8 ms·

Dancing Plague of 1518

192 points by graderjs 4y ago

graderjs 4y ago
Also, from Britannica^0: In July 1518, a woman whose name was given as Frau (Mrs.) Troffea (or Trauffea) stepped into the street and began dancing. She seemed unable to stop, and she kept dancing until she collapsed from exhaustion. After resting, she resumed the compulsive frenzied activity. She continued this way for days, and within a week more than 30 other people were similarly afflicted. They kept going long past the point of injury. City authorities were alarmed by the ever-increasing number of dancers. The civic and religious leaders theorized that more dancing was the solution, and so they arranged for guildhalls for the dancers to gather in, musicians to accompany the dancing, and professional dancers to help the afflicted to continue dancing…” Hahaha ^0: https://www.britannica.com/event/dancing-plague-of-1518 https://www.britannica.com/event/dancing-plague-of-1518
- flangola7 4y ago
  Was it some kind of brain infection? What causes this?
  - mseepgood 4y ago
    Boredom and lack of fun in an uptight society.
  - jl6 4y ago
    The article gives two possible explanations (LSD-like food poisoning, and “mass psychogenic illness”). There’s a chance it could be an elaborate hoax, or misunderstanding.
  - HopenHeyHi 4y ago
    It was the dreaded Hildegard von Blingin'. Be warned on clicking yonder hyperlinks least ye be similarly afflicted! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRIfsFefatg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRIfsFefatg Varily they did try to summon a hero during those dark days: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nx-x_1lIXh4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nx-x_1lIXh4 But lo, some tried to escape by way of sea: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9eSnSBP1Po https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9eSnSBP1Po Some say this evil lasted as late as 1576: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e6LOWKVq5sQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e6LOWKVq5sQ
  - themodelplumber 4y ago
    One of the linked papers talks about involuntary trance and the capacity for such a phenomenon to spread through extant systemic stress or fear. We know humans can be captured or gripped by any number of involuntary phenomena, particularly when it becomes a social effect and in effect reduces individual conscious control in favor of the social locus. So that lens seems fairly valid on its face. This also took place during extraordinarily harsh times even for that particular point in history. There had been massive floods and damage to crops, with food prices soaring, in addition to newly-spreading syphilis. There was probably a fairly strong unconscious sense of loss of control in the first place.
    - DANmode 4y ago
      > There had been massive floods Hm. Mycotoxins?
  - HlessClaudesman 4y ago
    Cordyceps.
  - refurb 4y ago
    “The human brain is a hell of a drug.” The idea of mass psychogenic illness is pretty well known and even happens today. You’ll read about some school where a bad smell comes up, some kid faints and then suddenly the class is on their way to the hospital, only to find out there was no exposure.
- macrolocal 4y ago
  “I can bring whole cities to ruin And still have time to get a soft-shoe in”
  - teddyh 4y ago
    Quote from the TV series Buffy the Vampire Slayer, Season 6, episode 7, Once More, With Feeling (2001): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Once_More,_with_Feeling_(Buffy_the_Vampire_Slayer) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Once_More,_with_Feeling_(Buffy...
    - pcthrowaway 4y ago
      That was a phenomenal episode of television
      - tough 4y ago
        Yeah I kinda hate musicals and loved that one, so whimsical.
  - pantulis 4y ago
    "I bought Nero his very first fiddle!"
- afavour 4y ago
  > The civic and religious leaders theorized that more dancing was the solution Reminds me of those pushing for “herd immunity” at the beginning of the Covid outbreak!
jb1991 4y ago
Never underestimate the power of hysteria, which used to be a bonafide diagnosis but is a term now rarely used outside hyperbole.
- graderjs 4y ago
  Or accurately depending on the context: South Korea stampeded; flocking behavior online. We're driven by our base impulses, without thinking.
tanseydavid 4y ago
The original rave party! Dance 'til you drop (dead).
tylerjaywood 4y ago
I built https://chrono.quest https://chrono.quest as a fun way to discover weird or anachronistic events from history. If anyone knows of a good list of events like this, please let me know so I can add them!
- yaboy 4y ago
  [flagged]
  - junon 4y ago
    Yes these people from 1518 are definitely going to take offense to this person's side project.
- Laremere 4y ago
  I appear to be unable to drag the events. On chrome mobile.
- ocfnash 4y ago
  The date of the last person executed by guillotine in France is surprisingly recent.
  - cultureswitch 4y ago
    1970 right?
  - tylerjaywood 4y ago
    That's in there. The list is random each day, but I'm pretty sure that showed up a couple days ago!
- josegonzalez 4y ago
  Might be cool to add instructions on what to do. I landed on that page and was fairly confused as to what I was supposed to do other than read the facts.
galaxyLogic 4y ago
Beware of man, who is not moved by sound -Fugs
throwaway689236 4y ago
Reminds of a certain Buffy episode https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Once_More,_with_Feeling_(Buffy_the_Vampire_Slayer) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Once_More,_with_Feeling_(Buffy...
- eyelidlessness 4y ago
  “There’s always a talisman”
Daz1 4y ago
How is this 'news'?
- c3534l 4y ago
  HackerNews isn't actually a news site. Intellectually stimulating articles are and always have been allowed.
- thinkingemote 4y ago
  A link to the site guidelines is in the footer of every page. The paragraph you should read is the first one.
csours 4y ago
It's ancient TikTok.
- Cardinal7167 4y ago
