9 ms·

> Andreessen Horowitz is now openly courting capital from Saudi Arabia, despite U.S. strains. I didn't know US' relations with Saudi Arabia were strained. SA i

by hiyer 4y ago

> Andreessen Horowitz is now openly courting capital from Saudi Arabia, despite U.S. strains. I didn't know US' relations with Saudi Arabia were strained. SA imports hundreds of millions of dollars in weapons from USA every year.

anonkogudhyfhhf 4y ago
They did murder an American journalist for criticising their rules in his writing
- samirillian 4y ago
  [flagged]
  - jjtheblunt 4y ago
    What?
    - aww_dang 4y ago
      >Abdulrahman Anwar al-Awlaki was a 16-year-old United States citizen who was killed while eating dinner at an outdoor restaurant in Yemen by a drone airstrike ordered by U.S. President Barack Obama on October 14, 2011. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Abdulrahman_al-Awlaki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Abdulrahman_al-Awla... >Nawar "Nora" al-Awlaki was an eight-year-old American citizen who was killed on January 29, 2017, during the Raid on Yakla, a commando attack ordered by U.S. President Donald Trump https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Nawar_al-Awlaki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Nawar_al-Awlaki >Anwar Nasser Abdulla al-Awlaki was an American imam who was killed in 2011 in Yemen by a U.S. government drone strike ordered by President Barack Obama. Al-Awlaki became the first U.S. citizen to be targeted and killed by a drone strike from the U.S. government.[7][8] US government officials argued that Awlaki was a key organizer for the Islamist terrorist group al-Qaeda... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anwar_al-Awlaki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anwar_al-Awlaki
      - jjtheblunt 4y ago
        I didn’t know about these. Thanks for the links and explanation.
  - boomboomsubban 4y ago
    Significantly less American than Anwar al-Awlaki, the US citizen Obama ordered assassinated. Jamal Khashoggi was a US resident, but never gained citizenship.
    - CydeWeys 4y ago
      He was an al Qaeda member with ties to 9/11. Not the same situation at all as a journalist.
      - naturalauction 4y ago
        Sure, but his son (who was also killed in a separate strike) was 4 when 9/11 happened and was 16 when he was killed.
      - boomboomsubban 4y ago
        Terrorist or not, he was a US citizen entitled to a fair trial.
        CydeWeys 4y ago
        Every Confederate killed during the Civil War was a US citizen too (secession is illegal and not recognized). At some point, if people are trying to kill you, you kill them back.
        boomboomsubban 4y ago
        Equating an army marching on your city and a man saying things in Yemen is silly.
        CydeWeys 4y ago
        By the end of the war we were the ones marching on them, killing them in their cities, and burning them down. War is war. The world would be a better, safer place for us if every single al Qaeda member worldwide were dead. I'm glad the US military is trying to get as many of them as possible. The main issue I'm worried about here is collateral damage -- that can cause the actions to be counter-productive.
  - TheGigaChad 4y ago
    [dead]
- mc32 4y ago
  [flagged]
  - chii 4y ago
    if he was an american citizen, then he's american. Doesn't matter who or what he's working for.
    - yunohn 4y ago
      He was born and raised in Saudi Arabia, which is how he became such a harsh critic of the country’s shortcomings. He was never a citizen of the USA. https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1035565/jamal-khashoggi-murder-nationality-saudi-arabia-journalist-remains https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1035565/jamal-khashoggi...
    - khuey 4y ago
      He had a green card.
      - mc32 4y ago
        A green card is a residency card; it does not confer citizenship. Lots of Journalists with American citizenship have residency cards of other countries in order to be able to work from those places. It does not make them Japanese, or Korean or Chinese, etc.
        x86x87 4y ago
        Your mental gymnastics are through the roof.
        988747 4y ago
        What mental gymnastics? Green card is not citizenship, green card holders are not Americans, they don't have American passports.
- bumbledraven 4y ago
  He was Saudi, not American. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamal_Khashoggi https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamal_Khashoggi : “Jamal Ahmad Khashoggi … was a Saudi journalist, dissident, author…”
  - cguess 4y ago
    Who lived and worked in the US for a US newspaper for years. Murdering any journalist, technically yours or not, is a bad look.
  - mhoad 4y ago
    Imagine trying to defend this on a technicality. Great job.
alephnerd 4y ago
US-Saudi relations have been strained since the Iraq War (KSA supported Saddam as a bulwark against Iran) [0][1], and faced a further tumble during the Arab Spring because of the US not pushing back against Qatar's support of the Muslim Brotherhood leading to strained Saudi relations in Egypt, Turkey, Pakistan and Libya [2] (Khashoggi was a casualty of the Saudi-Qatar rivalry - it's open knowledge on the Hill [7], doesn't excuse his murder though) While American weapons do still top Saudi purchases, this is largely in brownfield weapons systems such as the F-15E [3]. For new weapons platforms, the Saudi Armed Forces have increasingly pivoted to Europe (Eurofighter) [4], South Korea (replace the F-15e's munitions and planes with next-gen KAI platforms) [5], and the PRC (UAVs and Cruise Missiles) [6] In my opinion, all of this is due to Americans - both policymakers and voters - having Orientalist perceptions and stereotypes of the Middle East that are still stuck in the 80s and 90s and which has lead regional powers to hoof it on their own. The old guard of Saudis who were extremely pro-American all passed away or retired from political life and the newer generation of Saudis have become increasingly disillusioned with the US. Also, the Saudi govt is stopping it's foreign scholarship program and so if you're paying out of pocket, European programs make more sense or Saudi universities which ain't that shabby anymore either due to extremely competitive hiring packages to EU and Asian nationals. Addendum: Totally forgot about the Fracking boom in 2014-16 causing a trade war between the KSA and USA [8] [0] - https://www.wilsoncenter.org/event/saudi-arabia-and-the-iraq-war https://www.wilsoncenter.org/event/saudi-arabia-and-the-iraq... [1] - http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/03/18/sprj.irq.saudi/ http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/03/18/sprj.irq.saudi/ [2] - https://www.jstor.org/stable/48673735 https://www.jstor.org/stable/48673735 [3] - https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/defense/2015-10-06/us-air-force-contract-supply-repair-saudi-f-15s https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/defense/2015-10-06/u... [4] - https://www.wsj.com/articles/saudi-arabia-agrees-to-buy-more-typhoon-combat-jets-1520617435 https://www.wsj.com/articles/saudi-arabia-agrees-to-buy-more... [5] - https://www.tacticalreport.com/news/article/8047-saudi-arabia-rsaf-kai-and-fa-50-combat-aircraft https://www.tacticalreport.com/news/article/8047-saudi-arabi... [6] - https://www.cnn.com/2021/12/23/politics/saudi-ballistic-missiles-china/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2021/12/23/politics/saudi-ballistic-miss... [7] - https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2023/02/03/pompeo-washington-post-jamal-khashoggi-00081017 https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2023/02/03/pompeo-was... [8] - https://www.reuters.com/article/us-oil-shale-kemp/is-saudi-arabia-winning-the-war-against-shale-kemp-idUSKCN0VR2AB https://www.reuters.com/article/us-oil-shale-kemp/is-saudi-a...
rurp 4y ago
Saudi Arabia's abysmal human rights record makes that kind of trade pretty embarrassing for the US. Not embarrassing enough to cut ties, but there is some tension there.

