5 ms·

I get your point. But when you go through hundreds of applications for a single role, the ones with a cover letter do stand out. Not that I would only hire if y

I get your point. But when you go through hundreds of applications for a single role, the ones with a cover letter do stand out. Not that I would only hire if you had a cover letter, but it still stands out. One hand folks complain about automatic scanning and rejection based on just the CVs and here we are complaining about the one instrument, a job seeker has, to express interest in the company. To go with your date analogy, a cover letter might not need to be a love declaration, but maybe a message that looked at the other’s profile rather than just “what’s up”.

ehutch79 4y ago
It’s not the cover letter that’s really the problem here. It’s the cult like exuberance that seems to be demands by GP and sibling comments.
- version_five 4y ago
  I didn't see any cult like exuberance. I used to hire and the "cover letter" criteria I had was basically looking for some hint they were deliberately applying for this job because it interested them. That's what I get from the OP. It's not about looking for someone who's pretending they've found their life's passion. It's about preferring people who (hopefully honestly) indicate this would be something they'd want to do because of some fit between them and the job. That's not a burdensome, not cultish requirement. As an aside, I saw a cool job not long ago where they wanted your application email to have the subject line "$demonym reporting for duty", where $demonym is the cutesy name, like metamate that employees were supposed to call themselves. That is cultish, and puts me off applying way more than being asked for an sentence on why I'm a fit for the job.
  - haasted 4y ago
    Couldn't it be a simple test of whether the applicant had read the posting thoroughly? It's a quick filter to remove anyone who didn't manage to fulfill this no-effort criteria in their application. A lot of applicants simply send their resumes to any position that is vaguely relevant, without diving into the details of the role. A little bit like Van Halen's "Brown M&M clause": https://effectiviology.com/brown-mms/ https://effectiviology.com/brown-mms/
    - version_five 4y ago
      Yes, they definitely helps. I posted some jobs on linkedin and got absolutely garbage applicants. So the next time I wrote "do not apply on LinkedIn, email cv to xxxx". It was unbelievable to see how I had exactly the same wave of useless applications come in via LinkedIn's automated process, which I got to summarily ignore, and got a way higher average quality sent by email.
  - surgical_fire 4y ago
    > they were deliberately applying for this job because it interested them If they sent the CV, they did deliberate apply for the job. I always hated writing cover letters, always felt like the employer wanted me to do some groveling before I earned the right to be graced with an interview. Good thing now I have ChatGPT for the rescue.
gymbeaux 4y ago
I never made the connection before, but yes online dating apps are a LOT like interviewing for software jobs. In both cases, I am/was "rejected" a lot, but in both cases, wherever/whoever I ended up with, was very happy with me. I think most likely the conclusion to be drawn is that humans suck at evaluating other humans.
- camgunz 4y ago
  > I think most likely the conclusion to be drawn is that humans suck at evaluating other humans. In these circumstances definitely. It's a tall ask to accurately evaluate someone romantically or professionally based on a profile/resume and a few hours of face time. I think unions have a good method of doing this actually: people no one wants to work with wash out.
- ryandrake 4y ago
  The job market works exactly like the dating market would if there were 1,000 available men for every 1 available woman. In other words… like online dating.
pasquinelli 4y ago
i think the real move is to situate yourself in a relationship with the prospective employer where the resume and cover letter and interview and all are formalities done after you've already got the job, but that's a tough thing to just do in a hurry, like, say, if you just got shit-canned. maybe you'll do better with a cover letter, but it's still a cold-calling sales job, with success rates to match.
sharas- 4y ago
Most jobs out there are straight up boring. Due to the way simplistifi'er managers are structuring the system. It selects for accountable people, not responsible people. Even if the domain has something interesting in it. The filtering starts with HR functionary demanding a love letter to enter the managers' dollhouse. https://bitslap.it/blog/posts/playground-it.html#part-i---managers-dollhouse https://bitslap.it/blog/posts/playground-it.html#part-i---ma...
sys_64738 4y ago
If you get hundreds of applications then they're scanned into a database and ones with the buzzwords are deleted. A cover letter isn't even consumed by anybody other than the trash as the hiring manager isn't opening the mail. That doesn't happen anymore.
analognoise 4y ago
The only times I've ever sent a cover letter I was told "What cover letter?" The automatic system separated it and nobody looked at it.