  2011 called, they want their flash mob back
paulorlando 4y ago
I was reading about this recently as I was researching the Ghost Dancers of the Midwest Native American tribes of the late 1800s. There were multiple occurrences of dancing or related (sometimes seemingly uncontrollable) movement in religions. Here's a short list I made from James Mooney's book on the Ghost Dancers: - The dancing epidemic of Saint John, which broke out in Germany, the Netherlands, and France in the 1300s and 1400s. - The Flagellant movement, which erupted in Italy, France, Germany, Austria, Poland, Denmark, and England in the 1200s and 1300s. - The Quakers, who early in their history, were known for violently shaking. - The "Jumpers," a group that started in 1740 in Wales, whose actions Moore notes as most similar to the Ghost dancers of 1870 and 1890. They would repeatedly sing songs while jumping for hours. - The Shakers. You get the idea from the name. - The Methodists. Of the groups already mentioned, this was the one I had the least expectation of an early history of followers shaking and falling down in religious ecstasy. - The Kentucky Revival of 1800, which mostly affected Methodists and Baptists in Kentucky and Tennessee. The promise was that Christ's second coming would be in 1805. At these revival meetings attendees often fell to the ground and rolled around, jerking their body about. As Mooney said in his book: "The human race is one in thought and action. The systems of our highest civilizations have their counterparts among all the nations, and their chain of parallels stretches backward link by link until we find their origin and interpretation in the customs and rites of our own barbarian ancestors, or of our still existing aboriginal tribes. There is nothing new under the sun."
- 100721 4y ago
  > At these revival meetings attendees often fell to the ground and rolled around, jerking their body about. I have been to pentecostal churches like this. It was bizarre to witness. I feel like there must be a common thread among these religions.
  - quags 4y ago
    My childhood was in a Pentecostal church and this would randomly happen with out warning during a service - and when it did the service would run long. Normally I would get out at 12:30 so 11-12 was singing, 10-11 Sunday school and 12-12:30 at best the preaching would end but it was probably 1 in 6 where one could describe is as mass hysteria with loud singing , speaking in tongues and falling to the floor. Those would run and extra hour at least which gave very little time for play being you had to be back there for evening service. 10/10 would not recommend.
c3534l 4y ago
So I remember looking into this a while ago, and I don't really have proof, but it seems like the description of "dance" is probably misleading. There's, for instance, something called St. Vitis' Dance, which is a neurological condition people still get today. You can look at videos of that and I don't think any modern person would possibly describe that as dancing, but that's how it was perceived in an older age. As fascinating as the case of the dancing plague is, I suspect it was a disease with the more mundane symptom of muscular dyskinesia or dystonia and we're imagining something akin to actual dancing. Again, I have no proof. It just seems like we're taking the descriptions we have too literally from an era where medical terminology was often metaphorical and made by people with an extremely limited understanding of disease.
- lostlogin 4y ago
  In looking into that, ‘dance’ doesn’t seem a far fetched description. Things like Sydenham’s chorea match too, and could be described as a dance. Another name for it is rheumatic chorea - and it can present soon after a strep throat infection. There are plenty of medical or lay terms for medical things that are less accurate. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sydenham%27s_chorea https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sydenham%27s_chorea https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6799876/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6799876/
- adastra22 4y ago
  I think you are most likely correct. However, I’m still very curious about this event. Those kinds of diseases are typically neural degenerate, and not often readily transmissible. What could cause an entire town to catch it simultaneously? Something in the water or food supply?
  - krylon 4y ago
    I've heard of the hypothesis it was a fungus infecting the wheat. I don't know what it's called in English, it's Mutterkorn in German. Concidentally (or not?) the precursor substance of LSD is produced by this fungus.
Jiocus 4y ago
Wow, I was reading about this just yesterday —it was linked from 'List of unusual deaths', naturally https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unusual_deaths https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unusual_deaths
11235813213455 4y ago
There's a bit of mass hysteria in strikes as well
ggm 4y ago
Would mis-reported Hare Krishna or Sufi be treated by history similarly? Not that I think either are comparable, it's what deep time and a lack of other sources on a marginal social trend might look like in future distance which interests me. As if "midnight express" (1978) was a sole surviving document of life in Middle Eastern prisons, and so defined them.
- riffraff 4y ago
  It seems unlikely, being "foreigner" would have been a significant factor in the report of dance outbreaks in northern Europe, and it's not part of this story.
  - ggm 4y ago
    Most of the dancing Hare Krishna in western society are locals. Btw the point wasn't "these dancers are kare krishna" the point was that history isn't kind to marginal stories with single or a few sources.
- cultureswitch 4y ago
  There wouldn't have been any in Alsace in 1518
_ZeD_ 4y ago
like the tarantims[0] where italian tarantella (and pizzica) come from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarantism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarantism
sgt 4y ago
The Dancing Plague hits HN frontpage plague of the 2020's
