20 ms·

Nothing will change. I was attacked in Christmas ‘21 in the Tenderloin, right after walking out of the KFC/Taco Bell on Eddy. Two cop cars drove by me and did n

Nothing will change. I was attacked in Christmas ‘21 in the Tenderloin, right after walking out of the KFC/Taco Bell on Eddy. Two cop cars drove by me and did nothing. It was only due to an ambulance finishing a run at Sutter and spotting me that I didn’t bleed out on the suitcase. I have video, proof of damages physical and financial, eyewitnesses and the info of the men who attacked me. SFPD will not arrest them because Boudin refused to prosecute. New DA has not gotten back to me despite repeated attempts. I wanted to build a life and have my family in SF, to contribute and make it the city I believe it to be, but I refuse to put people I love in that situation. I’ve left for Estonia and couldn’t be happier.

nisegami 4y ago
I wonder if they'd have declined to prosecute if you'd have shot your attackers.
quantified 4y ago
Boudin specifically declared in your case he would not prosecute? Did he leave a record of his reason? Or did the SFPD just say he would? SFPD went on holiday to make him look bad, so the difference is important.
- atdrummond 4y ago
  I should be clear it was his office (I’ve never talked to the man), not him, where I encountered the most trouble. SFPD at least feigned caring about my situation but repeatedly pleaded their hands were tied, that they could arrest but the men would end up back on the street in days. The new DA’s office has made a lot of promises but there’s been no substantial progress. Their continued increasing rates of prosecutions on violent crimes gives me a bit more hope that they’re truly battling through an immense backlog - but I’ve simply run out of patience and energy to fight the system in order to compel them to simply do their jobs.
  - quantified 4y ago
    I think the case against Boudin would be made if the police made the arrests and the DA did in fact refuse to prosecute. Maybe there would have been that case. What trouble did the DA's office give you?
    - atdrummond 4y ago
      During Boudin’s admin, I struggled to ever talk to anyone. I was able to confirm they had all the info I had collected and the various reports the police I had done. They did seem oddly interested if I felt there was a possibility I instigated the attack (I was assaulted seconds after walking out the door). Since Boudin left, they have been much more responsive and have intimated they well get to my case. I just haven’t seen any action yet - but they have been far easier to communicate with.
  - jeltz 4y ago
    Why did you just trust the police? They could be telling the truth but they could also be lying. And in either case they did not even bother to try. If they do not investigate and hand the case to the DA's office how would the DA be able to press charges? Their accusation against Boudain could be correct but they could just as well be lazy and blame it on what the DA's office may or may not do in the future.
    - microtherion 4y ago
      And, notably, the police had a pattern of lying about Boudin because he was trying to crack down on police misconduct. This led to absurd scenes such as the DA forced to rent a U-haul truck and rely on the assistance of federal agencies to transport seized stolen goods, and arrest a suspect after the bust of a major car burglary ring: https://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/SFPD-didnt-stop-Quickly-burglaries-17195981.php https://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/SFPD-didnt-stop-Quick... The police achieved their objective of getting Boudin replaced by a DA who would let them continue to act with impunity. As you seem to have experienced yourself, fighting (non-Police) crime does not seem to have changed much.
  - 4y ago
- soderfoo 4y ago
  In a broader sense, and without delving in to politics, administrative and resource constraints require District Attorneys to set priorities and guidelines to determine which matters to pursue. It is an ugly side of the criminal justice system I witnessed firsthand. DA's have a budget and a limited number of assistant attorneys. They have to manage their office's caseload, and keep cases they do pursue moving through the pipeline. Even then, they must compete with the priorities of the judiciary and individual judges to reduce their caseload and keep cases moving. It was not uncommon for judges to periodically advise prosecutors, public defenders and other key defense attorneys to convene a forum for the expeditious resolution of cases (essentially a fire sale with lots of bartering) to lessen their load and improve their KPIs. So I think it is fair to say, Chesa Boudin, in his capacity as managing attorney responsible for setting his office's prosecutorial discretion policy, refused to prosecute the case. No different from any other prosecutorial discretion decisions made by countless prosecutors around the country daily.
  - quantified 4y ago
    That's a bunch of words to say that the police just said so. And that the judges are part of the problem.
  - jeltz 4y ago
    How would the DA even be able to press charges if the police do not investigate at all because they claim that the DA will not press charges? The DA does not go round investigating criminal cases, they rely on the police for that. It was clearly the police who dropped the case, not the DA. Maybe the police have given up because they are correct in that the DA will not do anything, but they could just as well be blaming the DA for their own prioritization issues.
deeensta 4y ago
