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> People have become used to the thin ozone layer. In much of the world, you now can't stay outside all day without getting sunburn. There are not many reports

> People have become used to the thin ozone layer. In much of the world, you now can't stay outside all day without getting sunburn. There are not many reports of sunburn from 100 years ago. So are you saying we evolved skin melanin production from UV radiation for no reason whatsoever? People that live in the desert used to (and still do) cover themselves with clothing just because of fashion standards? Sunburn has been a problem for our species ever since we shed most of our fur.

londons_explore 4y ago
Romans were believed to have a 'pale white' skin. They lived in Rome, and while there are records of sunshades (Velarium), it doesn't seem they were common. For example, the colosseum, a place people might stay many hours, had only 30% coverage. I don't think someone with similar skin would last long in Rome in the sun today...
- outworlder 4y ago
  > A strong distinction in skin color is frequently seen in the portrayal of men and women in Ancient Rome. Since women in Ancient Rome were traditionally expected to stay inside and out of the sun, they were usually quite pale; whereas men were expected to go outside and work in the sun, so they were usually deeply tanned Those commoners sometimes wore hats (pileus) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_people_in_ancient_Roman_history https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_people_in_ancient_Roman_... There are also descriptions of treatments for sunburn. There's no doubt that the ozone layer depletion increases the amount of UV light that we receive. Sometimes dramatically(very location dependent). But it's not like people could just toast in the sun all day without protection and not get burned.
- barkingcat 4y ago
  People also had much lower life expectancies. I don't think it's useful to say that because the people in antiquity didn't have sun protection they were stronger or somehow immune to sunburns ... maybe they just died before living long enough for it to matter. Or maybe they all died from cancers of all kinds, just not categorized as such, or died by murder / wars before cancer became an issue.
  - kadoban 4y ago
    The vast majority of historically lower life expectancies is due to changes in death rates in the first few years. People who made it to adulthood weren't all keeling over at 35.
    - Lewton 4y ago
      https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/life-expectancy-at-age-15?time=1798 https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/life-expectancy-at-age-15... Life expectancy at age 15 has gone up from 60 to 90 That’s still a massive increase
- meindnoch 4y ago
  Modern people barely spend time outside compared to the Romans. No wonder we're getting sunburnt when we finally go out in peak summer. If you spend most of your time outside year round, you'll develop a natural deep tan which offers considerable protection from the sun.
  - waboremo 4y ago
    Why risk melanoma for a little bit of "natural protection" when sun screen exists?
    - robocat 4y ago
      AFAIK the biggest risk of melanoma occurs from sunburn. I would guess a protective tan from regular sunlight is probably healthy overall (depending on how you get your tan: confounding benefits and risks for any activity would drown out signal?). Lifestyle risks trump melanoma risks.
    - meindnoch 4y ago
      Chronic sun exposure affects the skin differently than intermittent:https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Differential-dependence-of-melanoma-subgroups-on-sun-exposure-and-types-of-gene_fig1_331818745 https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Differential-dependence-... If you stay indoors 95% of your time, then yes, by all means, use as much sunscreen as you can. If you spend most of your time outside your whole life, your skin is already conditioned to deal with UV damage. Otherwise we would have gone extinct due to skin cancer, aren't we?
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]

londons_explore 4y ago

Romans were believed to have a 'pale white' skin. They lived in Rome, and while there are records of sunshades (Velarium), it doesn't seem they were common. For example, the colosseum, a place people might stay many hours, had only 30% coverage. I don't think someone with similar skin would last long in Rome in the sun today...

outworlder 4y ago
> A strong distinction in skin color is frequently seen in the portrayal of men and women in Ancient Rome. Since women in Ancient Rome were traditionally expected to stay inside and out of the sun, they were usually quite pale; whereas men were expected to go outside and work in the sun, so they were usually deeply tanned Those commoners sometimes wore hats (pileus) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_people_in_ancient_Roman_history https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_people_in_ancient_Roman_... There are also descriptions of treatments for sunburn. There's no doubt that the ozone layer depletion increases the amount of UV light that we receive. Sometimes dramatically(very location dependent). But it's not like people could just toast in the sun all day without protection and not get burned.
barkingcat 4y ago
People also had much lower life expectancies. I don't think it's useful to say that because the people in antiquity didn't have sun protection they were stronger or somehow immune to sunburns ... maybe they just died before living long enough for it to matter. Or maybe they all died from cancers of all kinds, just not categorized as such, or died by murder / wars before cancer became an issue.
- kadoban 4y ago
  The vast majority of historically lower life expectancies is due to changes in death rates in the first few years. People who made it to adulthood weren't all keeling over at 35.
  - Lewton 4y ago
    https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/life-expectancy-at-age-15?time=1798 https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/life-expectancy-at-age-15... Life expectancy at age 15 has gone up from 60 to 90 That’s still a massive increase
meindnoch 4y ago
Modern people barely spend time outside compared to the Romans. No wonder we're getting sunburnt when we finally go out in peak summer. If you spend most of your time outside year round, you'll develop a natural deep tan which offers considerable protection from the sun.
- waboremo 4y ago
  Why risk melanoma for a little bit of "natural protection" when sun screen exists?
  - robocat 4y ago
    AFAIK the biggest risk of melanoma occurs from sunburn. I would guess a protective tan from regular sunlight is probably healthy overall (depending on how you get your tan: confounding benefits and risks for any activity would drown out signal?). Lifestyle risks trump melanoma risks.
  - meindnoch 4y ago
    Chronic sun exposure affects the skin differently than intermittent:https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Differential-dependence-of-melanoma-subgroups-on-sun-exposure-and-types-of-gene_fig1_331818745 https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Differential-dependence-... If you stay indoors 95% of your time, then yes, by all means, use as much sunscreen as you can. If you spend most of your time outside your whole life, your skin is already conditioned to deal with UV damage. Otherwise we would have gone extinct due to skin cancer, aren't we?
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]