ehutch79 4y ago

It’s not the cover letter that’s really the problem here. It’s the cult like exuberance that seems to be demands by GP and sibling comments.

version_five 4y ago
I didn't see any cult like exuberance. I used to hire and the "cover letter" criteria I had was basically looking for some hint they were deliberately applying for this job because it interested them. That's what I get from the OP. It's not about looking for someone who's pretending they've found their life's passion. It's about preferring people who (hopefully honestly) indicate this would be something they'd want to do because of some fit between them and the job. That's not a burdensome, not cultish requirement. As an aside, I saw a cool job not long ago where they wanted your application email to have the subject line "$demonym reporting for duty", where $demonym is the cutesy name, like metamate that employees were supposed to call themselves. That is cultish, and puts me off applying way more than being asked for an sentence on why I'm a fit for the job.
- haasted 4y ago
  Couldn't it be a simple test of whether the applicant had read the posting thoroughly? It's a quick filter to remove anyone who didn't manage to fulfill this no-effort criteria in their application. A lot of applicants simply send their resumes to any position that is vaguely relevant, without diving into the details of the role. A little bit like Van Halen's "Brown M&M clause": https://effectiviology.com/brown-mms/ https://effectiviology.com/brown-mms/
  - version_five 4y ago
    Yes, they definitely helps. I posted some jobs on linkedin and got absolutely garbage applicants. So the next time I wrote "do not apply on LinkedIn, email cv to xxxx". It was unbelievable to see how I had exactly the same wave of useless applications come in via LinkedIn's automated process, which I got to summarily ignore, and got a way higher average quality sent by email.
- surgical_fire 4y ago
  > they were deliberately applying for this job because it interested them If they sent the CV, they did deliberate apply for the job. I always hated writing cover letters, always felt like the employer wanted me to do some groveling before I earned the right to be graced with an interview. Good thing now I have ChatGPT for the rescue.

gymbeaux 4y ago

I never made the connection before, but yes online dating apps are a LOT like interviewing for software jobs. In both cases, I am/was "rejected" a lot, but in both cases, wherever/whoever I ended up with, was very happy with me. I think most likely the conclusion to be drawn is that humans suck at evaluating other humans.

camgunz 4y ago
> I think most likely the conclusion to be drawn is that humans suck at evaluating other humans. In these circumstances definitely. It's a tall ask to accurately evaluate someone romantically or professionally based on a profile/resume and a few hours of face time. I think unions have a good method of doing this actually: people no one wants to work with wash out.
ryandrake 4y ago
The job market works exactly like the dating market would if there were 1,000 available men for every 1 available woman. In other words… like online dating.

pasquinelli 4y ago

i think the real move is to situate yourself in a relationship with the prospective employer where the resume and cover letter and interview and all are formalities done after you've already got the job, but that's a tough thing to just do in a hurry, like, say, if you just got shit-canned. maybe you'll do better with a cover letter, but it's still a cold-calling sales job, with success rates to match.

sharas- 4y ago

Most jobs out there are straight up boring. Due to the way simplistifi'er managers are structuring the system. It selects for accountable people, not responsible people. Even if the domain has something interesting in it. The filtering starts with HR functionary demanding a love letter to enter the managers' dollhouse. https://bitslap.it/blog/posts/playground-it.html#part-i---managers-dollhouse https://bitslap.it/blog/posts/playground-it.html#part-i---ma...

sys_64738 4y ago

If you get hundreds of applications then they're scanned into a database and ones with the buzzwords are deleted. A cover letter isn't even consumed by anybody other than the trash as the hiring manager isn't opening the mail. That doesn't happen anymore.

analognoise 4y ago

The only times I've ever sent a cover letter I was told "What cover letter?" The automatic system separated it and nobody looked at it.