“ SFPD will not arrest them because Boudin refused to prosecute.” That’s not how it works. After being arrested, you press charges against them.
- atdrummond 4y ago
  You can go ahead and call and try to get something done. I spent two years on it and was stonewalled by both the PD and the DA’s office. It’s incredible when there are so many stories of the police doing nothing and statistical evidence of the previous DA not prosecuting cases, that you choose to, at best, accuse me of being imprecise with my terminology or, at worse, claim that I’m lying about one of the most traumatic events of my life.
  - woodruffw 4y ago
    I don't think they're accusing you of lying; I think what they're saying is that your expectations (and blame) are misplaced: the police are not empowered to make arrest decisions based on how likely they think the DA is to prosecute. The fact that they're making those decisions extralegally suggests that they were playing political hot potato to sink a DA they don't like. (It's worth noting that Boudin was recalled nearly a year ago, and so perhaps the SFPD will have discovered the will to cooperate with the new DA.)
    - DannyBee 4y ago
      Lawyer here: In the US, The police are so empowered and do it all the time. I am unsure why gp thinks otherwise. They are not required to nor do they simply get arrest warrants in every case they think they have probable cause. Anything else would be silly. They would get an arrest warrant, arrest, it would get dismissed without charges at the initial hearing a day later. If the DA is involved already or they know the office policy, Cops will not get an arrest warrant if the DA is not going to back them. If DA is not yet involved they may do it for various reasons, but again, they usually aren't going to touch it if they know the DA won't back them. They have too much to do to be that passive aggressive. As for the other part, Whether individuals can get arrest warrants actually varies from state to state, though it is very uncommon no matter what.
rainy59 4y ago
Yep same here. Estonia is a dream compared to Bay Area even with the cold winters and old Soviet buildings (which means lots of cheap rent btw). San Francisco has a powerful marketing and promotion engine - and yes it really is a gorgeous city in the late summer - but the weather otherwise is pretty miserable - almost as cold and rainy as Seattle I'm sure - given the option - any US west coast tech startup would much prefer to operate in some quaint old town in Eastern Europe with the cafes etc. and no need to hassle with a car. Unfortunately the venture community infrastructure / legal etc. is stuck on west coast - and AI is only reinforcing that
- comboy 4y ago
  Why Estonia of all the places? I'm assuming you guys were in the situation to choose whenever you wanted to move. Western Europe, Signapore, Australia, Switzerland? Why Estonia?
  - AlchemistCamp 4y ago
    Estonia is on a short list of places I'd consider moving to to found a company if the US weren't an option. My top three would probably be Singapore, Israel and Estonia. Of the three, Estonia is the most budget-friendly.
  - triggerwarn 4y ago
    [flagged]
  - logicchains 4y ago
    Most of those places you mention are relatively hostile to (foreign) startups, Estonia in comparison tries to encourage foreigners to open companies there.
    - wizofaus 4y ago
      How open is it to foreign workers on, say, 12-month contracts? Not that it's something I'm looking for right now but knowing it might be a possibility in a few year's time would be encouraging.
mjfl 4y ago
you made a good choice. hope to visit Estonia some day.
rvz 4y ago
> Nothing will change. What would it take for it to change? Really? It is never too late to change. But right now, the SF tech travel agents here and in the comments section are going to have a hard time at pitching that the city is 'safe' for them and now have to admit that it has gotten worse. But maybe we should start with identifying the 'problem' which has something to do with 'who' is running those streets and seeing if there is a patten in other cities in the US... Once you know, you will find your answer.
- notsosec 4y ago
  [flagged]
  - atlasunshrugged 4y ago
    Or state capacity? Education quality and equality measurements?
- seydor 4y ago
  I smell Robocop Startups rising
- bobsmooth 4y ago
  >What would it take for it to change? Putting criminals in jail and keeping them there.
- 32kfjh23 4y ago
  [flagged]
  - lizardking 4y ago
    Articulating the problem is political suicide in San Francisco and in most other progressive leaning cities as well. People pretend to not notice and or attribute the crime to other variables. It is impossible to fix a problem you won’t even identify, or have been gas lit out of being able to recognize.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
newbie578 4y ago
I just want to know why do people let the current status quo be in SF? I mean hearing cases like these makes you lean to the right even though you disagree with them, but when you look what the left is doing, you are left with no alternative..
- subsistence234 4y ago
  emperor's new clothes.
- millzlane 4y ago
  Why would hearing those make you lean to the right? When did putting violent criminals in jail become a "right leaning" thing?
  - brightball 4y ago
    Nothing really changed from a right leaning perspective. It’s been my perception that not putting all sorts of criminals in jail has become a left leaning thing over the last decade or so. The push to shut down private prisons, especially in California for example. By proxy that made it a right leaning thing. I’ve heard my more right wing friends suggest that a big Democratic donor has been specifically backing DAs who do this type of thing. I have no references for it at all, but I know that Desantis even mentioned it in the press while discussing the Trump charges in NY.
