16 ms·

This is a terrific set of ideals and I think like many great visions, even if it’s not accomplished directly, it will put wheels into motion that will advance t

This is a terrific set of ideals and I think like many great visions, even if it’s not accomplished directly, it will put wheels into motion that will advance the world in the right direction, and might just help save the environment. I just wish the guy in charge could apply the same systematic thinking to his approach to politics. I fear that the major short term risk to humanity is not the environment, but toxic politics. If renewables are the solution to our energy problems, I like to think kindness and tolerance might be the solution to our political problems. Perhaps he could publish a master plan for that, too.

logicchains 4y ago
[flagged]
- soperj 4y ago
  34% of people identify as independents, more than the 29% that identify as Republican or the 29% that identify as Democrats.
  - natch 4y ago
    ok so roughly two thirds of the population, not half, reinforcing the point with your correction. I hope that was what you intended.
- rootusrootus 4y ago
  > the coordinated censorship of the political views of half the population Tell me again which news network is the largest?
  - systemvoltage 4y ago
    See Twitter files. OP is right.
  - systemvoltage 4y ago
    Here is a better view of the hegemony of the left across the board: https://twitter.com/loganclarkhall/status/1644157299244642304 https://twitter.com/loganclarkhall/status/164415729924464230... It's completely lopsided.
fatneckbeard 4y ago
yes. there is environmental sustainability and then there is social sustainability. nobody wants to live in a carbon free world if every company is as abusive as Tesla to its employees. and that culture came from Musk himself. the way he treats people does not make for sustainable relationships.
- toomuchtodo 4y ago
  Tesla the org will outlive Elon. We thank him for his exceptional efforts to accelerate the transition to clean energy and mobility, personal issues and poor behavior aside that need no mention. Just as people like him squeeze others to get as much as they can, we should hope for the same: the largest amount of progress delivered at the lowest amount of harm caused until he’s moved on. “The impossible delivered merely late.” It’s about maintaining everything in tension sustainably. No excuses, there are no heroes. (early Tesla investor because climate change is existential, no current exposure, none planned)
  - _hypx 4y ago
    Actually Musk was not the founder of Tesla, nor is Tesla likely to be a major car maker in the future. It is basically a terrible car maker know for its poor quality, on par with Chrysler and the like. It is likely destined to be own by some other car company eventually.
    - rlt 4y ago
      > Actually Musk was not the founder of Tesla Such a tired trope. For all intents and purposes Musk is absolutely a founder of Tesla. > It is basically a terrible car maker know for its poor quality And someone should tell all of the satisfied Tesla customers how terrible quality their cars are https://electrek.co/2022/06/15/tesla-tops-list-most-satisfied-customers-entire-auto-industry/ https://electrek.co/2022/06/15/tesla-tops-list-most-satisfie...
  - mradonic 4y ago
    | Tesla the org will outlive Elon. You cannot know that for sure. Maybe we find the holy grail, or maybe the company doesn't survive idiocy of its fake founder.
dheera 4y ago
> I just wish the guy in charge could apply the same systematic thinking to his approach to politics. I actually think he is smarter than people give him credit for, politically. One of the major problems right now is conservatives, who are about half the country, aren't into supporting renewable energy anything (but liberals will continue to buy Tesla products even if you piss them off a little). A lot of what's he's been upto lately is attempting to socially engineer renewable energy into the conservative world, which is a tough problem to crack to begin with.
- NegativeK 4y ago
  While I agree that he's very smart in some areas, I think that this is a lot of post-hoc rationale for bad behavior.
- threeseed 4y ago
  This comment is offensive and ridiculous. There are many ways to increase adoption of renewable energy that don't involve putting down minorities, being racist, sexist and all around offensive and acting with the maturity of a spoilt teenager. Two of them being through government regulation and incentives which are major contributors to Tesla's success.
  - whatwhaaaaat 4y ago
    How has elon been racist or sexist?
  - spacephysics 4y ago
    These blanket judgements and accusations at a good half of the population of the United States is why we’re in the social mess we’re in now. You’re contributing to the problem, the divisive rhetoric that isn’t useful for anyone on any side if we wish to come to common ground across the aisle. If either side wishes to make impactful change. Already the world is moving away from the US dollar hegemony, a move that will impact our children, and children’s children if we as a country don’t participate in these evolving times. There’s numerous other examples of the world making decades-long plans that the US is not positioning ourselves appropriately for. We’re distracted by such tribalism on both sides. The United States won’t be taken over by an outside power, no, we’re doing well enough eating ourselves from the inside.
throwawaymanbot 4y ago
[dead]
pdog 4y ago
> I just wish the guy in charge could apply the same systematic thinking to his approach to politics. I fear that the major short term risk to humanity is not the environment, but toxic politics. Elon Musk is not (and never has been) a politician. What exactly do you think he should do differently?
- doctor_eval 4y ago
  Every person in any list of the richest people in the world is, pretty much by definition, political. It's just how the world works.
epgui 4y ago