by hiyer 4y ago

anonkogudhyfhhf 4y ago

They did murder an American journalist for criticising their rules in his writing

samirillian 4y ago
[flagged]
- jjtheblunt 4y ago
  What?
  - aww_dang 4y ago
    >Abdulrahman Anwar al-Awlaki was a 16-year-old United States citizen who was killed while eating dinner at an outdoor restaurant in Yemen by a drone airstrike ordered by U.S. President Barack Obama on October 14, 2011. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Abdulrahman_al-Awlaki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Abdulrahman_al-Awla... >Nawar "Nora" al-Awlaki was an eight-year-old American citizen who was killed on January 29, 2017, during the Raid on Yakla, a commando attack ordered by U.S. President Donald Trump https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Nawar_al-Awlaki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Nawar_al-Awlaki >Anwar Nasser Abdulla al-Awlaki was an American imam who was killed in 2011 in Yemen by a U.S. government drone strike ordered by President Barack Obama. Al-Awlaki became the first U.S. citizen to be targeted and killed by a drone strike from the U.S. government.[7][8] US government officials argued that Awlaki was a key organizer for the Islamist terrorist group al-Qaeda... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anwar_al-Awlaki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anwar_al-Awlaki
    - jjtheblunt 4y ago
      I didn’t know about these. Thanks for the links and explanation.
- boomboomsubban 4y ago
  Significantly less American than Anwar al-Awlaki, the US citizen Obama ordered assassinated. Jamal Khashoggi was a US resident, but never gained citizenship.
  - CydeWeys 4y ago
    He was an al Qaeda member with ties to 9/11. Not the same situation at all as a journalist.
    - naturalauction 4y ago
      Sure, but his son (who was also killed in a separate strike) was 4 when 9/11 happened and was 16 when he was killed.
    - boomboomsubban 4y ago
      Terrorist or not, he was a US citizen entitled to a fair trial.
      - CydeWeys 4y ago
        Every Confederate killed during the Civil War was a US citizen too (secession is illegal and not recognized). At some point, if people are trying to kill you, you kill them back.
        boomboomsubban 4y ago
        Equating an army marching on your city and a man saying things in Yemen is silly.
        CydeWeys 4y ago
        By the end of the war we were the ones marching on them, killing them in their cities, and burning them down. War is war. The world would be a better, safer place for us if every single al Qaeda member worldwide were dead. I'm glad the US military is trying to get as many of them as possible. The main issue I'm worried about here is collateral damage -- that can cause the actions to be counter-productive.
- TheGigaChad 4y ago
  [dead]
mc32 4y ago
[flagged]
- chii 4y ago
  if he was an american citizen, then he's american. Doesn't matter who or what he's working for.
  - yunohn 4y ago
    He was born and raised in Saudi Arabia, which is how he became such a harsh critic of the country’s shortcomings. He was never a citizen of the USA. https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1035565/jamal-khashoggi-murder-nationality-saudi-arabia-journalist-remains https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1035565/jamal-khashoggi...
  - khuey 4y ago
    He had a green card.
    - mc32 4y ago
      A green card is a residency card; it does not confer citizenship. Lots of Journalists with American citizenship have residency cards of other countries in order to be able to work from those places. It does not make them Japanese, or Korean or Chinese, etc.
      - x86x87 4y ago
        Your mental gymnastics are through the roof.
        988747 4y ago
        What mental gymnastics? Green card is not citizenship, green card holders are not Americans, they don't have American passports.
bumbledraven 4y ago
He was Saudi, not American. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamal_Khashoggi https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamal_Khashoggi : “Jamal Ahmad Khashoggi … was a Saudi journalist, dissident, author…”
- cguess 4y ago
  Who lived and worked in the US for a US newspaper for years. Murdering any journalist, technically yours or not, is a bad look.
- mhoad 4y ago
  Imagine trying to defend this on a technicality. Great job.