    - harimau777 4y ago
      Opposing private prisons doesn't imply opposing prisons in general. That's a strawman.
      - alienicecream 4y ago
        Logically no, but really that's what they want.
      - brightball 4y ago
brightball 4y ago
What I don’t understand is why it’s up to the DA? If a citizen wants to press charges what allows a DA to just decide not to? Seems like the DA should be charged with obstruction of justice.
- prasadjoglekar 4y ago
  Citizens can press civil charges, but the power to prosecute someone for jail time is reserved for the government. And the local and state governments, not the federal govt. DAs are elected, so notionally, Boudin, the DA for SF, is representating the will of the people by not prosecuting criminals deemed to be "low level crimes".
  - prottog 4y ago
    > not the federal govt U.S. Attorneys prosecute people for crimes that violate federal law, convictions which often result in time in federal prisons.
- millzlane 4y ago
  Not sure what is going on in SF. But in Baltimore they would have been arrested and chargeg. Sure the city might drop the charges if the police bungle the investigation purposely or due to incompetence. But people are arrested and charged.
- zenexer 4y ago
  Citizens don’t get to decide whether to press criminal charges; only the government can decide that. They may take the victim’s request into consideration, but that’s the extent of it.
rvba 4y ago
Are those who attacked you policemen or their family members? Or someone was bribed to look the other way?
- atdrummond 4y ago
  I don’t believe that is the case. I don’t think the police have been particularly “Johnny-on-the-spot” regarding the situation but I also don’t get the impression they’re actively stonewalling me.
  - graderjs 4y ago
    Is that how it works? I thought if a victim wanted to press charges, then police process it and the process starts. I understand in some places the police won't let tourists / non-locals press charges against locals--effectively giving locals a carte blanche to abuse/assault/harass outsiders however they want with zero repercussions, an implicit impunity they nevertheless seem to understand and most definitely actively exploit sadly, tragically and abusively--particularly if, and exacerbated by, language barriers--i.e, if you're a non-local victimized by a local who doesn't speak their language in such a place, like Taiwan, the locals feel pretty confident no one can touch them (tho I haven't heard of that happening in the USA)...what's the prosecutor got to do with it? Isn't it a police decision?
    - zenexer 4y ago
      > I thought if a victim wanted to press charges, then police process it and the process starts. In the US, victims can’t press criminal charges; only the government can. > what's the prosecutor got to do with it? Isn't it a police decision? Usually, it’s both. Ideally, the prosecutor decides whether to prosecute, but if the police never pass information along to the prosecutor, the decision is effectively being made by the police.
    - fluidcruft 4y ago
      I think you are correct but the DA office usually decides whether or not to proceed to court. It could be the DA has given the police "don't bother us with XYZ because we cannot go to court" and so the police don't bother either. Perhaps available jailspace is being triaged and that type of crime will ultimately be given a slap on the wrist so it's a waste of resources. I'm not in California but the news often has stories about California's jail overcrowding situation and having to early release criminals to make space.
weberer 4y ago
>SFPD will not arrest them because Boudin refused to prosecute. New DA has not gotten back to me despite repeated attempts. The same is happening in Philadelphia too. Its sad, because the city was on the upswing in the first half of the 2010's and making a lot of progress on reducing crime. Then a new DA came in and did a complete 180. Now its worse than ever. Look up videos of "Kensington, Philadelphia" on Youtube. Its like Mad Max these days.
- atdrummond 4y ago
  I drove through Kensington twice during my last visit to Philadelphia this past year. It seemed to me a conscious decision by the city to have one open air market that they couldn’t control but at least manage. Sacrifice Kensington and contain the violence and drugs everywhere else.
  - ethbr0 4y ago
    Man, that'd make a really good plot point in a show exploring the nuances of policing...
    - syzarian 4y ago
      The Wire is the best TV series in my opinion.
  - christkv 4y ago
    So basically the wire.
- beepbooptheory 4y ago
  I live in Philly. "Mad Max" is really pushing it and slightly offensive. It is still, like, society over here. Up until last year my gf worked everyday at a school in Kensington. She was never attacked by raiders or whatever. People everywhere have lives and are doing the best they can with what they've got.
  - 4y ago
harimau777 4y ago
A major problem as I see it is a lack of nuanced policy. Currently in America it seems that you can either have police brutality and criminalized homelessness or you can have non-enforcement. What we really need is to prosecute crime but without tolerating police brutality or making laws designed to punish the poor.
- causi 4y ago
  People with middle-ground attitudes seem to just get attacked by both sides nowadays.
