an updated version? Developers on Steam can ship their own update mechanism separate from Steam if they want to. I feel like people don't actually know the policies of Steam and how it mostly just leaves it up to the developer, for better or worse. If Steam decided to block developers from being able to do DRM, it wouldn't mean all the games would go DRM free, it'd mean the games wouldn't go on Steam, like they don't go on GOG - they'd go to their own launchers. As much as people like to believe Steam has a monopoly, publishers have been able to bring out their own launchers reasonably successfully. People will go to their launchers if that's the only way to get anticipated games. Some of the most successful games started and remained outside of Steam. The industry would look significantly different if Steam had an actual monopoly.
- johnfonesca 4y ago
  >How is it different than having to use GOG's website to install a purchase you made or download an updated version? You buy game on GOG, dowload the installers, move it to a external HDD and you can install that game forever. This is the only thing that is actually DRM free. Needless to say, you can't to that with ANY other store (be it Steam, Epic etc). All of them requires you to install their crap to access your bought games and they don't give you full offline installers.
  - badsectoracula 4y ago
    > Needless to say, you can't to that with ANY other store (be it Steam, Epic etc). All of them requires you to install their crap to access your bought games and they don't give you full offline installers. You don't get an installer but many games are DRM-free on Steam so you can just zip up the directory under steamapps/common and you're good to go. I have ~180 games on my storage HDD from Steam. I always try to have an offline copy of every game i buy (and i try to buy them from "proper" DRM-free stores than Steam where possible) and while it'd be nice if there was an offline installer, it isn't really much of an issue in practice. The biggest issue with Steam is that you don't know if a game is DRM-free or not before buying it and trying to figure out yourself (which is why i prefer other stores like Zoom Platform and GOG in the first place).

by SXX 4y ago

The point is that Steam itself is DRM. Even if game itself can work standalone you can't install or update it without Steam client. This is the difference between Steam and GOG.

agentgumshoe 4y ago

What is the Steam client doing that makes it a problem?

SXX 4y ago
Like making me login again into Steam at random for whatever reason Valve come up with? I guess there was bug on older macOS where it asked me for password every single time I restarted Steam. Now this is fixed though. There is offline mode, but it's unreliable. I know that some games might run without Steam, but it's not comfortable at all. And yeah It's not a problem. It's just a difference between Steam and DRM-free platforms like GOG.
- autoexec 4y ago
  > There is offline mode, but it's unreliable. Even when it's working, eventually it stops working and you'll be forced to connect to the internet. I learned this the hard way once. When you're already dealing with the fact that you don't have internet access, having your access to your single player offline games taken from you is just cruel!
t0bia_s 4y ago
It's like man in middle that doesn't have to be there. I'm buying games exclusively on GoG because DRM free policy.
- thaumasiotes 4y ago
  GoG doesn't have a DRM-free policy. DRM is allowed. Has been for quite a while.
  - t0bia_s 4y ago
    GoG galaxy is not must like Steam.
    - thaumasiotes 4y ago
      That depends what you're trying to do.
    - debugnik 4y ago
      Galaxy also has an SDK that devs can choose to require for their game; if they don't it's for lack of adoption. Their docs do admittedly ask devs to make integration optional for the user, but their definition of optional includes "no multiplayer" as well.
      - Wowfunhappy 4y ago
        > but their definition of optional includes "no multiplayer" as well. I don't think this is ideal by any means, but I do think it's a reasonable compromise. For better or worse, many/most modern multiplayer games are architected to use a centralized, company-run software. The server software is not built to be deployed by end-users, and getting it to that state would involve very significant engineering effort. It's just not a reasonable ask.
    - flohofwoe 4y ago
      Steam also allows DRM free games, it's probably just not very popular with game developers. One advantage of GoG is that they seem to actually care that old games on their store are actually working on new Windows versions, while on Steam it's more or less a gamble (at least you can return broken games though).
      - depressedpanda 4y ago
        In some ways I think we've reached a point where it's easier to run old Windows games on Linux via Wine/Proton, than on the latest version of Windows.
- maccard 4y ago
  It provides a storefront, authentication, distribution and an updater, at least. That is valuable to a lot of games.
  - t0bia_s 4y ago
    That is service. Not DRM.
IIsi50MHz 4y ago
I think Steam requires that the Steam client connect to Steamservers at least once every two weeks, to validate your licenses.

DRW_ 4y ago

How is it different than having to use GOG's website to install a purchase you made or download an updated version? Developers on Steam can ship their own update mechanism separate from Steam if they want to. I feel like people don't actually know the policies of Steam and how it mostly just leaves it up to the developer, for better or worse. If Steam decided to block developers from being able to do DRM, it wouldn't mean all the games would go DRM free, it'd mean the games wouldn't go on Steam, like they don't go on GOG - they'd go to their own launchers. As much as people like to believe Steam has a monopoly, publishers have been able to bring out their own launchers reasonably successfully. People will go to their launchers if that's the only way to get anticipated games. Some of the most successful games started and remained outside of Steam. The industry would look significantly different if Steam had an actual monopoly.

johnfonesca 4y ago
>How is it different than having to use GOG's website to install a purchase you made or download an updated version? You buy game on GOG, dowload the installers, move it to a external HDD and you can install that game forever. This is the only thing that is actually DRM free. Needless to say, you can't to that with ANY other store (be it Steam, Epic etc). All of them requires you to install their crap to access your bought games and they don't give you full offline installers.
- badsectoracula 4y ago
  > Needless to say, you can't to that with ANY other store (be it Steam, Epic etc). All of them requires you to install their crap to access your bought games and they don't give you full offline installers. You don't get an installer but many games are DRM-free on Steam so you can just zip up the directory under steamapps/common and you're good to go. I have ~180 games on my storage HDD from Steam. I always try to have an offline copy of every game i buy (and i try to buy them from "proper" DRM-free stores than Steam where possible) and while it'd be nice if there was an offline installer, it isn't really much of an issue in practice. The biggest issue with Steam is that you don't know if a game is DRM-free or not before buying it and trying to figure out yourself (which is why i prefer other stores like Zoom Platform and GOG in the first place).