> I just wish the guy in charge could apply the same systematic thinking to his approach to politics So much this, my god... And politics aside, everything Elon says about public health seems to be pretty dumb too. It's a good reminder that you can be extremely brilliant in your field but still no better than an average schmuck on other topics. This is why we don't have a choice but to specialize and why we defer to expertise. In the 1600s you could be on top of all science-- that's simply not even remotely possible any longer for any individual.
- fundad 4y ago
  Is he trying to sound smart or simply promote anti-tax candidates so he keeps more of his money?
  - epgui 4y ago
    I'm torn on this question. I think I could argue both sides ad nauseam, so I'll just say that I don't know what he thinks.
    - fundad 4y ago
      Some columnists can’t figure him out either, but his motives are clear, I’m going by not subtle actions. He promotes GOP candidates and favors right wing journalists. He engages in QAanon conspiracies on his network. He’s one of many right wing operators who started or bought social media sites. Donating the personal maximum to both parties is nothing compared to what is essentially $44B in-kind campaign contribution.
  - tenpies 4y ago
    Isn't it too late for that given the exorbitant tax bill he already paid? [1] Short of Democrats passing one of those economy-destroying net wealth taxes, or a truly-absurd unrealized capital gains tax; the damage is done for Musk. Granted, taxes of this nature being what they are, he will likely be able to recover some of that amount in future years. --- [1] https://www.cnbc.com/2021/12/20/elon-musk-says-he-will-pay-over-11-billion-in-taxes-this-year.html https://www.cnbc.com/2021/12/20/elon-musk-says-he-will-pay-o...
enslavedrobot 4y ago
The geopolitics of energy and resource scarcity are a primary driver of political toxicity and state sponsored murder and oppression. Transitioning to renewable regional and local energy generation and storage will reduce political risk to humanity dramatically by enabling the decoupling of geopolitics from oil. On another note, here's an interview with a crazy narcissist who bought twitter on a lark discussing the vision for reducing political toxicity on social media at a Morgan Stanley conference. Have you ever listened to an actual primary interview on the plan for twitter rather than a clickbait article on the topic? https://www.youtube.com/live/zpcgHK_fXRo?feature=share https://www.youtube.com/live/zpcgHK_fXRo?feature=share
- wyldfire 4y ago
  > dramatically by enabling the decoupling of geopolitics from oil. I can't help thinking that oil and combustion engines are here for a long time. The energy density is unbeatable. As renewables succeed, oil's utility doesn't disappear. So it seems like we would find some new equilibrium.
  - super256 4y ago
    If we produce much more green energy than we currently need, we might see synthetic fuels becoming viable, no?
    - epgui 4y ago
      In a vacuum I think that would be the natural conclusion, but IMO there's probably better uses for that energy (eg.: desalination plants). Although I could totally see this being the case for CO2 + ... -> CH4 + ...
    - _hypx 4y ago
      We can just directly convert green energy into hydrogen. For a lot of cases that is already more than good enough. Synthetic fuels may be needed, but possibly only in specific situations.
NotYourLawyer 4y ago
[flagged]
andreygrehov 4y ago
> I just wish the guy in charge could apply the same systematic thinking to his approach to politics. What if his political tweets is the result of systematic thinking? If someone holds a viewpoint that differs from ours, does it necessarily imply that their perspective is outrageous and incorrect?
- systemvoltage 4y ago
  I think Elon is pretty much where he was years ago. Progressives have abandoned classical liberalism. I feel same way. And so do many people (Tobi Lutke, Tim Urban, etc.). Berkeley's free speech movement stands in stark contrast with the DEI marxism going on today on campus.
  - saalweachter 4y ago
    I mean, "classical liberalism" as a term was invented to distinguish 18th century ideals from "progressive liberalism", so that's kind of a truism?
- theonething 4y ago
  > If someone holds a viewpoint that differs from ours, does it necessarily imply that their perspective is outrageous and incorrect? Ironically, in the context of GP's comment, this is a large cause of toxic politics. The demonization of people with different viewpoints and refusal to engage in genuine discourse brews the toxicity.
- doctor_eval 4y ago
  It's not just his political tweets though. It's also the treatment of employees at Tesla and Twitter. Pedo guy. The private detectives. Selling stuff that doesn't work. All that stuff. Maybe, like most of us, he sometimes fails to meet his personal standards, and regrets some of the things he does, but I've personally lost confidence that this is the case. You don't call someone "pedo guy" without evidence if you are trying to avoid toxic politics.
  - 4y ago
lmm 4y ago
> If renewables are the solution to our energy problems, I like to think kindness and tolerance might be the solution to our political problems. Perhaps he could publish a master plan for that, too. What's your basis for thinking that? If anything I'd say the weaponisation of "kindness and tolerance" to the point that it drowns out speaking the truth and calling out bad behaviour is the biggest problem with our politics. (And as far as I can see Musk has removed the single most toxic influence on our politics by buying Twitter; even if the discourse on there is now worse than it was before, the benefit from real politicians no longer taking it seriously vastly outweighs any possible costs)
- danparsonson 4y ago
  The easy answer is that weaponised kindness and tolerance are not actually kindness and tolerance - the word 'weaponised' is the differentiator.
  - lmm 4y ago
    Refraining from ever saying anything against a person's political views is genuinely kindness, or at least it's hard to argue that it isn't. It just does more harm in other ways. The redefinition of tolerance to mean deference to other people's absurd views is a travesty IMO, but that battle has already been lost. In any case this "easy answer" is useless in practice; arguing that these policies are unkind or intolerant at best gets you debating semantics, and is usually even less effective than that.
