4 ms·

nobody can deny that the descendents of slavery have been dealt a terrible hand, but what makes you think that any and all animosity toward President Obama exis

nobody can deny that the descendents of slavery have been dealt a terrible hand, but what makes you think that any and all animosity toward President Obama existed specifically, solely because of the color of his skin? surely you don't believe that he was an otherwise objectively perfect President, such that the only criticism anyone could have of him was racially-motivated? what positive Change did he end up doing for American black people while in office for eight years, anyway? (am I being racist by asking this?) and how do you square all this with the hatred for his white successor, which was, objectively, several orders of magnitude greater? also, how do you square your thesis with the existence of black Republican politicians—surely anyone who was racially critical of Obama would also be equally racially critical of black elected officials in their own party?

simplotek 4y ago
> (...) what makes you think that any and all animosity toward President Obama existed specifically, solely because of the color of his skin? You picked an awfully disingenuous way of framing your question. Just because you can find someone who dislikes Obama because of some random reason that does not reject or refute the pervasiveness of racism as a factor in the vitriolic hatred directed at him. https://edition.cnn.com/2016/12/28/politics/carl-paladino-remarks-about-obamas-mistake/index.html https://edition.cnn.com/2016/12/28/politics/carl-paladino-re... https://time.com/4573554/michelle-obama-racism-first-lady/ https://time.com/4573554/michelle-obama-racism-first-lady/
- adamrezich 4y ago
  your source is one guy apologizing for racist remarks, and you're extrapolating that out to concur with the previous replier's assertion that this is an example of "the horrific hatred directed at Obama that's only really explained as racism"? to paraphrase you: just because you can find someone who dislikes Obama because of some racial reason, that does not prove the pervasiveness of racism as a factor in the vitriolic hatred directed at him. I thought by 2023 we could all be mature about this and agree that, sure, there was a nonzero amount of racist hate for President Obama during his presidency, yet the idea that, in general, negative sentiment toward him can be exclusively attributed to racism, is absurd. do you really believe that anything other than a tiny, statistically-insignificant minority of Americans in 2008–16 disapproved of their President based upon the color of his skin? do you really believe that anything other than a tiny, statistically-insignificant minority of Americans today, in 2023, are overtly racist toward black people based upon the color of their skin? (I also note that you chose to not respond to my assertion that Obama did not really do anything for black Americans specifically, during his two-term presidency. he was elected on the promise of Hope and Change, and while he gave plenty of the former, he utterly failed in executing on the latter. ditto for my assertion about Obama's successor.)
  - comfypotato 4y ago
    Can’t help but point out that the minority you pointed out twice is definitely not statistically insignificant. Blatant racism is rampant in the poorer areas of where I’m from. I’m in recovery, AA that is (known for a majority of lower-income folks) and I’ve been at hangouts where the majority of men non-ironically use the n word. It’s sad. Very much agree with you though that saying any/all dislike for Obama was because of race is absurd. Conspiracy-theory, flat-earth, not-worth-arguing absurd.
    - Glawen 4y ago
      > I’m in recovery, AA that is (known for a majority of lower-income folks) and I’ve been at hangouts where the majority of men non-ironically use the n word. It’s sad. That's how it is in lower income areas, whatever country. I grew up in a small village with lower income folks and that's how it was, you need to learn not being vehement about this. You cannot benchmark a policy based on stuff like this. I believe it is the exact same thing with folks "victims" of racism: they can say hideous stuff too, e.g antisemitism within Muslim community.
      - dsfyu404ed 4y ago
        >That's how it is in lower income areas, whatever country This. If you really wanna overhear some casual racism in the US learn to speak Spanish. And for the most part the people of all races that say these things aren't racist in that they believe in inherent superiority or anything. They're more critiquing culture that just so happens to follow (loosely, obviously we're using a broad brush here) race but in a way that isn't articulate and narrowly scoped enough to pass muster with the white collar crowd. They're basically shitting on other race groups in the same way that all the trades on a job site shit on each other. This kind of bring us full circle to the whole classism thing...
      - cwillu 4y ago
        “I spoke only as do all men in my land, and I would gladly learn better.”
    - 4y ago
ttfkam 4y ago
How do we square a former president of the Harvard Law Review and Constitutional Law professor who has been faithful to his wife and devoted and loving to his children? Who actually wrote most of his own speeches. Who was not born wealthy but through hard work and education made it to where he is today. An 8-year presidency where no one in his administration was indicted let alone convicted of a crime. Zero pictures and video with him partying with Epstein. Practicing Christian who went to church even when the cameras weren't rolling. (Got pejoratively called a Muslim regardless.) Compare him to… …a guy whose dad bought him through college at a school conveniently of the same name as a famous business school (Wharton) to make people believe he went to the famous one when he really went to the far less prestigious undergraduate. Professors on record calling him the dumbest student they've ever had. Born into wealth and every advantage. Cheated on every woman he married, including with a porn star he paid to have sex with when his youngest child was born. (The hush money came later.) Who took little to no part in raising any of his children. Ran Miss Teen USA pageant to (by his own admission) look at scantily clad underage girls including in the dressing room. Will throw anyone under the bus if it suits him. Bankrupted multiple casinos even while his dad was buying chips to keep him afloat. Siphoned money from multiple charities to the point that both he and his children are now legally forbidden to ever run a charity again. Multiple indictments and subsequent convictions in his administration including members of his cabinet. Mueller even wrote in so many words that the ONLY reason Trump wasn't indicted by the DOJ was because he was a sitting president. Faked his way through every hymn whenever he had a photo op in a church. And on and on. ----- You're asserting their main substantive differences and the relative hatred for them were their political parties? If Obama had done even a tenth of the stuff we can prove (not speculate) Trump had done, Obama would never have been elected as a senator let alone president. Hell, he'd be in prison. The ONLY reason Trump could get away with half the stuff he did was because he's white and rich. Black and rich would not have shielded him so effectively nor raised him to the highest levels of the GOP.

