4 ms·

The other advantage is the total net worth as opposed to GDP. You hear a lot about GDP and the US has the biggest economy by far. But the total net worth per p

The other advantage is the total net worth as opposed to GDP. You hear a lot about GDP and the US has the biggest economy by far. But the total net worth per person in the States is even further ahead of the rest of the world. Only Switzerland is ahead of the US in per-capita net worth (only by a hair though) and one suspects that’s partly due to so many Americans parking their money there. Having had the biggest GDP for decades led to a amazing amount of wealth being concentrated in the USA.

tfourb 4y ago
Actually the U.S. in 3rd place behind Switzerland and Luxembourg in terms of mean wealth per adult and Hong Kong is not far behind. But you are right that the other countries on the upper ranks are mostly smaller nations with large banking sectors: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_wealth_per_adult https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_wealth_pe... While I agree that the U.S. has an enormous built-in advantage over other countries, I would really highlight one other piece of data: In terms of median wealth, the U.S. is eclipsed by half the E.U. and many Asian countries including diverse economies like France. This points to a terrifying concentration of wealth, which has also been highlighted by researchers like Picketty and this could (or arguably already does) put the social fabric of the U.S. under enormous strain.
- FredPret 4y ago
  While it is true that the US mean is much higher than the median, the median person still benefits greatly from that wealth. The rich invest their wealth in business, real estate for rent, and real estate for themselves, making all these things better. I'm currently in the EU, in a country that outperforms the US in median wealth by about 20%. While it's clear that life here is good, I'm also struck by how much worse everything looks here, from the rental real estate where I'm staying, to the generally unprofessional standard of business. So just looking at the slightly-higher median and ignoring the 2-3x higher mean also skews the picture.
  - ljf 4y ago
    True, but look at the rental markets for the majority of Americans that don't live in the rich coastal areas. And talk about unprofessional business - you have unprofessional legal professionals in parts of the US. Where America is great, it is great. But for the rest of it, it can be a very differently life for most of the inhabitants.
    - FredPret 4y ago
      Compare "poor" America with poor (insert geographic area here). There's no comparison. It's hugely, vastly better in the States. The only other places that have large backwater areas that can compete are maybe Canada and Australia. This is due to investment by rich people in rental real estate and businesses such as Walmart, Costco, Amazon, etc. When a family like the Waltons have a net worth in the 100's of $Bn's, this money isn't kept in gold bars in a safe. It's actively deployed in a variety of businesses. So the poor don't get a cut of the 100's of $Bn's, but they do benefit from the investment. And in very equal countries, the opposite is true. Everybody's OK, but there aren't really any systems that stand out as being amazing.
      - TheOtherHobbes 4y ago
        It's an empire. Empires are good at concentrating wealth by extracting it from their surroundings. Personally I would absolutely not want to be a poor person in the US. High crime, police violence, abusive work conditions, random shooters, health care bankruptcy, Fentanyl being pushed by medical professionals, zero Covid protections - it's a dystopian horror show. This may surprise you, but there are locations around the world with much lower GDP and much happier people.
      - dtech 4y ago
        I find this a weird take. In my country we're always amazed that there are places in most largish US cities where it simply isn't safe to be if you aren't a native, and lethal violence is a daily occurence.
      - Jochim 4y ago
- pjc50 4y ago
  This has all sorts of distorting effects. It turns out that one guy was paying a substantial fraction of New Jersey's budget, and he moved. https://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/01/business/one-top-taxpayer-moved-and-new-jersey-shuddered.html https://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/01/business/one-top-taxpayer... (then ended moving back again, because Florida)
  - maxerickson 4y ago
    Note that it put the income tax forecast at risk. The individual taxpayer was paying ~hundreds of millions per year into an $86 billion dollar budget. It's kind of wild that an individual would be paying a tenth of a percent (or so) of a state's income taxes, but it's maybe not a substantial fraction.
    - nonethewiser 4y ago
      Not that surprising when you have a progressive tax system and people who make tons of money.
  - quags 4y ago
    New Jersey certainly has had budget issues and pension issues. But the current leadership has done fairly well with a budget suppress and continuing to fund the pension system. So as of now the loss of the single taxpayer while a loss to the budget hasn’t put a huge hole in the system. Obviously fully funding the pension after years of under funding will take time so we will see how it turns out.
satellite2 4y ago
It's basically impossible to do any financial transactions in Switzerland as an American. Even something as mundane as opening a bank account to receive your salary is extremely complicated as most banks refuse to do business with Americans. A lot of Americans there renounced their citizenship because of this.
- FredPret 4y ago
  That's due to American regulations. If any American has an account at your bank, they can audit your whole bank. So now there are banks that will never take an American customer, and banks that specialize in Americans.
  - throwawaybzx 4y ago
    [flagged]
- danaris 4y ago
  I'm not sure this is the best example. The reason America puts Swiss banks with American customers under extra scrutiny is specifically because Swiss banks are infamous for enabling tax evasion.
  - FredPret 4y ago
    It's a global thing, not just Swiss. USA has some high-powered financial regulations and the ability to enforce them