tunnuz 4y ago
That’s very interesting and I remember reading of ergot, but never realised it could give these sort of symptoms nor that it was what LSD had been synthesized from. Thanks for sharing.
- shen23 4y ago
  a whole lot of stuff has been derived from ergot alkaloids. Albert Hoffmann alone found drugs to help women survive child birth before LSD stole the show. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1637017/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1637017/
avodonosov 4y ago
that's one case. More general article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dancing_mania https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dancing_mania
Han091 4y ago
[flagged]
pil0u 4y ago
"Mass hysteria" is not well known or understood and probably a poor choice of words - it is not pathological. In France in October 2019, 17 students started convulsing without clear logical reason and no poisoning evidence. It was eventually flagged as a new case of "mass hysteria". This (French) podcast episode[0] captures testimonies from judges, doctors and the mayor of the city to explain how it went, it's mind blowing. Here is a summary (abstract, translated): > On 3 October, during a school cross-country race in Morbier, in the Jura, seventeen schoolchildren were taken ill one after the other: nausea, vomiting, convulsions... > Maelys, a pupil in the third year of secondary school, was excused from running at the last moment because of neck pain. Sitting down, she observes her classmates. The girls in the third grade are the last to pass when the scene suddenly becomes unrealistic: "A friend comes in and suddenly I hear a shout: "She's convulsing!" Another friend falls into the changing room. Another friend comes up to me and says in a panic "I can't feel my legs!" and I see that she is shaking all over her body, her legs don't respond and she yells at me to call the fire brigade. Around us there were already two helicopters." > Two students are in a "state of absolute emergency", one of them with a "vital prognosis". They are being transported to Besançon hospital. > The results of the drinking water were in conformity. The food hypothesis was also ruled out. We also suspected drugs and narcotics, but the blood tests and urine analyses revealed nothing. No toxicological cause could explain the event. > Dominique Parain, a former neurologist at the Rouen University Hospital, read about the incident in the press and recognised the symptoms of a "collective psychogenic syndrome": "First of all, the cross is noted, so there is a favourable ground for stress. Then it appears in a community, in this case a school, and psychogenic syndromes mainly concern girls, as is the case here. Finally, it spreads to the sight, in the manner of a yawn. One person's discomfort causes another's discomfort." > If the cause is imaginary, the symptoms are very real and would have for origin a temporary dysfunction of the cerebral activity: "The brain's connections are constantly being made and broken, and in adolescence, connectivity explodes. This can lead to discomfort. We believe that certain mental images can disconnect cortical regions, leading to a loss of control and various symptoms." > Some schoolchildren still find it hard to believe that these spectacular seizures have a purely emotional cause. "Denial is common in this case", says Dominique Parain. [0] https://www.radiofrance.fr/franceculture/podcasts/les-pieds-sur-terre/les-pieds-sur-terre-du-jeudi-20-fevrier-2020-2106640 https://www.radiofrance.fr/franceculture/podcasts/les-pieds-...
zabzonk 4y ago
isn't there a fantasy novel about this? it is on the edge of my tongue. bum-faced memory - when you get to my age (nearly 70) you know it is in there, but it is often infuriatingly difficult trying to retrieve it.
DrNosferatu 4y ago
It’s actually called “TikTok”.
- Pompidou 4y ago
  In some way could call what is happening now "the great smartphone Plague". Hundred of people staring at a screen, all the Time, and for some, stoping to go out, and believing self-harming social-media driven ideology such as anti-health posture (anti-vax for instance).
RickJWagner 4y ago
We could use a little of that today. Maybe with a soundtrack with the BeeGees, Abba and some 70s funk.
quickthrower2 4y ago
Nerve agent? Rabies?
stall84 4y ago
Every fiber of your being is screaming 'prank!' every line you traverse in this article...
petercooper 4y ago
It's such a coincidence to see this on HN today. I was listening to a podcast about this very phenomenon yesterday (it was an old episode from exactly one year ago, too). If anyone is intrigued, it's https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PmvwGymptko https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PmvwGymptko – they covered ten different "strange" causes of death, of which the dancing plague was one (and perhaps the least gruesome – the Byford Dolphin one was a real eye opener https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byford_Dolphin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byford_Dolphin).
rhyme-boss 4y ago
At the same time Cortez was encountering the Aztecs.
djha-skin 4y ago
Sometimes I think about this plague because I have restless leg[1]. It gets really bad sometimes at night to the point that I can't sit still I have to jump around. I take medication for it now and so it's controlled but if I didn't take meds for it it would be a lot harder to deal with. The reason I think of restless leg in connection with this disease is that, remarkably, modern medicine does not have a definitive answer for the cause of either. I take several pills that doctors have prescribed which I have discovered help with the disease but it is unknown why they do so in some cases. I get that the disease is complicated, but sometimes I just wonder if these people took an Epsom salt bath if that would have lent some relief. 1: https://www.ninds.nih.gov/health-information/disorders/restless-legs-syndrome https://www.ninds.nih.gov/health-information/disorders/restl...