simplotek 4y ago

> (...) what makes you think that any and all animosity toward President Obama existed specifically, solely because of the color of his skin? You picked an awfully disingenuous way of framing your question. Just because you can find someone who dislikes Obama because of some random reason that does not reject or refute the pervasiveness of racism as a factor in the vitriolic hatred directed at him. https://edition.cnn.com/2016/12/28/politics/carl-paladino-remarks-about-obamas-mistake/index.html https://edition.cnn.com/2016/12/28/politics/carl-paladino-re... https://time.com/4573554/michelle-obama-racism-first-lady/ https://time.com/4573554/michelle-obama-racism-first-lady/

adamrezich 4y ago
your source is one guy apologizing for racist remarks, and you're extrapolating that out to concur with the previous replier's assertion that this is an example of "the horrific hatred directed at Obama that's only really explained as racism"? to paraphrase you: just because you can find someone who dislikes Obama because of some racial reason, that does not prove the pervasiveness of racism as a factor in the vitriolic hatred directed at him. I thought by 2023 we could all be mature about this and agree that, sure, there was a nonzero amount of racist hate for President Obama during his presidency, yet the idea that, in general, negative sentiment toward him can be exclusively attributed to racism, is absurd. do you really believe that anything other than a tiny, statistically-insignificant minority of Americans in 2008–16 disapproved of their President based upon the color of his skin? do you really believe that anything other than a tiny, statistically-insignificant minority of Americans today, in 2023, are overtly racist toward black people based upon the color of their skin? (I also note that you chose to not respond to my assertion that Obama did not really do anything for black Americans specifically, during his two-term presidency. he was elected on the promise of Hope and Change, and while he gave plenty of the former, he utterly failed in executing on the latter. ditto for my assertion about Obama's successor.)
- comfypotato 4y ago
  Can’t help but point out that the minority you pointed out twice is definitely not statistically insignificant. Blatant racism is rampant in the poorer areas of where I’m from. I’m in recovery, AA that is (known for a majority of lower-income folks) and I’ve been at hangouts where the majority of men non-ironically use the n word. It’s sad. Very much agree with you though that saying any/all dislike for Obama was because of race is absurd. Conspiracy-theory, flat-earth, not-worth-arguing absurd.
  - Glawen 4y ago
    > I’m in recovery, AA that is (known for a majority of lower-income folks) and I’ve been at hangouts where the majority of men non-ironically use the n word. It’s sad. That's how it is in lower income areas, whatever country. I grew up in a small village with lower income folks and that's how it was, you need to learn not being vehement about this. You cannot benchmark a policy based on stuff like this. I believe it is the exact same thing with folks "victims" of racism: they can say hideous stuff too, e.g antisemitism within Muslim community.
    - dsfyu404ed 4y ago
      >That's how it is in lower income areas, whatever country This. If you really wanna overhear some casual racism in the US learn to speak Spanish. And for the most part the people of all races that say these things aren't racist in that they believe in inherent superiority or anything. They're more critiquing culture that just so happens to follow (loosely, obviously we're using a broad brush here) race but in a way that isn't articulate and narrowly scoped enough to pass muster with the white collar crowd. They're basically shitting on other race groups in the same way that all the trades on a job site shit on each other. This kind of bring us full circle to the whole classism thing...
    - cwillu 4y ago
      “I spoke only as do all men in my land, and I would gladly learn better.”
  - 4y ago

ttfkam 4y ago

How do we square a former president of the Harvard Law Review and Constitutional Law professor who has been faithful to his wife and devoted and loving to his children? Who actually wrote most of his own speeches. Who was not born wealthy but through hard work and education made it to where he is today. An 8-year presidency where no one in his administration was indicted let alone convicted of a crime. Zero pictures and video with him partying with Epstein. Practicing Christian who went to church even when the cameras weren't rolling. (Got pejoratively called a Muslim regardless.) Compare him to… …a guy whose dad bought him through college at a school conveniently of the same name as a famous business school (Wharton) to make people believe he went to the famous one when he really went to the far less prestigious undergraduate. Professors on record calling him the dumbest student they've ever had. Born into wealth and every advantage. Cheated on every woman he married, including with a porn star he paid to have sex with when his youngest child was born. (The hush money came later.) Who took little to no part in raising any of his children. Ran Miss Teen USA pageant to (by his own admission) look at scantily clad underage girls including in the dressing room. Will throw anyone under the bus if it suits him. Bankrupted multiple casinos even while his dad was buying chips to keep him afloat. Siphoned money from multiple charities to the point that both he and his children are now legally forbidden to ever run a charity again. Multiple indictments and subsequent convictions in his administration including members of his cabinet. Mueller even wrote in so many words that the ONLY reason Trump wasn't indicted by the DOJ was because he was a sitting president. Faked his way through every hymn whenever he had a photo op in a church. And on and on. ----- You're asserting their main substantive differences and the relative hatred for them were their political parties? If Obama had done even a tenth of the stuff we can prove (not speculate) Trump had done, Obama would never have been elected as a senator let alone president. Hell, he'd be in prison. The ONLY reason Trump could get away with half the stuff he did was because he's white and rich. Black and rich would not have shielded him so effectively nor raised him to the highest levels of the GOP.