tfourb 4y ago

Actually the U.S. in 3rd place behind Switzerland and Luxembourg in terms of mean wealth per adult and Hong Kong is not far behind. But you are right that the other countries on the upper ranks are mostly smaller nations with large banking sectors: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_wealth_per_adult https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_wealth_pe... While I agree that the U.S. has an enormous built-in advantage over other countries, I would really highlight one other piece of data: In terms of median wealth, the U.S. is eclipsed by half the E.U. and many Asian countries including diverse economies like France. This points to a terrifying concentration of wealth, which has also been highlighted by researchers like Picketty and this could (or arguably already does) put the social fabric of the U.S. under enormous strain.

FredPret 4y ago
While it is true that the US mean is much higher than the median, the median person still benefits greatly from that wealth. The rich invest their wealth in business, real estate for rent, and real estate for themselves, making all these things better. I'm currently in the EU, in a country that outperforms the US in median wealth by about 20%. While it's clear that life here is good, I'm also struck by how much worse everything looks here, from the rental real estate where I'm staying, to the generally unprofessional standard of business. So just looking at the slightly-higher median and ignoring the 2-3x higher mean also skews the picture.
- ljf 4y ago
  True, but look at the rental markets for the majority of Americans that don't live in the rich coastal areas. And talk about unprofessional business - you have unprofessional legal professionals in parts of the US. Where America is great, it is great. But for the rest of it, it can be a very differently life for most of the inhabitants.
  - FredPret 4y ago
    Compare "poor" America with poor (insert geographic area here). There's no comparison. It's hugely, vastly better in the States. The only other places that have large backwater areas that can compete are maybe Canada and Australia. This is due to investment by rich people in rental real estate and businesses such as Walmart, Costco, Amazon, etc. When a family like the Waltons have a net worth in the 100's of $Bn's, this money isn't kept in gold bars in a safe. It's actively deployed in a variety of businesses. So the poor don't get a cut of the 100's of $Bn's, but they do benefit from the investment. And in very equal countries, the opposite is true. Everybody's OK, but there aren't really any systems that stand out as being amazing.
    - TheOtherHobbes 4y ago
      It's an empire. Empires are good at concentrating wealth by extracting it from their surroundings. Personally I would absolutely not want to be a poor person in the US. High crime, police violence, abusive work conditions, random shooters, health care bankruptcy, Fentanyl being pushed by medical professionals, zero Covid protections - it's a dystopian horror show. This may surprise you, but there are locations around the world with much lower GDP and much happier people.
    - dtech 4y ago
      I find this a weird take. In my country we're always amazed that there are places in most largish US cities where it simply isn't safe to be if you aren't a native, and lethal violence is a daily occurence.
    - Jochim 4y ago
pjc50 4y ago
This has all sorts of distorting effects. It turns out that one guy was paying a substantial fraction of New Jersey's budget, and he moved. https://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/01/business/one-top-taxpayer-moved-and-new-jersey-shuddered.html https://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/01/business/one-top-taxpayer... (then ended moving back again, because Florida)
- maxerickson 4y ago
  Note that it put the income tax forecast at risk. The individual taxpayer was paying ~hundreds of millions per year into an $86 billion dollar budget. It's kind of wild that an individual would be paying a tenth of a percent (or so) of a state's income taxes, but it's maybe not a substantial fraction.
  - nonethewiser 4y ago
    Not that surprising when you have a progressive tax system and people who make tons of money.
- quags 4y ago
  New Jersey certainly has had budget issues and pension issues. But the current leadership has done fairly well with a budget suppress and continuing to fund the pension system. So as of now the loss of the single taxpayer while a loss to the budget hasn’t put a huge hole in the system. Obviously fully funding the pension after years of under funding will take time so we will see how it turns out.

satellite2 4y ago

It's basically impossible to do any financial transactions in Switzerland as an American. Even something as mundane as opening a bank account to receive your salary is extremely complicated as most banks refuse to do business with Americans. A lot of Americans there renounced their citizenship because of this.

FredPret 4y ago
That's due to American regulations. If any American has an account at your bank, they can audit your whole bank. So now there are banks that will never take an American customer, and banks that specialize in Americans.
- throwawaybzx 4y ago
  [flagged]
danaris 4y ago
I'm not sure this is the best example. The reason America puts Swiss banks with American customers under extra scrutiny is specifically because Swiss banks are infamous for enabling tax evasion.
- FredPret 4y ago
  It's a global thing, not just Swiss. USA has some high-powered financial regulations and the ability to enforce them