192 points by graderjs 4y ago

Also, from Britannica^0: In July 1518, a woman whose name was given as Frau (Mrs.) Troffea (or Trauffea) stepped into the street and began dancing. She seemed unable to stop, and she kept dancing until she collapsed from exhaustion. After resting, she resumed the compulsive frenzied activity. She continued this way for days, and within a week more than 30 other people were similarly afflicted. They kept going long past the point of injury. City authorities were alarmed by the ever-increasing number of dancers. The civic and religious leaders theorized that more dancing was the solution, and so they arranged for guildhalls for the dancers to gather in, musicians to accompany the dancing, and professional dancers to help the afflicted to continue dancing…” Hahaha ^0: https://www.britannica.com/event/dancing-plague-of-1518 https://www.britannica.com/event/dancing-plague-of-1518

flangola7 4y ago
Was it some kind of brain infection? What causes this?
- mseepgood 4y ago
  Boredom and lack of fun in an uptight society.
- jl6 4y ago
  The article gives two possible explanations (LSD-like food poisoning, and “mass psychogenic illness”). There’s a chance it could be an elaborate hoax, or misunderstanding.
- HopenHeyHi 4y ago
  It was the dreaded Hildegard von Blingin'. Be warned on clicking yonder hyperlinks least ye be similarly afflicted! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRIfsFefatg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRIfsFefatg Varily they did try to summon a hero during those dark days: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nx-x_1lIXh4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nx-x_1lIXh4 But lo, some tried to escape by way of sea: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9eSnSBP1Po https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9eSnSBP1Po Some say this evil lasted as late as 1576: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e6LOWKVq5sQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e6LOWKVq5sQ
- themodelplumber 4y ago
  One of the linked papers talks about involuntary trance and the capacity for such a phenomenon to spread through extant systemic stress or fear. We know humans can be captured or gripped by any number of involuntary phenomena, particularly when it becomes a social effect and in effect reduces individual conscious control in favor of the social locus. So that lens seems fairly valid on its face. This also took place during extraordinarily harsh times even for that particular point in history. There had been massive floods and damage to crops, with food prices soaring, in addition to newly-spreading syphilis. There was probably a fairly strong unconscious sense of loss of control in the first place.
  - DANmode 4y ago
    > There had been massive floods Hm. Mycotoxins?
- HlessClaudesman 4y ago
  Cordyceps.
- refurb 4y ago
  “The human brain is a hell of a drug.” The idea of mass psychogenic illness is pretty well known and even happens today. You’ll read about some school where a bad smell comes up, some kid faints and then suddenly the class is on their way to the hospital, only to find out there was no exposure.
macrolocal 4y ago
“I can bring whole cities to ruin And still have time to get a soft-shoe in”
- teddyh 4y ago
  Quote from the TV series Buffy the Vampire Slayer, Season 6, episode 7, Once More, With Feeling (2001): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Once_More,_with_Feeling_(Buffy_the_Vampire_Slayer) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Once_More,_with_Feeling_(Buffy...
  - pcthrowaway 4y ago
    That was a phenomenal episode of television
    - tough 4y ago
      Yeah I kinda hate musicals and loved that one, so whimsical.
- pantulis 4y ago
  "I bought Nero his very first fiddle!"
afavour 4y ago