  - ethbr0 4y ago
    Given the current state of voters, ranked choice seems like the best way to break the logjam by creating situations where palatable-to-all get elected over loved-by-most-hated-by-many.
    - refurb 4y ago
      That’s exactly how Chesa Boudin got elected to DA in SF - ranked choice.
      - ethbr0 4y ago
        It can be a bad option, but still the best of the alternatives.
        refurb 4y ago
        You can look up who lost. Basically an “old timer” Democrat and a “hard(er) on crime upstart”. Not sure we got the least worst.
        ethbr0 4y ago
        I meant ranked choice can be the least worst way of conducting democratic elections. Individual results will still rightly depend on voters. You can blunt the attraction of extremism, but hearts and minds need shifting before voters will take a fundamentally different approach.
MrBuddyCasino 4y ago
„Conservatives who think people will grow out of it, or that observable declines in quality of living or public safety will have an impact, don't get it. It's a faith, backed by power and media. You can't fight that with reason, especially when you are being silenced.“ https://twitter.com/vdarejamesk/status/1643462162776567808 https://twitter.com/vdarejamesk/status/1643462162776567808
- Xcelerate 4y ago
  I’ve lived in the southeast, the Bay Area, and Europe. The Bay Area is my favorite, but every time I go back to visit I’m just astonished — is this what the residents really want (well, SF more specifically)? I can see people agreeing with the group-think in public to fit in, but in the private of the voting booths they still vote for representatives and policies they know are going to destroy the city? It’s mind-blowing to me. Are we so split on issues to the point where we can’t have clean, safe, healthy, well-educated cities anymore?
  - MrBuddyCasino 4y ago
    Things that seem paradoxical and totally inexplicable like the one you mentioned, do have good (but not necessarily intuitive) explanations, but it takes a while to wrap your head around it. Its not even particularly obscure, leftism has been treated philosophically since centuries, often with astonishing foresight (eg Burnham). Check out Twitter & Substack, start with Yarvin and people associated with that sphere, and you shall be enlightened.
rswerve 4y ago
I don’t know your case, but it’s also possible that the police won’t make an arrest because police in America tend to go on low-key strike when a liberal prosecutor is elected, and then loudly proclaim that the DA is undermining the rule of law. This article is about a different kind of “police pullback,” but the underlying phenomenon—cops won’t work when they’re challenged—is the same. https://www.propublica.org/article/what-can-mayors-do-when-the-police-stop-doing-their-jobs/ https://www.propublica.org/article/what-can-mayors-do-when-t...
- syzarian 4y ago
  This has happened in Minneapolis. Since George Floyd police in Minneapolis have effectively stopped doing their job. When one of their own is treated by the law like anyone else would be they retaliate by refusing to work. Police feel entitled to be free of genuine consequence for their actions. For example, police commit more domestic violence on average than non-police and rarely get arrested for it.
  - pandaman 4y ago
    When they are treated like anyone else i.e. people who do not enforce the law they act like anyone else i.e. don't enforce the law, why would you expect anything else?
    - anoonmoose 4y ago
      because they took the job
      - pandaman 4y ago
        They took a job that had different conditions. It used to be that the police could arrest people and use force (why everyone else could not).
        syzarian 4y ago
rdtsc 4y ago
> SFPD will not arrest them because Boudin refused to prosecute It was explained to me a few times that it wasn’t supposed to be an issue. The police will just as eagerly do their job and arrest criminals. But that never made sense to me. What happened in your case seems a lot more likely. What would be the point in going through all the trouble arresting a suspect if there is a good chance charges will just be dropped.
lern_too_spel 4y ago
Why should police care whether the DA brings charges? Their job is to arrest people committing crimes. Besides, even Boudin would charge violent criminals. Your story sounds like a clear case of police not doing their jobs. https://missionlocal.org/2022/04/chesa-boudin-files-more-charges/ https://missionlocal.org/2022/04/chesa-boudin-files-more-cha...
maratbn 4y ago
Did Boudin specifically refuse to prosecute the men who stabbed you, or did the police simply refuse to arrest them claiming as an excuse that Boudin will not prosecute?
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- josephcsible 4y ago
  Did the lawnmower specifically chop off your hand, or did you simply refuse to stick your hand in it claiming as an excuse that the lawnmower would chop it off?
electriclove 4y ago
Anarchotyranny
mistrial9 4y ago
those fast food places are the site of regular drug deals -- hard drugs, all the time. The police do not know if you are a customer or what .. its an ugly situation.
roflyear 4y ago
The police don't do anything - anywhere - and this thread is a great example of why nothing gets done in SF. You have 1/3 of the people here saying SF needs more police. You have 1/3 saying the police don't do anything. You have 1/3 saying other things, dehumanizing homeless people, saying if everyone had a gun it'd be better, etc.. And this probably is not the case of "everyone is right" but rather "everyone is wrong!"