    - doctor_eval 4y ago
      > The redefinition of tolerance to mean deference to other people's absurd views is a travesty IMO, but that battle has already been lost. I'm not sure anything has been redefined. Tolerance is the ability to live in a world alongside people whose views you don't share. Kindness is the ability to treat those people with respect, despite disagreeing with them. It would be nice to see influential people expressing these views, instead of making things worse. It's basically impossible to provide examples without the conversation devolving, so I'll leave it there.
MrBuddyCasino 4y ago
> I like to think kindness and tolerance might be the solution to our political problems The irony of posting this while the black bar commemorates Bob Lees murder tastes very bitter.
abudabi123 4y ago
Advertising before a democracy's election is hot garbage on fire meandering down a flooded road and floating with old fossil fueled automobiles in the rain. The Master Plan 3 could have an annex to apply Super A.I. to subj/objective positioning of voter options summarising candidate's pro/cons in six paired bullet points addressing the advertised-to audience along the I.Q. bell-curve. There could be a 400-word GoogleGPT blurb extra to make the persuasive case either way for audiences unable to watch scifi movies like Solaris bu able to watch Spaceballs.
Dig1t 4y ago
Toxic politics being what? Seems like he’s on the right side of climate change, abortion rights. Is it just the freedom of speech thing? What’s wrong with being pro first amendment? That right, and absolutists who support it, are the biggest reason why the left has been able to gain so much power and make so much progress.
- mikevm 4y ago
  [flagged]
  - dragonwriter 4y ago
    > Ever since Musk turned Twitter into a more open platform That didn’t happen, though. > Reducing censorship became “toxic politics” Musk hasn’t reduced censorship. In fact, he very quickly stepped back from even claiming that, claiming instead that he was maintaining Twitter’s content policies (which, in fact, he never retracted) and even embracing artificial reach limitation (the same “shadowbanning” practice he had early complained of) as a means of enforcing it. It’s true that outside observers that have been tracking content on Twitter since long before Musk took over found that particular forms of hate and abuse (most banned by the written policy) took off under Musk, while other viewpoints (while not engaging in nominally banned conduct) were suppressed, but this shift in bias in content moderation is very much not the same as making it a “more open” platform. > Musk is now flagged as “not a real leftist” Musk was never considered even loosely a leftist. It’s very hard to see how a hypercapitalst (in class terms) could remain such while also being a leftist in ideological terms, but if such a contradictory character has ever existed, Musk was never it, and no one ever thought he was. Before he played footsie with Trump, Musk might have been pegged for a center-right neoliberal pro-weed capitalist with a horrible record on race relations that might manage to fit in with the right wing of the Demcocratic Party, but…that’s about as far left as anyone ever thought he was. > but a right winger, I mean, race and class issues aside, he’s been endorsing right-wing culture war positions on all the hot issues, so, yeah, that’s kind of how he’s asked to be seen, I don’t think he’s actually ideologically a right-wing culture war extremists, I think he’s just virtue-signalling to that camp because that faction has made naked its willingness to punish enemies and reward allies in industry, whereas the opposing political camp has generally been loathe to do so, at least openly and overtly. But, whatever the motive is, Musk has clearly made a conscious decision about how he wants to be seen, and how he is seen reflects that. > he’s probably done more for liberal causes than any of these authoritarian phonies. Leftists don’t support “liberal” causes.
_hypx 4y ago
It's honestly more of a grand vision of what a future society could look like, not anything any one company could accomplish. You read papers like this from many a futurist.
- specialist 4y ago
  Exactly right. Tesla's recent investor day presentation details their anticipated role in Master Plan 3. TLDR: 20m cars/year, new $25k model, charger network, battery storage, etc.
triggerwarn 4y ago
[dead]
zpeti 4y ago
How about we discuss the actual plan and you don’t bring your politics into this discussion? Wouldn’t that be nice for a place like HN for once. You really can’t stomach someone you disagree with politically creating an amazing vision and product that actually improves the world? Is politics that important?
triggerw4rn 4y ago
[flagged]
mnky9800n 4y ago
this is all just a plot to take over the world. he clearly believes that he has the best ideas and therefore if everyone could just fall inline then things would run more smoothly. i mean think about it, he has a space based internet service that he can broadcast his ideas and control information flow any way he wants (especially when other sources of internet disappear). He now has a plan to control the energy distribution to the entire planet. This is lex luthor kind of plotting. or maybe im just letting my imagination run away with itself.
- tim333 4y ago
  Lex was more into causing wars and using super weapons but who knows - maybe Elon has us fooled!
ZeroGravitas 4y ago
Worth noting these aren't ideals or visions, nor are they really specific to Telsa or Musk. This is a summary of the common consensus that the entire world is working towards and has been for a while. This is just putting a set of numbers to it and summarising why the experts believe it's possible. Entire countries have adopted national economic strategies based on this stuff. It's not coming out of leftfield as a big surprise to anyone paying attention. https://energia.gob.cl/sites/default/files/national_green_hydrogen_strategy_-_chile.pdf https://energia.gob.cl/sites/default/files/national_green_hy...

