11 ms·
Sucralose is a negative modulator of T cell-mediated responses in mice
- henko 4y agoIs that good or bad?
- hsjqllzlfkf 4y agoBad. In English it means it hampers the normal working of some immunity system cells. Anyway, this is an example of why I'm skeptical of anyone framing dietary choices as "X is healthy".
- mog_dev 4y agoBad, as it seems to affect immune response in mice. But it could have therapeutic applications for autoimmune diseases according to the paper.
- poniko 4y agoIt's bad for mice in a dose that is ridicules .. it doesn't translate to humans. Per usuall "more studies are needed".
- fguerraz 4y ago> it doesn't translate to humans Says who?
- poniko 4y agoPretty much every studie done on mice .. the default is that mice response is not the same as human response, even though every media outlet seems to want it to be. So until they have done any studie on humas this should not be reported by mainstream media instead only used to get grants for follow up studies.
- quickthrower2 4y agoMight be good if one wants to “mitigate T cell-dependent autoimmune disorders”
- llampx 4y agoSugar is bad and so are sweeteners. The question is, what is the least worst option? Maybe that is to cut sweet things out of our diet completely.
- INTPenis 4y agoJust eat less sugar. Like once a week is fine. The problem with sugar isn't consuming it, but rather consuming it all the time. And of course I mean excessive sugar, not the 4 grams that are in every 100 grams of bread.
- samwillis 4y agoInteresting to note that bread in the US tends to have a significantly higher sugar content than in Europe, as much as 13g per 100g.
- quickthrower2 4y agoYeah you have to be picky and go for keto branded options to find 4% carb bread
- brnt 4y agoWell, they were talking about (added) sugar, not carbs in general. How can you have bread without carbohydrates? What is it made of then?
- bdcravens 4y agoIt usually is made of almond or coconut flour. Most "keto" bread isn't devoid of carbs, but often has a lot of dietary fiber, which is undigestable.
- quietbritishjim 4y agoAlmond and coconut flour are likely to have more (natural) sugar in than wheat flour. Bread made with coconut flour in particular is surely going to have more total sugar than regular bread with a little added sugar. A more reasonable explanation is that the comment that triggered this discussion was just from someone who used the wrong word by accident or totally misunderstands what carbs are.
- 2T1Qka0rEiPr 4y agoIn mice (reminded of: https://twitter.com/justsaysinmice https://twitter.com/justsaysinmice)
- tgv 4y agoOk, but mechanisms at this level are more likely to translate to effects in humans than e.g. "autism". OTOH, there's the quote "rats, when experimented upon, develop cancer" (attribution lost in the mist of time), so some caution is certainly warranted.
- heisenbit 4y agoSwallowing sweetened water with levels that may be reached by humans if pushing for the max.. Extreme bit not super extreme. Mice would never conduct experiments on humans with levels that were not relevant for their daily lifes.
- falcor84 4y agoThe only story I know about mice experimenting on humans is the Hitchhiker's Guide, and I think I'm overdue another one. Any recommendations?
- elif 4y agoFor a 100kg human the levels of consumption would be half a gram of sucralose per day to approximate the mice yield. That's 33 packets of Splenda or 5 bottles of prime energy drink assuming a 200:1 ratio compared to Gatorade's sugar. Hardly extreme.
- rocket_surgeron 4y ago>That's 33 packets of Splenda or 5 bottles of prime energy drink assuming a 200:1 ratio compared to Gatorade's sugar. Hardly extreme. That seems extremely extreme to me but as a fan of water so >0 Primes and/or Splenda packets per day every day seems extreme so I may lack context.
- Tenoke 4y ago99.9% of the time sharing mice studies has negative value. Too many of those findings don't pan out for humans for non-researchers to get anything useful out of.
- Silverback_VII 4y ago99.9% of people who claim that 'mouse studies dare useless' are from Reddit and not from the forefront of science. As a result of this reasoning, they may never experience the 300% testosterone boost of onion juice.
- groestl 4y agoGiven the number of mouse studies, 0,1% non-negative seems promising ;)
- quickthrower2 4y agoBut can you reproduce that result?
- heftig 4y agoWhat are time sharing mice?
- eCa 4y agoMaybe a comma helps: > 99.9% of the time, sharing mice studies has negative value.
- timbit42 4y agoWhat are 'sharing mice'?
- mahmoudhossam 4y agoMice using a time-sharing OS?
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- ar9av 4y agoCould this perhaps have any therapeutic applications in people with over active T-cells like Multiple Sclerosis?
- markdog12 4y agoLast sentence in abstract: > Overall, these findings suggest that a high intake of sucralose can dampen T cell-mediated responses, an effect that could be used in therapy to mitigate T cell-dependent autoimmune disorders.
- davidgerard 4y agoIN MICE @dang, can you please add that to the title?
- SomeoneFromCA 4y agoIntersting though: sucralose is just normal saccharose, but with a hydrogen substituted with chlorine. One would think it should be the least dangerous one, due to being so similar to a natural molecule.
- kevviiinn 4y agoIn the context of biochemistry, that's not really such a small change. It vastly modifies the reactivity of that site
- SomeoneFromCA 4y agoOf course, I know that, otherwise it would not be so sweet.
- cwingrav 4y agoI’m chemistry, tiny changes to structure or single atoms can produce drastically different properties.
- SomeoneFromCA 4y agoYet, medicines of similar structure and minor substitutions all have very similar profile, otherwise they would not havve been unified in different classes (say, benzodiazepines).
- gilrain 4y agoThis is like changing the input to a hash function by just one and being surprised the output is so different. That said, your confusion probably originated with Splenda’s “tastes like sugar ‘cause it’s made from sugar” marketing, which was ruled to be misleading.
- SomeoneFromCA 4y agoNo, |I do not have any confusion. Check the molecule yourself.
- FrustratedMonky 4y agoWhy do people have such a bias against using mice these days? You need to start somewhere, you aren't going to jump to all human studies for every single idea for an experiment.
- gilrain 4y agoFor instance, many culturally significant sassafras products and their derivative safrole are still illegal on the basis of overly-broadly applied mouse studies. It was later discovered the harmful metabolite does not occur in humans. But the regulations still didn’t get rolled back. Enjoy your fake root beer. Edit: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/0300483X77900397 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/030048...
- mtlmtlmtlmtl 4y agoI'm pretty sure safrole is heavily regulated because it's a precursor for MDMA and other methylene dioxy modified phenethylamines, not because of some purported health effect.
- gilrain 4y agoWhat source made you pretty sure about that? It was banned due to its supposed hepatotoxic effects in the 1960s. Can you find MDMA regulations that far back? I imagine the MDMA connection helps keep it banned, sure.
- mtlmtlmtlmtl 4y agoHuh, did not know that, my bad. It seems there are some other causes for concern with safrole that have not been disconfirmed in humans though. I'm seeing stuff about possible neurotoxity and immune effects as well. But yeah I'm sure no one is eager to lighten regulations anyway given the MDMA connection.
- gilrain 4y ago