> The civic and religious leaders theorized that more dancing was the solution Reminds me of those pushing for “herd immunity” at the beginning of the Covid outbreak!

jb1991 4y ago

Never underestimate the power of hysteria, which used to be a bonafide diagnosis but is a term now rarely used outside hyperbole.

graderjs 4y ago
Or accurately depending on the context: South Korea stampeded; flocking behavior online. We're driven by our base impulses, without thinking.

tanseydavid 4y ago

The original rave party! Dance 'til you drop (dead).

tylerjaywood 4y ago

I built https://chrono.quest https://chrono.quest as a fun way to discover weird or anachronistic events from history. If anyone knows of a good list of events like this, please let me know so I can add them!

yaboy 4y ago
[flagged]
- junon 4y ago
  Yes these people from 1518 are definitely going to take offense to this person's side project.
Laremere 4y ago
I appear to be unable to drag the events. On chrome mobile.
ocfnash 4y ago
The date of the last person executed by guillotine in France is surprisingly recent.
- cultureswitch 4y ago
  1970 right?
- tylerjaywood 4y ago
  That's in there. The list is random each day, but I'm pretty sure that showed up a couple days ago!
josegonzalez 4y ago
Might be cool to add instructions on what to do. I landed on that page and was fairly confused as to what I was supposed to do other than read the facts.

galaxyLogic 4y ago

Beware of man, who is not moved by sound -Fugs

throwaway689236 4y ago

Reminds of a certain Buffy episode https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Once_More,_with_Feeling_(Buffy_the_Vampire_Slayer) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Once_More,_with_Feeling_(Buffy...

eyelidlessness 4y ago
“There’s always a talisman”

Daz1 4y ago

How is this 'news'?

c3534l 4y ago
HackerNews isn't actually a news site. Intellectually stimulating articles are and always have been allowed.
thinkingemote 4y ago
A link to the site guidelines is in the footer of every page. The paragraph you should read is the first one.

csours 4y ago

It's ancient TikTok.

Cardinal7167 4y ago
2011 called, they want their flash mob back

paulorlando 4y ago

I was reading about this recently as I was researching the Ghost Dancers of the Midwest Native American tribes of the late 1800s. There were multiple occurrences of dancing or related (sometimes seemingly uncontrollable) movement in religions. Here's a short list I made from James Mooney's book on the Ghost Dancers: - The dancing epidemic of Saint John, which broke out in Germany, the Netherlands, and France in the 1300s and 1400s. - The Flagellant movement, which erupted in Italy, France, Germany, Austria, Poland, Denmark, and England in the 1200s and 1300s. - The Quakers, who early in their history, were known for violently shaking. - The "Jumpers," a group that started in 1740 in Wales, whose actions Moore notes as most similar to the Ghost dancers of 1870 and 1890. They would repeatedly sing songs while jumping for hours. - The Shakers. You get the idea from the name. - The Methodists. Of the groups already mentioned, this was the one I had the least expectation of an early history of followers shaking and falling down in religious ecstasy. - The Kentucky Revival of 1800, which mostly affected Methodists and Baptists in Kentucky and Tennessee. The promise was that Christ's second coming would be in 1805. At these revival meetings attendees often fell to the ground and rolled around, jerking their body about. As Mooney said in his book: "The human race is one in thought and action. The systems of our highest civilizations have their counterparts among all the nations, and their chain of parallels stretches backward link by link until we find their origin and interpretation in the customs and rites of our own barbarian ancestors, or of our still existing aboriginal tribes. There is nothing new under the sun."

