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> socialize them to understand their ethnic identity in terms of American slavery. This is historical context for why these groups are still face discriminatio

by Spivak 4y ago

> socialize them to understand their ethnic identity in terms of American slavery. This is historical context for why these groups are still face discrimination today. Someone who's racist has no idea if you're a recent immigrant from Nigeria, you will face the exact same discrimination as a descendant of slaves. This is the public education equivalent of "the talk" parents have to have with their kids for why they're treated differently. One of my good friends is a second generation immigrant from Thailand and in white suburbia in the 80s her mom was told to go back to China. Even people totally disconnected from the historical acts of discrimination are affected by it. The "standard" US history curriculum is comically bad, come over on my Mayflower, have Thanksgiving with the Indians, Taxation Without Representation, Tea Party, The Federalist Papers, The Constitution, slavery, The underground railroad, Lincoln's emancipation proclamation, civil war for two seconds, jim crow, then MLK solved racism, paper shuffling, the end, Murica!

nradov 4y ago
In practice it seems many racists actually do discriminate based at least partially on national origin. I have overhead multiple US small business owners state that they like to hire recent immigrants from Nigeria (and other African countries) instead of the native-born descendants of slaves due to a perceived difference in employee work ethic and attitude. To be clear I don't support discrimination and I abhor all forms of racism. I'm just pointing out that different groups may have wildly different experiences with discrimination despite looking somewhat similar.
rayiner 4y ago
> This is historical context for why these groups are still face discrimination today. Someone who's racist has no idea if you're a recent immigrant from Nigeria, you will face the exact same discrimination as a descendant of slaves. They may face prejudice, but they don’t face what academics today would call systemic or structural racism. To use your example, Nigerian immigrants have such high income mobility they reach parity with similarly educated whites by the second generation. Indeed, studies show that virtually all immigrant groups enjoy higher income mobility than native born Americans. > This is the public education equivalent of "the talk" parents have to have with their kids for why they're treated differently. What “talk?” My parents never said anything about racism, even though I grew up in an almost completely white Virginia town in the 1990s. And I’m grateful for it, because I never had any reason to expect to be treated differently. It would be wildly inappropriate for a teacher, 80% of whom are white, to try and address how a minority kid should relate to living in a white majority society. > One of my good friends is a second generation immigrant from Thailand and in white suburbia in the 80s her mom was told to go back to China. Even people totally disconnected from the historical acts of discrimination are affected by it. And? Did that keep your friend from getting into school? Getting jobs? Etc? Prejudice between different groups is nearly universal. I was born in Thailand, but my family is from Bangladesh. If I had continued to live there I can guarantee you I’d have more than a few stories. The other day I was in an elevator with some Arabs, and one muttered “Bangladeshi” to the other. I don’t speak Arabic but I guarantee you he wasn’t saying anything nice! As an Asian, your friend is more likely to make more money and live longer, and less likely to get shot by the police or incarcerated than the average white person. Comments like that are unpleasant and rude, but have nothing to do with historically rooted structural racism.

by Spivak 4y ago

nradov 4y ago

In practice it seems many racists actually do discriminate based at least partially on national origin. I have overhead multiple US small business owners state that they like to hire recent immigrants from Nigeria (and other African countries) instead of the native-born descendants of slaves due to a perceived difference in employee work ethic and attitude. To be clear I don't support discrimination and I abhor all forms of racism. I'm just pointing out that different groups may have wildly different experiences with discrimination despite looking somewhat similar.

rayiner 4y ago

> This is historical context for why these groups are still face discrimination today. Someone who's racist has no idea if you're a recent immigrant from Nigeria, you will face the exact same discrimination as a descendant of slaves. They may face prejudice, but they don’t face what academics today would call systemic or structural racism. To use your example, Nigerian immigrants have such high income mobility they reach parity with similarly educated whites by the second generation. Indeed, studies show that virtually all immigrant groups enjoy higher income mobility than native born Americans. > This is the public education equivalent of "the talk" parents have to have with their kids for why they're treated differently. What “talk?” My parents never said anything about racism, even though I grew up in an almost completely white Virginia town in the 1990s. And I’m grateful for it, because I never had any reason to expect to be treated differently. It would be wildly inappropriate for a teacher, 80% of whom are white, to try and address how a minority kid should relate to living in a white majority society. > One of my good friends is a second generation immigrant from Thailand and in white suburbia in the 80s her mom was told to go back to China. Even people totally disconnected from the historical acts of discrimination are affected by it. And? Did that keep your friend from getting into school? Getting jobs? Etc? Prejudice between different groups is nearly universal. I was born in Thailand, but my family is from Bangladesh. If I had continued to live there I can guarantee you I’d have more than a few stories. The other day I was in an elevator with some Arabs, and one muttered “Bangladeshi” to the other. I don’t speak Arabic but I guarantee you he wasn’t saying anything nice! As an Asian, your friend is more likely to make more money and live longer, and less likely to get shot by the police or incarcerated than the average white person. Comments like that are unpleasant and rude, but have nothing to do with historically rooted structural racism.