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I feel the same way about my 16' i7 from 2019... but I also have an 14' M1 Pro for work, and if I didn't already have that, I would have definitely upgraded. It

I feel the same way about my 16' i7 from 2019... but I also have an 14' M1 Pro for work, and if I didn't already have that, I would have definitely upgraded. It's just a much better machine, if nothing else from a battery life perspective. Twice as better, and that counts a lot for me.

trinsic2 4y ago
I can't understand why anyone would want to support a manufacturer that designs a configuration that has the storage an memory soldiered in.
- pulvinar 4y ago
  Might be because it’s the “soldering in” that boosts its performance. So if you can plan ahead you come out ahead.
  - jlokier 4y ago
    That's true for the memory (RAM), but not the storage (SSD). Socketed SSDs are just as fast and almost as light as soldered, and there is no good technical reason why they shouldn't be upgradable for a long time. I'm in the market for a new Mac. I'm currently using a late 2013 15-inch Retina as my trusty friend. If the M2 Max came with socketed SSD I'd buy it today with the 96GB RAM and max spec in every other regard, despite the price being nearly double what I paid for my current machine 9.5 years ago. But because the SSD is soldered on, expensive and non-upgradable, and I'm always running out of space, and I want to be able to work with some large models, databases and VMs, I need to plan ahead the next 5 years in terabytes. Ensuring enough storage headroom for potential future use takes the price to a level where it's a major commitment I'll have to stick with for years, so I decided to wait and see what comes out later this year instead. So count me as one of the potential M2 customers who was excited to get one, then after a long wait last year for the M2 MBPs to come out, and a long period of deciding which model to get after they came out, in the end decided to wait, with the unnecessarily soldered-in, non-upgradable SSDs being a factor in why. (I have some other doubts: When I tried in store, the keyboard on the M2 MBPs is not as nice to type on compared with the 2013 model, and the trackpad is annoyingly large, and prone to triggering tap-to-touch from my hands while typing, and click-to-touch is not my preference. But those aren't bad enough to affect my purchasing decision, as long as the M1/M2 processors are still well ahead of the rest.)
    - lotsofpulp 4y ago
      Does modularity increase size/weight? Increase in warranty fraud? More complexity so higher probability of breakage?
      - wtallis 4y ago
        I think the only real challenge to upgradable storage is dealing with broken power management that's widespread in consumer NVMe SSDs. The security, size and weight concerns all seem manageable, especially given that non-Apple laptops already commonly require the use of single-sided M.2 modules.
    - kofejnik 4y ago
      an external usb-c m2 enclosure is amazingly fast and only $20 or so
      - jlokier 4y ago
        Good point. That might be the way to go. Thanks for the suggestion. I hadn't thought of it, as older USB drives (ie. my experience, 2013 MBP) are much slower for large data than the internal storage, some of my work is storage I/O performance constrained, and I don't want to carry around yet another dongle. But the price differential vs Apple built-in and flexibility/upgradability, at current USB4 speeds makes a compelling case. (I read anout significant differences between M1 and M2 for some flavours of USB storage link speed, which might persuade me to opt for the M2 after all.)

trinsic2 4y ago

I can't understand why anyone would want to support a manufacturer that designs a configuration that has the storage an memory soldiered in.

pulvinar 4y ago
Might be because it’s the “soldering in” that boosts its performance. So if you can plan ahead you come out ahead.
- jlokier 4y ago
  That's true for the memory (RAM), but not the storage (SSD). Socketed SSDs are just as fast and almost as light as soldered, and there is no good technical reason why they shouldn't be upgradable for a long time. I'm in the market for a new Mac. I'm currently using a late 2013 15-inch Retina as my trusty friend. If the M2 Max came with socketed SSD I'd buy it today with the 96GB RAM and max spec in every other regard, despite the price being nearly double what I paid for my current machine 9.5 years ago. But because the SSD is soldered on, expensive and non-upgradable, and I'm always running out of space, and I want to be able to work with some large models, databases and VMs, I need to plan ahead the next 5 years in terabytes. Ensuring enough storage headroom for potential future use takes the price to a level where it's a major commitment I'll have to stick with for years, so I decided to wait and see what comes out later this year instead. So count me as one of the potential M2 customers who was excited to get one, then after a long wait last year for the M2 MBPs to come out, and a long period of deciding which model to get after they came out, in the end decided to wait, with the unnecessarily soldered-in, non-upgradable SSDs being a factor in why. (I have some other doubts: When I tried in store, the keyboard on the M2 MBPs is not as nice to type on compared with the 2013 model, and the trackpad is annoyingly large, and prone to triggering tap-to-touch from my hands while typing, and click-to-touch is not my preference. But those aren't bad enough to affect my purchasing decision, as long as the M1/M2 processors are still well ahead of the rest.)
  - lotsofpulp 4y ago
    Does modularity increase size/weight? Increase in warranty fraud? More complexity so higher probability of breakage?
    - wtallis 4y ago
      I think the only real challenge to upgradable storage is dealing with broken power management that's widespread in consumer NVMe SSDs. The security, size and weight concerns all seem manageable, especially given that non-Apple laptops already commonly require the use of single-sided M.2 modules.
  - kofejnik 4y ago
    an external usb-c m2 enclosure is amazingly fast and only $20 or so
    - jlokier 4y ago
      Good point. That might be the way to go. Thanks for the suggestion. I hadn't thought of it, as older USB drives (ie. my experience, 2013 MBP) are much slower for large data than the internal storage, some of my work is storage I/O performance constrained, and I don't want to carry around yet another dongle. But the price differential vs Apple built-in and flexibility/upgradability, at current USB4 speeds makes a compelling case. (I read anout significant differences between M1 and M2 for some flavours of USB storage link speed, which might persuade me to opt for the M2 after all.)