100721 4y ago
> At these revival meetings attendees often fell to the ground and rolled around, jerking their body about. I have been to pentecostal churches like this. It was bizarre to witness. I feel like there must be a common thread among these religions.
- quags 4y ago
  My childhood was in a Pentecostal church and this would randomly happen with out warning during a service - and when it did the service would run long. Normally I would get out at 12:30 so 11-12 was singing, 10-11 Sunday school and 12-12:30 at best the preaching would end but it was probably 1 in 6 where one could describe is as mass hysteria with loud singing , speaking in tongues and falling to the floor. Those would run and extra hour at least which gave very little time for play being you had to be back there for evening service. 10/10 would not recommend.

c3534l 4y ago

So I remember looking into this a while ago, and I don't really have proof, but it seems like the description of "dance" is probably misleading. There's, for instance, something called St. Vitis' Dance, which is a neurological condition people still get today. You can look at videos of that and I don't think any modern person would possibly describe that as dancing, but that's how it was perceived in an older age. As fascinating as the case of the dancing plague is, I suspect it was a disease with the more mundane symptom of muscular dyskinesia or dystonia and we're imagining something akin to actual dancing. Again, I have no proof. It just seems like we're taking the descriptions we have too literally from an era where medical terminology was often metaphorical and made by people with an extremely limited understanding of disease.

lostlogin 4y ago
In looking into that, ‘dance’ doesn’t seem a far fetched description. Things like Sydenham’s chorea match too, and could be described as a dance. Another name for it is rheumatic chorea - and it can present soon after a strep throat infection. There are plenty of medical or lay terms for medical things that are less accurate. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sydenham%27s_chorea https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sydenham%27s_chorea https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6799876/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6799876/
adastra22 4y ago
I think you are most likely correct. However, I’m still very curious about this event. Those kinds of diseases are typically neural degenerate, and not often readily transmissible. What could cause an entire town to catch it simultaneously? Something in the water or food supply?
- krylon 4y ago
  I've heard of the hypothesis it was a fungus infecting the wheat. I don't know what it's called in English, it's Mutterkorn in German. Concidentally (or not?) the precursor substance of LSD is produced by this fungus.

Jiocus 4y ago

Wow, I was reading about this just yesterday —it was linked from 'List of unusual deaths', naturally https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unusual_deaths https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unusual_deaths

11235813213455 4y ago

There's a bit of mass hysteria in strikes as well

ggm 4y ago

Would mis-reported Hare Krishna or Sufi be treated by history similarly? Not that I think either are comparable, it's what deep time and a lack of other sources on a marginal social trend might look like in future distance which interests me. As if "midnight express" (1978) was a sole surviving document of life in Middle Eastern prisons, and so defined them.

riffraff 4y ago
It seems unlikely, being "foreigner" would have been a significant factor in the report of dance outbreaks in northern Europe, and it's not part of this story.
- ggm 4y ago
  Most of the dancing Hare Krishna in western society are locals. Btw the point wasn't "these dancers are kare krishna" the point was that history isn't kind to marginal stories with single or a few sources.
cultureswitch 4y ago
There wouldn't have been any in Alsace in 1518

_ZeD_ 4y ago

like the tarantims[0] where italian tarantella (and pizzica) come from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarantism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarantism

sgt 4y ago

The Dancing Plague hits HN frontpage plague of the 2020's

tunnuz 4y ago

That’s very interesting and I remember reading of ergot, but never realised it could give these sort of symptoms nor that it was what LSD had been synthesized from. Thanks for sharing.

shen23 4y ago
a whole lot of stuff has been derived from ergot alkaloids. Albert Hoffmann alone found drugs to help women survive child birth before LSD stole the show. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1637017/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1637017/

avodonosov 4y ago

that's one case. More general article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dancing_mania https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dancing_mania