nisegami 4y ago

I wonder if they'd have declined to prosecute if you'd have shot your attackers.

quantified 4y ago

Boudin specifically declared in your case he would not prosecute? Did he leave a record of his reason? Or did the SFPD just say he would? SFPD went on holiday to make him look bad, so the difference is important.

atdrummond 4y ago
I should be clear it was his office (I’ve never talked to the man), not him, where I encountered the most trouble. SFPD at least feigned caring about my situation but repeatedly pleaded their hands were tied, that they could arrest but the men would end up back on the street in days. The new DA’s office has made a lot of promises but there’s been no substantial progress. Their continued increasing rates of prosecutions on violent crimes gives me a bit more hope that they’re truly battling through an immense backlog - but I’ve simply run out of patience and energy to fight the system in order to compel them to simply do their jobs.
- quantified 4y ago
  I think the case against Boudin would be made if the police made the arrests and the DA did in fact refuse to prosecute. Maybe there would have been that case. What trouble did the DA's office give you?
  - atdrummond 4y ago
    During Boudin’s admin, I struggled to ever talk to anyone. I was able to confirm they had all the info I had collected and the various reports the police I had done. They did seem oddly interested if I felt there was a possibility I instigated the attack (I was assaulted seconds after walking out the door). Since Boudin left, they have been much more responsive and have intimated they well get to my case. I just haven’t seen any action yet - but they have been far easier to communicate with.
- jeltz 4y ago
  Why did you just trust the police? They could be telling the truth but they could also be lying. And in either case they did not even bother to try. If they do not investigate and hand the case to the DA's office how would the DA be able to press charges? Their accusation against Boudain could be correct but they could just as well be lazy and blame it on what the DA's office may or may not do in the future.
  - microtherion 4y ago
    And, notably, the police had a pattern of lying about Boudin because he was trying to crack down on police misconduct. This led to absurd scenes such as the DA forced to rent a U-haul truck and rely on the assistance of federal agencies to transport seized stolen goods, and arrest a suspect after the bust of a major car burglary ring: https://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/SFPD-didnt-stop-Quickly-burglaries-17195981.php https://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/SFPD-didnt-stop-Quick... The police achieved their objective of getting Boudin replaced by a DA who would let them continue to act with impunity. As you seem to have experienced yourself, fighting (non-Police) crime does not seem to have changed much.
- 4y ago
soderfoo 4y ago
In a broader sense, and without delving in to politics, administrative and resource constraints require District Attorneys to set priorities and guidelines to determine which matters to pursue. It is an ugly side of the criminal justice system I witnessed firsthand. DA's have a budget and a limited number of assistant attorneys. They have to manage their office's caseload, and keep cases they do pursue moving through the pipeline. Even then, they must compete with the priorities of the judiciary and individual judges to reduce their caseload and keep cases moving. It was not uncommon for judges to periodically advise prosecutors, public defenders and other key defense attorneys to convene a forum for the expeditious resolution of cases (essentially a fire sale with lots of bartering) to lessen their load and improve their KPIs. So I think it is fair to say, Chesa Boudin, in his capacity as managing attorney responsible for setting his office's prosecutorial discretion policy, refused to prosecute the case. No different from any other prosecutorial discretion decisions made by countless prosecutors around the country daily.
- quantified 4y ago
  That's a bunch of words to say that the police just said so. And that the judges are part of the problem.
- jeltz 4y ago
  How would the DA even be able to press charges if the police do not investigate at all because they claim that the DA will not press charges? The DA does not go round investigating criminal cases, they rely on the police for that. It was clearly the police who dropped the case, not the DA. Maybe the police have given up because they are correct in that the DA will not do anything, but they could just as well be blaming the DA for their own prioritization issues.

deeensta 4y ago

“ SFPD will not arrest them because Boudin refused to prosecute.” That’s not how it works. After being arrested, you press charges against them.