logicchains 4y ago

[flagged]

soperj 4y ago
34% of people identify as independents, more than the 29% that identify as Republican or the 29% that identify as Democrats.
- natch 4y ago
  ok so roughly two thirds of the population, not half, reinforcing the point with your correction. I hope that was what you intended.
rootusrootus 4y ago
> the coordinated censorship of the political views of half the population Tell me again which news network is the largest?
- systemvoltage 4y ago
  See Twitter files. OP is right.
- systemvoltage 4y ago
  Here is a better view of the hegemony of the left across the board: https://twitter.com/loganclarkhall/status/1644157299244642304 https://twitter.com/loganclarkhall/status/164415729924464230... It's completely lopsided.

fatneckbeard 4y ago

yes. there is environmental sustainability and then there is social sustainability. nobody wants to live in a carbon free world if every company is as abusive as Tesla to its employees. and that culture came from Musk himself. the way he treats people does not make for sustainable relationships.

toomuchtodo 4y ago
Tesla the org will outlive Elon. We thank him for his exceptional efforts to accelerate the transition to clean energy and mobility, personal issues and poor behavior aside that need no mention. Just as people like him squeeze others to get as much as they can, we should hope for the same: the largest amount of progress delivered at the lowest amount of harm caused until he’s moved on. “The impossible delivered merely late.” It’s about maintaining everything in tension sustainably. No excuses, there are no heroes. (early Tesla investor because climate change is existential, no current exposure, none planned)
- _hypx 4y ago
  Actually Musk was not the founder of Tesla, nor is Tesla likely to be a major car maker in the future. It is basically a terrible car maker know for its poor quality, on par with Chrysler and the like. It is likely destined to be own by some other car company eventually.
  - rlt 4y ago
    > Actually Musk was not the founder of Tesla Such a tired trope. For all intents and purposes Musk is absolutely a founder of Tesla. > It is basically a terrible car maker know for its poor quality And someone should tell all of the satisfied Tesla customers how terrible quality their cars are https://electrek.co/2022/06/15/tesla-tops-list-most-satisfied-customers-entire-auto-industry/ https://electrek.co/2022/06/15/tesla-tops-list-most-satisfie...
- mradonic 4y ago
  | Tesla the org will outlive Elon. You cannot know that for sure. Maybe we find the holy grail, or maybe the company doesn't survive idiocy of its fake founder.