Han091 4y ago

[flagged]

pil0u 4y ago

"Mass hysteria" is not well known or understood and probably a poor choice of words - it is not pathological. In France in October 2019, 17 students started convulsing without clear logical reason and no poisoning evidence. It was eventually flagged as a new case of "mass hysteria". This (French) podcast episode[0] captures testimonies from judges, doctors and the mayor of the city to explain how it went, it's mind blowing. Here is a summary (abstract, translated): > On 3 October, during a school cross-country race in Morbier, in the Jura, seventeen schoolchildren were taken ill one after the other: nausea, vomiting, convulsions... > Maelys, a pupil in the third year of secondary school, was excused from running at the last moment because of neck pain. Sitting down, she observes her classmates. The girls in the third grade are the last to pass when the scene suddenly becomes unrealistic: "A friend comes in and suddenly I hear a shout: "She's convulsing!" Another friend falls into the changing room. Another friend comes up to me and says in a panic "I can't feel my legs!" and I see that she is shaking all over her body, her legs don't respond and she yells at me to call the fire brigade. Around us there were already two helicopters." > Two students are in a "state of absolute emergency", one of them with a "vital prognosis". They are being transported to Besançon hospital. > The results of the drinking water were in conformity. The food hypothesis was also ruled out. We also suspected drugs and narcotics, but the blood tests and urine analyses revealed nothing. No toxicological cause could explain the event. > Dominique Parain, a former neurologist at the Rouen University Hospital, read about the incident in the press and recognised the symptoms of a "collective psychogenic syndrome": "First of all, the cross is noted, so there is a favourable ground for stress. Then it appears in a community, in this case a school, and psychogenic syndromes mainly concern girls, as is the case here. Finally, it spreads to the sight, in the manner of a yawn. One person's discomfort causes another's discomfort." > If the cause is imaginary, the symptoms are very real and would have for origin a temporary dysfunction of the cerebral activity: "The brain's connections are constantly being made and broken, and in adolescence, connectivity explodes. This can lead to discomfort. We believe that certain mental images can disconnect cortical regions, leading to a loss of control and various symptoms." > Some schoolchildren still find it hard to believe that these spectacular seizures have a purely emotional cause. "Denial is common in this case", says Dominique Parain. [0] https://www.radiofrance.fr/franceculture/podcasts/les-pieds-sur-terre/les-pieds-sur-terre-du-jeudi-20-fevrier-2020-2106640 https://www.radiofrance.fr/franceculture/podcasts/les-pieds-...

zabzonk 4y ago

isn't there a fantasy novel about this? it is on the edge of my tongue. bum-faced memory - when you get to my age (nearly 70) you know it is in there, but it is often infuriatingly difficult trying to retrieve it.

DrNosferatu 4y ago

It’s actually called “TikTok”.

Pompidou 4y ago
In some way could call what is happening now "the great smartphone Plague". Hundred of people staring at a screen, all the Time, and for some, stoping to go out, and believing self-harming social-media driven ideology such as anti-health posture (anti-vax for instance).

RickJWagner 4y ago

We could use a little of that today. Maybe with a soundtrack with the BeeGees, Abba and some 70s funk.

quickthrower2 4y ago

Nerve agent? Rabies?

stall84 4y ago

Every fiber of your being is screaming 'prank!' every line you traverse in this article...

petercooper 4y ago

It's such a coincidence to see this on HN today. I was listening to a podcast about this very phenomenon yesterday (it was an old episode from exactly one year ago, too). If anyone is intrigued, it's https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PmvwGymptko https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PmvwGymptko – they covered ten different "strange" causes of death, of which the dancing plague was one (and perhaps the least gruesome – the Byford Dolphin one was a real eye opener https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byford_Dolphin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byford_Dolphin).

rhyme-boss 4y ago

At the same time Cortez was encountering the Aztecs.

djha-skin 4y ago

Sometimes I think about this plague because I have restless leg[1]. It gets really bad sometimes at night to the point that I can't sit still I have to jump around. I take medication for it now and so it's controlled but if I didn't take meds for it it would be a lot harder to deal with. The reason I think of restless leg in connection with this disease is that, remarkably, modern medicine does not have a definitive answer for the cause of either. I take several pills that doctors have prescribed which I have discovered help with the disease but it is unknown why they do so in some cases. I get that the disease is complicated, but sometimes I just wonder if these people took an Epsom salt bath if that would have lent some relief. 1: https://www.ninds.nih.gov/health-information/disorders/restless-legs-syndrome https://www.ninds.nih.gov/health-information/disorders/restl...