atdrummond 4y ago
You can go ahead and call and try to get something done. I spent two years on it and was stonewalled by both the PD and the DA’s office. It’s incredible when there are so many stories of the police doing nothing and statistical evidence of the previous DA not prosecuting cases, that you choose to, at best, accuse me of being imprecise with my terminology or, at worse, claim that I’m lying about one of the most traumatic events of my life.
- woodruffw 4y ago
  I don't think they're accusing you of lying; I think what they're saying is that your expectations (and blame) are misplaced: the police are not empowered to make arrest decisions based on how likely they think the DA is to prosecute. The fact that they're making those decisions extralegally suggests that they were playing political hot potato to sink a DA they don't like. (It's worth noting that Boudin was recalled nearly a year ago, and so perhaps the SFPD will have discovered the will to cooperate with the new DA.)
  - DannyBee 4y ago
    Lawyer here: In the US, The police are so empowered and do it all the time. I am unsure why gp thinks otherwise. They are not required to nor do they simply get arrest warrants in every case they think they have probable cause. Anything else would be silly. They would get an arrest warrant, arrest, it would get dismissed without charges at the initial hearing a day later. If the DA is involved already or they know the office policy, Cops will not get an arrest warrant if the DA is not going to back them. If DA is not yet involved they may do it for various reasons, but again, they usually aren't going to touch it if they know the DA won't back them. They have too much to do to be that passive aggressive. As for the other part, Whether individuals can get arrest warrants actually varies from state to state, though it is very uncommon no matter what.

rainy59 4y ago

Yep same here. Estonia is a dream compared to Bay Area even with the cold winters and old Soviet buildings (which means lots of cheap rent btw). San Francisco has a powerful marketing and promotion engine - and yes it really is a gorgeous city in the late summer - but the weather otherwise is pretty miserable - almost as cold and rainy as Seattle I'm sure - given the option - any US west coast tech startup would much prefer to operate in some quaint old town in Eastern Europe with the cafes etc. and no need to hassle with a car. Unfortunately the venture community infrastructure / legal etc. is stuck on west coast - and AI is only reinforcing that

comboy 4y ago
Why Estonia of all the places? I'm assuming you guys were in the situation to choose whenever you wanted to move. Western Europe, Signapore, Australia, Switzerland? Why Estonia?
- AlchemistCamp 4y ago
  Estonia is on a short list of places I'd consider moving to to found a company if the US weren't an option. My top three would probably be Singapore, Israel and Estonia. Of the three, Estonia is the most budget-friendly.
- triggerwarn 4y ago
  [flagged]
- logicchains 4y ago
  Most of those places you mention are relatively hostile to (foreign) startups, Estonia in comparison tries to encourage foreigners to open companies there.
  - wizofaus 4y ago
    How open is it to foreign workers on, say, 12-month contracts? Not that it's something I'm looking for right now but knowing it might be a possibility in a few year's time would be encouraging.

mjfl 4y ago

you made a good choice. hope to visit Estonia some day.

rvz 4y ago

> Nothing will change. What would it take for it to change? Really? It is never too late to change. But right now, the SF tech travel agents here and in the comments section are going to have a hard time at pitching that the city is 'safe' for them and now have to admit that it has gotten worse. But maybe we should start with identifying the 'problem' which has something to do with 'who' is running those streets and seeing if there is a patten in other cities in the US... Once you know, you will find your answer.

notsosec 4y ago
[flagged]
- atlasunshrugged 4y ago
  Or state capacity? Education quality and equality measurements?
seydor 4y ago
I smell Robocop Startups rising
bobsmooth 4y ago
>What would it take for it to change? Putting criminals in jail and keeping them there.
32kfjh23 4y ago
[flagged]
- lizardking 4y ago
  Articulating the problem is political suicide in San Francisco and in most other progressive leaning cities as well. People pretend to not notice and or attribute the crime to other variables. It is impossible to fix a problem you won’t even identify, or have been gas lit out of being able to recognize.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

newbie578 4y ago

I just want to know why do people let the current status quo be in SF? I mean hearing cases like these makes you lean to the right even though you disagree with them, but when you look what the left is doing, you are left with no alternative..

subsistence234 4y ago
emperor's new clothes.
millzlane 4y ago
Why would hearing those make you lean to the right? When did putting violent criminals in jail become a "right leaning" thing?
- brightball 4y ago
  Nothing really changed from a right leaning perspective. It’s been my perception that not putting all sorts of criminals in jail has become a left leaning thing over the last decade or so. The push to shut down private prisons, especially in California for example. By proxy that made it a right leaning thing. I’ve heard my more right wing friends suggest that a big Democratic donor has been specifically backing DAs who do this type of thing. I have no references for it at all, but I know that Desantis even mentioned it in the press while discussing the Trump charges in NY.
  - harimau777 4y ago
    Opposing private prisons doesn't imply opposing prisons in general. That's a strawman.
    - alienicecream 4y ago
      Logically no, but really that's what they want.
    - brightball 4y ago

brightball 4y ago

What I don’t understand is why it’s up to the DA? If a citizen wants to press charges what allows a DA to just decide not to? Seems like the DA should be charged with obstruction of justice.

