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> Note that this has been the case for an incredibly long time, under the common travel area. That's correct. > However, I suspect that this may change at som

> Note that this has been the case for an incredibly long time, under the common travel area. That's correct. > However, I suspect that this may change at some point, once the UK introduces their ESTA like scheme. No. It won't. That would violate the Good Friday Agreement.

disgruntledphd2 4y ago
For non Irish/UK citizens there will 100% be checks for passports and visa on ferries at the very least.
- scott_w 4y ago
  No, there simply won't. Your scenario makes no sense whatsoever. How do you "only" check non-UK/Irish citizens? Do you listen for their accent? Do you go by skin colour? There will be no checks between Belfast/Stranraer just as there are no checks between Carlisle/Glasgow.
  - disgruntledphd2 4y ago
    Well either the UK give up their current visa requirements (the proposed ESTA analogy) or there will have to be. Here's an Irish Times article about the issue: https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/2023/03/09/uk-amends-visa-waiver-plans-for-non-irish-eu-citizens-crossing-border/ https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/2023/03/09/uk-amends-vis... Looks like they've fixed the EU citizens living in Ireland crossing the border for work issue, thankfully.
    - scott_w 4y ago
      This was always going to be dropped because anyone with a brain realised it was unworkable and stupid. The only evidence you’ve put forward contradicts what you say! You still haven’t answered a basic question: How does Border Force check the passports of only non-UK or Irish citizens?
      - disgruntledphd2 4y ago
        > This was always going to be dropped because anyone with a brain realised it was unworkable and stupid. I have felt that way and been proven wrong so many times since 2016 that I'm hesitant to be certain of this. I have no idea how they'll do it. The most sensible thing to do would be to rely on the current approach (i.e. passport/visa checks by hotels/hostels/employers). What I actually think will happen is zero enforcement till the Mail run a bunch of stories on it, and then everyone will get checked on the ferries.
        scott_w 4y ago
        Are you still waffling your nonsense on this thread? Let me be very clear: the government has balked at every single initiative that would violate the Good Friday Agreement, for good reason. They’re not about to suddenly change tack here. If the Government starting checking ferries from Belfast to Stranraer, unionists would start burning ports just like they did in 2021. You can’t provide evidence for any of your guesses because it doesn’t exist. I don’t know why you waste your time trying to continue the “debate.”
        disgruntledphd2 4y ago
        > Are you still waffling your nonsense on this thread? There is absolutely no need to get aggressive/annoyed. If you don't want to engage, then leave the thread. It's not like there'll be a red bubble reminding you about it. We're having a conversation about something that neither of us are certain about, thus there is no correct answer here. > Let me be very clear: the government has balked at every single initiative that would violate the Good Friday Agreement, for good reason. They’re not about to suddenly change tack here. Are we talking about the Irish government here? Cos I definitely remember the UK gov attempting to pass a whole bunch of stuff that would violate the GF/Belfast agreement since 2016. In fact, I believe that the Lords is the only reason they haven't. > If the Government starting checking ferries from Belfast to Stranraer, unionists would start burning ports just like they did in 2021. You can’t provide evidence for any of your guesses because it doesn’t exist. I don’t know why you waste your time trying to continue the “debate.” Perhaps, I personally wouldn't like to see it. However, how does immigration control work if they don't? If an Albanian/Polish person can go to Dublin, cross the border and then head to the UK on a ferry and work illegally, then ultimately the UK government will have to do something. I have no special insight into what they'll do, but I honestly wouldn't be surprised if it involved passport/ID checking. Lets remember that the UK government basically don't give a toss about NI, as evidenced by the last seven years post the Brexit vote.

disgruntledphd2 4y ago

For non Irish/UK citizens there will 100% be checks for passports and visa on ferries at the very least.

scott_w 4y ago
No, there simply won't. Your scenario makes no sense whatsoever. How do you "only" check non-UK/Irish citizens? Do you listen for their accent? Do you go by skin colour? There will be no checks between Belfast/Stranraer just as there are no checks between Carlisle/Glasgow.
- disgruntledphd2 4y ago
  Well either the UK give up their current visa requirements (the proposed ESTA analogy) or there will have to be. Here's an Irish Times article about the issue: https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/2023/03/09/uk-amends-visa-waiver-plans-for-non-irish-eu-citizens-crossing-border/ https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/2023/03/09/uk-amends-vis... Looks like they've fixed the EU citizens living in Ireland crossing the border for work issue, thankfully.
  - scott_w 4y ago
    This was always going to be dropped because anyone with a brain realised it was unworkable and stupid. The only evidence you’ve put forward contradicts what you say! You still haven’t answered a basic question: How does Border Force check the passports of only non-UK or Irish citizens?
    - disgruntledphd2 4y ago
      > This was always going to be dropped because anyone with a brain realised it was unworkable and stupid. I have felt that way and been proven wrong so many times since 2016 that I'm hesitant to be certain of this. I have no idea how they'll do it. The most sensible thing to do would be to rely on the current approach (i.e. passport/visa checks by hotels/hostels/employers). What I actually think will happen is zero enforcement till the Mail run a bunch of stories on it, and then everyone will get checked on the ferries.
      - scott_w 4y ago
        Are you still waffling your nonsense on this thread? Let me be very clear: the government has balked at every single initiative that would violate the Good Friday Agreement, for good reason. They’re not about to suddenly change tack here. If the Government starting checking ferries from Belfast to Stranraer, unionists would start burning ports just like they did in 2021. You can’t provide evidence for any of your guesses because it doesn’t exist. I don’t know why you waste your time trying to continue the “debate.”
        disgruntledphd2 4y ago
        > Are you still waffling your nonsense on this thread? There is absolutely no need to get aggressive/annoyed. If you don't want to engage, then leave the thread. It's not like there'll be a red bubble reminding you about it. We're having a conversation about something that neither of us are certain about, thus there is no correct answer here. > Let me be very clear: the government has balked at every single initiative that would violate the Good Friday Agreement, for good reason. They’re not about to suddenly change tack here. Are we talking about the Irish government here? Cos I definitely remember the UK gov attempting to pass a whole bunch of stuff that would violate the GF/Belfast agreement since 2016. In fact, I believe that the Lords is the only reason they haven't. > If the Government starting checking ferries from Belfast to Stranraer, unionists would start burning ports just like they did in 2021. You can’t provide evidence for any of your guesses because it doesn’t exist. I don’t know why you waste your time trying to continue the “debate.” Perhaps, I personally wouldn't like to see it. However, how does immigration control work if they don't? If an Albanian/Polish person can go to Dublin, cross the border and then head to the UK on a ferry and work illegally, then ultimately the UK government will have to do something. I have no special insight into what they'll do, but I honestly wouldn't be surprised if it involved passport/ID checking. Lets remember that the UK government basically don't give a toss about NI, as evidenced by the last seven years post the Brexit vote.