dheera 4y ago

> I just wish the guy in charge could apply the same systematic thinking to his approach to politics. I actually think he is smarter than people give him credit for, politically. One of the major problems right now is conservatives, who are about half the country, aren't into supporting renewable energy anything (but liberals will continue to buy Tesla products even if you piss them off a little). A lot of what's he's been upto lately is attempting to socially engineer renewable energy into the conservative world, which is a tough problem to crack to begin with.

NegativeK 4y ago
While I agree that he's very smart in some areas, I think that this is a lot of post-hoc rationale for bad behavior.
threeseed 4y ago
This comment is offensive and ridiculous. There are many ways to increase adoption of renewable energy that don't involve putting down minorities, being racist, sexist and all around offensive and acting with the maturity of a spoilt teenager. Two of them being through government regulation and incentives which are major contributors to Tesla's success.
- whatwhaaaaat 4y ago
  How has elon been racist or sexist?
- spacephysics 4y ago
  These blanket judgements and accusations at a good half of the population of the United States is why we’re in the social mess we’re in now. You’re contributing to the problem, the divisive rhetoric that isn’t useful for anyone on any side if we wish to come to common ground across the aisle. If either side wishes to make impactful change. Already the world is moving away from the US dollar hegemony, a move that will impact our children, and children’s children if we as a country don’t participate in these evolving times. There’s numerous other examples of the world making decades-long plans that the US is not positioning ourselves appropriately for. We’re distracted by such tribalism on both sides. The United States won’t be taken over by an outside power, no, we’re doing well enough eating ourselves from the inside.

throwawaymanbot 4y ago

[dead]

pdog 4y ago

> I just wish the guy in charge could apply the same systematic thinking to his approach to politics. I fear that the major short term risk to humanity is not the environment, but toxic politics. Elon Musk is not (and never has been) a politician. What exactly do you think he should do differently?

doctor_eval 4y ago
Every person in any list of the richest people in the world is, pretty much by definition, political. It's just how the world works.

epgui 4y ago

> I just wish the guy in charge could apply the same systematic thinking to his approach to politics So much this, my god... And politics aside, everything Elon says about public health seems to be pretty dumb too. It's a good reminder that you can be extremely brilliant in your field but still no better than an average schmuck on other topics. This is why we don't have a choice but to specialize and why we defer to expertise. In the 1600s you could be on top of all science-- that's simply not even remotely possible any longer for any individual.

fundad 4y ago
Is he trying to sound smart or simply promote anti-tax candidates so he keeps more of his money?
- epgui 4y ago
  I'm torn on this question. I think I could argue both sides ad nauseam, so I'll just say that I don't know what he thinks.
  - fundad 4y ago
    Some columnists can’t figure him out either, but his motives are clear, I’m going by not subtle actions. He promotes GOP candidates and favors right wing journalists. He engages in QAanon conspiracies on his network. He’s one of many right wing operators who started or bought social media sites. Donating the personal maximum to both parties is nothing compared to what is essentially $44B in-kind campaign contribution.
- tenpies 4y ago
  Isn't it too late for that given the exorbitant tax bill he already paid? [1] Short of Democrats passing one of those economy-destroying net wealth taxes, or a truly-absurd unrealized capital gains tax; the damage is done for Musk. Granted, taxes of this nature being what they are, he will likely be able to recover some of that amount in future years. --- [1] https://www.cnbc.com/2021/12/20/elon-musk-says-he-will-pay-over-11-billion-in-taxes-this-year.html https://www.cnbc.com/2021/12/20/elon-musk-says-he-will-pay-o...