alephnerd 4y ago

US-Saudi relations have been strained since the Iraq War (KSA supported Saddam as a bulwark against Iran) [0][1], and faced a further tumble during the Arab Spring because of the US not pushing back against Qatar's support of the Muslim Brotherhood leading to strained Saudi relations in Egypt, Turkey, Pakistan and Libya [2] (Khashoggi was a casualty of the Saudi-Qatar rivalry - it's open knowledge on the Hill [7], doesn't excuse his murder though) While American weapons do still top Saudi purchases, this is largely in brownfield weapons systems such as the F-15E [3]. For new weapons platforms, the Saudi Armed Forces have increasingly pivoted to Europe (Eurofighter) [4], South Korea (replace the F-15e's munitions and planes with next-gen KAI platforms) [5], and the PRC (UAVs and Cruise Missiles) [6] In my opinion, all of this is due to Americans - both policymakers and voters - having Orientalist perceptions and stereotypes of the Middle East that are still stuck in the 80s and 90s and which has lead regional powers to hoof it on their own. The old guard of Saudis who were extremely pro-American all passed away or retired from political life and the newer generation of Saudis have become increasingly disillusioned with the US. Also, the Saudi govt is stopping it's foreign scholarship program and so if you're paying out of pocket, European programs make more sense or Saudi universities which ain't that shabby anymore either due to extremely competitive hiring packages to EU and Asian nationals. Addendum: Totally forgot about the Fracking boom in 2014-16 causing a trade war between the KSA and USA [8] [0] - https://www.wilsoncenter.org/event/saudi-arabia-and-the-iraq-war https://www.wilsoncenter.org/event/saudi-arabia-and-the-iraq... [1] - http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/03/18/sprj.irq.saudi/ http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/03/18/sprj.irq.saudi/ [2] - https://www.jstor.org/stable/48673735 https://www.jstor.org/stable/48673735 [3] - https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/defense/2015-10-06/us-air-force-contract-supply-repair-saudi-f-15s https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/defense/2015-10-06/u... [4] - https://www.wsj.com/articles/saudi-arabia-agrees-to-buy-more-typhoon-combat-jets-1520617435 https://www.wsj.com/articles/saudi-arabia-agrees-to-buy-more... [5] - https://www.tacticalreport.com/news/article/8047-saudi-arabia-rsaf-kai-and-fa-50-combat-aircraft https://www.tacticalreport.com/news/article/8047-saudi-arabi... [6] - https://www.cnn.com/2021/12/23/politics/saudi-ballistic-missiles-china/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2021/12/23/politics/saudi-ballistic-miss... [7] - https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2023/02/03/pompeo-washington-post-jamal-khashoggi-00081017 https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2023/02/03/pompeo-was... [8] - https://www.reuters.com/article/us-oil-shale-kemp/is-saudi-arabia-winning-the-war-against-shale-kemp-idUSKCN0VR2AB https://www.reuters.com/article/us-oil-shale-kemp/is-saudi-a...

rurp 4y ago

Saudi Arabia's abysmal human rights record makes that kind of trade pretty embarrassing for the US. Not embarrassing enough to cut ties, but there is some tension there.