prasadjoglekar 4y ago
Citizens can press civil charges, but the power to prosecute someone for jail time is reserved for the government. And the local and state governments, not the federal govt. DAs are elected, so notionally, Boudin, the DA for SF, is representating the will of the people by not prosecuting criminals deemed to be "low level crimes".
- prottog 4y ago
  > not the federal govt U.S. Attorneys prosecute people for crimes that violate federal law, convictions which often result in time in federal prisons.
millzlane 4y ago
Not sure what is going on in SF. But in Baltimore they would have been arrested and chargeg. Sure the city might drop the charges if the police bungle the investigation purposely or due to incompetence. But people are arrested and charged.
zenexer 4y ago
Citizens don’t get to decide whether to press criminal charges; only the government can decide that. They may take the victim’s request into consideration, but that’s the extent of it.

rvba 4y ago

Are those who attacked you policemen or their family members? Or someone was bribed to look the other way?

atdrummond 4y ago
I don’t believe that is the case. I don’t think the police have been particularly “Johnny-on-the-spot” regarding the situation but I also don’t get the impression they’re actively stonewalling me.
- graderjs 4y ago
  Is that how it works? I thought if a victim wanted to press charges, then police process it and the process starts. I understand in some places the police won't let tourists / non-locals press charges against locals--effectively giving locals a carte blanche to abuse/assault/harass outsiders however they want with zero repercussions, an implicit impunity they nevertheless seem to understand and most definitely actively exploit sadly, tragically and abusively--particularly if, and exacerbated by, language barriers--i.e, if you're a non-local victimized by a local who doesn't speak their language in such a place, like Taiwan, the locals feel pretty confident no one can touch them (tho I haven't heard of that happening in the USA)...what's the prosecutor got to do with it? Isn't it a police decision?
  - zenexer 4y ago
    > I thought if a victim wanted to press charges, then police process it and the process starts. In the US, victims can’t press criminal charges; only the government can. > what's the prosecutor got to do with it? Isn't it a police decision? Usually, it’s both. Ideally, the prosecutor decides whether to prosecute, but if the police never pass information along to the prosecutor, the decision is effectively being made by the police.
  - fluidcruft 4y ago
    I think you are correct but the DA office usually decides whether or not to proceed to court. It could be the DA has given the police "don't bother us with XYZ because we cannot go to court" and so the police don't bother either. Perhaps available jailspace is being triaged and that type of crime will ultimately be given a slap on the wrist so it's a waste of resources. I'm not in California but the news often has stories about California's jail overcrowding situation and having to early release criminals to make space.

weberer 4y ago

>SFPD will not arrest them because Boudin refused to prosecute. New DA has not gotten back to me despite repeated attempts. The same is happening in Philadelphia too. Its sad, because the city was on the upswing in the first half of the 2010's and making a lot of progress on reducing crime. Then a new DA came in and did a complete 180. Now its worse than ever. Look up videos of "Kensington, Philadelphia" on Youtube. Its like Mad Max these days.

atdrummond 4y ago
I drove through Kensington twice during my last visit to Philadelphia this past year. It seemed to me a conscious decision by the city to have one open air market that they couldn’t control but at least manage. Sacrifice Kensington and contain the violence and drugs everywhere else.
- ethbr0 4y ago
  Man, that'd make a really good plot point in a show exploring the nuances of policing...
  - syzarian 4y ago
    The Wire is the best TV series in my opinion.
- christkv 4y ago
  So basically the wire.
beepbooptheory 4y ago
I live in Philly. "Mad Max" is really pushing it and slightly offensive. It is still, like, society over here. Up until last year my gf worked everyday at a school in Kensington. She was never attacked by raiders or whatever. People everywhere have lives and are doing the best they can with what they've got.
- 4y ago

harimau777 4y ago

A major problem as I see it is a lack of nuanced policy. Currently in America it seems that you can either have police brutality and criminalized homelessness or you can have non-enforcement. What we really need is to prosecute crime but without tolerating police brutality or making laws designed to punish the poor.

causi 4y ago
People with middle-ground attitudes seem to just get attacked by both sides nowadays.
- ethbr0 4y ago
  Given the current state of voters, ranked choice seems like the best way to break the logjam by creating situations where palatable-to-all get elected over loved-by-most-hated-by-many.
  - refurb 4y ago
    That’s exactly how Chesa Boudin got elected to DA in SF - ranked choice.
    - ethbr0 4y ago
      It can be a bad option, but still the best of the alternatives.
      - refurb 4y ago
        You can look up who lost. Basically an “old timer” Democrat and a “hard(er) on crime upstart”. Not sure we got the least worst.
        ethbr0 4y ago
        I meant ranked choice can be the least worst way of conducting democratic elections. Individual results will still rightly depend on voters. You can blunt the attraction of extremism, but hearts and minds need shifting before voters will take a fundamentally different approach.