enslavedrobot 4y ago

The geopolitics of energy and resource scarcity are a primary driver of political toxicity and state sponsored murder and oppression. Transitioning to renewable regional and local energy generation and storage will reduce political risk to humanity dramatically by enabling the decoupling of geopolitics from oil. On another note, here's an interview with a crazy narcissist who bought twitter on a lark discussing the vision for reducing political toxicity on social media at a Morgan Stanley conference. Have you ever listened to an actual primary interview on the plan for twitter rather than a clickbait article on the topic? https://www.youtube.com/live/zpcgHK_fXRo?feature=share https://www.youtube.com/live/zpcgHK_fXRo?feature=share

wyldfire 4y ago
> dramatically by enabling the decoupling of geopolitics from oil. I can't help thinking that oil and combustion engines are here for a long time. The energy density is unbeatable. As renewables succeed, oil's utility doesn't disappear. So it seems like we would find some new equilibrium.
- super256 4y ago
  If we produce much more green energy than we currently need, we might see synthetic fuels becoming viable, no?
  - epgui 4y ago
    In a vacuum I think that would be the natural conclusion, but IMO there's probably better uses for that energy (eg.: desalination plants). Although I could totally see this being the case for CO2 + ... -> CH4 + ...
  - _hypx 4y ago
    We can just directly convert green energy into hydrogen. For a lot of cases that is already more than good enough. Synthetic fuels may be needed, but possibly only in specific situations.

NotYourLawyer 4y ago

[flagged]

andreygrehov 4y ago

> I just wish the guy in charge could apply the same systematic thinking to his approach to politics. What if his political tweets is the result of systematic thinking? If someone holds a viewpoint that differs from ours, does it necessarily imply that their perspective is outrageous and incorrect?

systemvoltage 4y ago
I think Elon is pretty much where he was years ago. Progressives have abandoned classical liberalism. I feel same way. And so do many people (Tobi Lutke, Tim Urban, etc.). Berkeley's free speech movement stands in stark contrast with the DEI marxism going on today on campus.
- saalweachter 4y ago
  I mean, "classical liberalism" as a term was invented to distinguish 18th century ideals from "progressive liberalism", so that's kind of a truism?
theonething 4y ago
> If someone holds a viewpoint that differs from ours, does it necessarily imply that their perspective is outrageous and incorrect? Ironically, in the context of GP's comment, this is a large cause of toxic politics. The demonization of people with different viewpoints and refusal to engage in genuine discourse brews the toxicity.
doctor_eval 4y ago
It's not just his political tweets though. It's also the treatment of employees at Tesla and Twitter. Pedo guy. The private detectives. Selling stuff that doesn't work. All that stuff. Maybe, like most of us, he sometimes fails to meet his personal standards, and regrets some of the things he does, but I've personally lost confidence that this is the case. You don't call someone "pedo guy" without evidence if you are trying to avoid toxic politics.
- 4y ago

lmm 4y ago

> If renewables are the solution to our energy problems, I like to think kindness and tolerance might be the solution to our political problems. Perhaps he could publish a master plan for that, too. What's your basis for thinking that? If anything I'd say the weaponisation of "kindness and tolerance" to the point that it drowns out speaking the truth and calling out bad behaviour is the biggest problem with our politics. (And as far as I can see Musk has removed the single most toxic influence on our politics by buying Twitter; even if the discourse on there is now worse than it was before, the benefit from real politicians no longer taking it seriously vastly outweighs any possible costs)

danparsonson 4y ago
The easy answer is that weaponised kindness and tolerance are not actually kindness and tolerance - the word 'weaponised' is the differentiator.
- lmm 4y ago
  Refraining from ever saying anything against a person's political views is genuinely kindness, or at least it's hard to argue that it isn't. It just does more harm in other ways. The redefinition of tolerance to mean deference to other people's absurd views is a travesty IMO, but that battle has already been lost. In any case this "easy answer" is useless in practice; arguing that these policies are unkind or intolerant at best gets you debating semantics, and is usually even less effective than that.
  - doctor_eval 4y ago
    > The redefinition of tolerance to mean deference to other people's absurd views is a travesty IMO, but that battle has already been lost. I'm not sure anything has been redefined. Tolerance is the ability to live in a world alongside people whose views you don't share. Kindness is the ability to treat those people with respect, despite disagreeing with them. It would be nice to see influential people expressing these views, instead of making things worse. It's basically impossible to provide examples without the conversation devolving, so I'll leave it there.

MrBuddyCasino 4y ago

> I like to think kindness and tolerance might be the solution to our political problems The irony of posting this while the black bar commemorates Bob Lees murder tastes very bitter.

abudabi123 4y ago

Advertising before a democracy's election is hot garbage on fire meandering down a flooded road and floating with old fossil fueled automobiles in the rain. The Master Plan 3 could have an annex to apply Super A.I. to subj/objective positioning of voter options summarising candidate's pro/cons in six paired bullet points addressing the advertised-to audience along the I.Q. bell-curve. There could be a 400-word GoogleGPT blurb extra to make the persuasive case either way for audiences unable to watch scifi movies like Solaris bu able to watch Spaceballs.

Dig1t 4y ago

Toxic politics being what? Seems like he’s on the right side of climate change, abortion rights. Is it just the freedom of speech thing? What’s wrong with being pro first amendment? That right, and absolutists who support it, are the biggest reason why the left has been able to gain so much power and make so much progress.

mikevm 4y ago
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- dragonwriter 4y ago
  > Ever since Musk turned Twitter into a more open platform That didn’t happen, though. > Reducing censorship became “toxic politics” Musk hasn’t reduced censorship. In fact, he very quickly stepped back from even claiming that, claiming instead that he was maintaining Twitter’s content policies (which, in fact, he never retracted) and even embracing artificial reach limitation (the same “shadowbanning” practice he had early complained of) as a means of enforcing it. It’s true that outside observers that have been tracking content on Twitter since long before Musk took over found that particular forms of hate and abuse (most banned by the written policy) took off under Musk, while other viewpoints (while not engaging in nominally banned conduct) were suppressed, but this shift in bias in content moderation is very much not the same as making it a “more open” platform. > Musk is now flagged as “not a real leftist” Musk was never considered even loosely a leftist. It’s very hard to see how a hypercapitalst (in class terms) could remain such while also being a leftist in ideological terms, but if such a contradictory character has ever existed, Musk was never it, and no one ever thought he was. Before he played footsie with Trump, Musk might have been pegged for a center-right neoliberal pro-weed capitalist with a horrible record on race relations that might manage to fit in with the right wing of the Demcocratic Party, but…that’s about as far left as anyone ever thought he was. > but a right winger, I mean, race and class issues aside, he’s been endorsing right-wing culture war positions on all the hot issues, so, yeah, that’s kind of how he’s asked to be seen, I don’t think he’s actually ideologically a right-wing culture war extremists, I think he’s just virtue-signalling to that camp because that faction has made naked its willingness to punish enemies and reward allies in industry, whereas the opposing political camp has generally been loathe to do so, at least openly and overtly. But, whatever the motive is, Musk has clearly made a conscious decision about how he wants to be seen, and how he is seen reflects that. > he’s probably done more for liberal causes than any of these authoritarian phonies. Leftists don’t support “liberal” causes.

_hypx 4y ago

It's honestly more of a grand vision of what a future society could look like, not anything any one company could accomplish. You read papers like this from many a futurist.

specialist 4y ago
Exactly right. Tesla's recent investor day presentation details their anticipated role in Master Plan 3. TLDR: 20m cars/year, new $25k model, charger network, battery storage, etc.

triggerwarn 4y ago

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zpeti 4y ago

How about we discuss the actual plan and you don’t bring your politics into this discussion? Wouldn’t that be nice for a place like HN for once. You really can’t stomach someone you disagree with politically creating an amazing vision and product that actually improves the world? Is politics that important?

triggerw4rn 4y ago

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mnky9800n 4y ago

this is all just a plot to take over the world. he clearly believes that he has the best ideas and therefore if everyone could just fall inline then things would run more smoothly. i mean think about it, he has a space based internet service that he can broadcast his ideas and control information flow any way he wants (especially when other sources of internet disappear). He now has a plan to control the energy distribution to the entire planet. This is lex luthor kind of plotting. or maybe im just letting my imagination run away with itself.

tim333 4y ago
Lex was more into causing wars and using super weapons but who knows - maybe Elon has us fooled!

ZeroGravitas 4y ago

Worth noting these aren't ideals or visions, nor are they really specific to Telsa or Musk. This is a summary of the common consensus that the entire world is working towards and has been for a while. This is just putting a set of numbers to it and summarising why the experts believe it's possible. Entire countries have adopted national economic strategies based on this stuff. It's not coming out of leftfield as a big surprise to anyone paying attention. https://energia.gob.cl/sites/default/files/national_green_hydrogen_strategy_-_chile.pdf https://energia.gob.cl/sites/default/files/national_green_hy...