MrBuddyCasino 4y ago

„Conservatives who think people will grow out of it, or that observable declines in quality of living or public safety will have an impact, don't get it. It's a faith, backed by power and media. You can't fight that with reason, especially when you are being silenced.“ https://twitter.com/vdarejamesk/status/1643462162776567808 https://twitter.com/vdarejamesk/status/1643462162776567808

Xcelerate 4y ago
I’ve lived in the southeast, the Bay Area, and Europe. The Bay Area is my favorite, but every time I go back to visit I’m just astonished — is this what the residents really want (well, SF more specifically)? I can see people agreeing with the group-think in public to fit in, but in the private of the voting booths they still vote for representatives and policies they know are going to destroy the city? It’s mind-blowing to me. Are we so split on issues to the point where we can’t have clean, safe, healthy, well-educated cities anymore?
- MrBuddyCasino 4y ago
  Things that seem paradoxical and totally inexplicable like the one you mentioned, do have good (but not necessarily intuitive) explanations, but it takes a while to wrap your head around it. Its not even particularly obscure, leftism has been treated philosophically since centuries, often with astonishing foresight (eg Burnham). Check out Twitter & Substack, start with Yarvin and people associated with that sphere, and you shall be enlightened.

rswerve 4y ago

I don’t know your case, but it’s also possible that the police won’t make an arrest because police in America tend to go on low-key strike when a liberal prosecutor is elected, and then loudly proclaim that the DA is undermining the rule of law. This article is about a different kind of “police pullback,” but the underlying phenomenon—cops won’t work when they’re challenged—is the same. https://www.propublica.org/article/what-can-mayors-do-when-the-police-stop-doing-their-jobs/ https://www.propublica.org/article/what-can-mayors-do-when-t...

syzarian 4y ago
This has happened in Minneapolis. Since George Floyd police in Minneapolis have effectively stopped doing their job. When one of their own is treated by the law like anyone else would be they retaliate by refusing to work. Police feel entitled to be free of genuine consequence for their actions. For example, police commit more domestic violence on average than non-police and rarely get arrested for it.
- pandaman 4y ago
  When they are treated like anyone else i.e. people who do not enforce the law they act like anyone else i.e. don't enforce the law, why would you expect anything else?
  - anoonmoose 4y ago
    because they took the job
    - pandaman 4y ago
      They took a job that had different conditions. It used to be that the police could arrest people and use force (why everyone else could not).
      - syzarian 4y ago

rdtsc 4y ago

> SFPD will not arrest them because Boudin refused to prosecute It was explained to me a few times that it wasn’t supposed to be an issue. The police will just as eagerly do their job and arrest criminals. But that never made sense to me. What happened in your case seems a lot more likely. What would be the point in going through all the trouble arresting a suspect if there is a good chance charges will just be dropped.

lern_too_spel 4y ago

Why should police care whether the DA brings charges? Their job is to arrest people committing crimes. Besides, even Boudin would charge violent criminals. Your story sounds like a clear case of police not doing their jobs. https://missionlocal.org/2022/04/chesa-boudin-files-more-charges/ https://missionlocal.org/2022/04/chesa-boudin-files-more-cha...

maratbn 4y ago

Did Boudin specifically refuse to prosecute the men who stabbed you, or did the police simply refuse to arrest them claiming as an excuse that Boudin will not prosecute?

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
josephcsible 4y ago
Did the lawnmower specifically chop off your hand, or did you simply refuse to stick your hand in it claiming as an excuse that the lawnmower would chop it off?

electriclove 4y ago

Anarchotyranny

mistrial9 4y ago

those fast food places are the site of regular drug deals -- hard drugs, all the time. The police do not know if you are a customer or what .. its an ugly situation.

roflyear 4y ago

The police don't do anything - anywhere - and this thread is a great example of why nothing gets done in SF. You have 1/3 of the people here saying SF needs more police. You have 1/3 saying the police don't do anything. You have 1/3 saying other things, dehumanizing homeless people, saying if everyone had a gun it'd be better, etc.. And this probably is not the case of "everyone is right" but rather "everyone is wrong!"