5 ms·

> In Spring 2018, Epic executives and managers discussed adding a confirm purchase button to prevent accidental purchases. Though employees were concerned that

> In Spring 2018, Epic executives and managers discussed adding a confirm purchase button to prevent accidental purchases. Though employees were concerned that “it is a bit of a dark UX pattern to not have confirmation on ‘destructive’ actions,” Epic feared that adding a confirmation button would add “friction,” “result in a decent number of people second guessing their purchase,” and reduce the number of “impulse purchases.” > Epic has never allowed users to cancel or undo charges for Battle Passes or Llamas and did not begin allowing users to cancel Cosmetics charges until June 2019. Even then, Epic uses design tricks, sometimes referred to as “dark patterns,” to deter consumers from cancelling or requesting refunds for unauthorized V-Bucks charges. > On July 20, 2018, an Epic Community Coordinator asked if there were any plans to add a confirmation step for in-game purchases, noting: “This is actually a huge complaints on our side and could remove most of the ‘excuses’ about accidental purchase: ‘I wanted to press Replay, my PS4 was in sleep mode’, etc. This is something I wanted to push forward but didn’t have time to build a real case around, has this already been discussed in the past?” > In addition, Epic deliberately requires consumers to find and navigate a difficult and lengthy path to request a refund through the Fortnite app. To start, Epic hid the link to submit a refund request under the “Settings” tab on the Fortnite app menu, far removed from the purchase screen, even though requesting a refund is not a game or device setting. The Epic user experience (“UX”) designer who helped design the refund request path reported that he put the link there in an “attempt to obfuscate the existence of the feature” and that “not a single player found this option in the most recent round of UX testing.” When the designer asked whether he should make the feature easier to find, he was told by a superior, “it is perfect where it is at.” Many more examples in this complaint doc: https://www.ftc.gov/system/files/ftc_gov/pdf/1923203EpicGamesComplaint.pdf https://www.ftc.gov/system/files/ftc_gov/pdf/1923203EpicGame...

BiteCode_dev 4y ago
And despite Epic having great games, this is why I have not installed it or paid for any of their product so far. Also why steam is still the leader despite having a terrible UI: they have been very good to their customers.
- capableweb 4y ago
  > Also why steam is still the leader despite having a terrible UI: they have been very good to their customers. Steams core customer is the game developers/publishers, who they take a ~30% (last time I checked) cut from the profits from. The people who buy games are simply users of Steam, and Steam has to treat them well, otherwise their actual customers (developers/publishers) won't get as much profits, and indirectly Steam.
  - bioemerl 4y ago
    Developers don't pay that 30 percent, users do. You could even say that steam is a customer of the developers (I buy your game at x to sell for y), and the average person is a customer of steam and the devs. I don't really see the customers or the developers as the core. Both groups tie into each other in a big network effect.
    - echelon 4y ago
      Developers do. It comes out of their margins. If game developers and publishers could get the same audience without steam and the 30% tax, they would in a heartbeat. They'd probably cut the price a little to expand sales and enjoy the wider margin. Margin that could be spent on salaries and growth. Thankfully Valve is investing its proceeds in developing competitive products that enrich the industry and not just skimming.
    - j_maffe 4y ago
      They are neither buyers nor sellers, they have a marketplace business model. https://www.bluecart.com/blog/marketplace-business-model#:~:text=An%20online%20marketplace%20business%20model,ways%20and%20different%20in%20others https://www.bluecart.com/blog/marketplace-business-model#:~:....
    - thomastjeffery 4y ago
      That is a pointless distinction. 30% of the price is distributed to Valve instead of developers. Whether that results in developers obtaining lower profits or users paying higher prices is entirely subjective; that depends on what would happen otherwise, which is categorically unprovable.
elpool2 4y ago
When you unlock an item in a battle-pass, you have to hold down the button for about a second to unlock it (and there's a little progress bar animation as it unlocks). This is great! it makes it much harder to accidentally unlock the wrong thing with a single button press. The downside to a wrong click is pretty negligible though, you're probably going to unlock everything in the battle-pass eventually anyway. But in the "store" part of the app, where you're purchasing things with the "v-bucks" in-game currency (which you've paid actual money for), the purchase was just a single button press. It was very easy to accidentally purchase when instead you meant to press the "back" or "preview item" button. Only recently did they change this to use the same "hold for 1 second" pattern already used in the battle-pass.
_the_inflator 4y ago
Somewhat ironic. Remember Epic's attack on Apple's game store? At least Apple does not apply that many controversial patterns to their customer experience.
tuxone 4y ago
Is this the company that craves to install its Store on the most profitable mobile platform? I will try to keep that in mind
mock-possum 4y ago
> Epic feared that adding a confirmation button would add “friction,” “result in a decent number of people second guessing their purchase,” and reduce the number of “impulse purchases.” yeah, it would have absolutely done that.

BiteCode_dev 4y ago

And despite Epic having great games, this is why I have not installed it or paid for any of their product so far. Also why steam is still the leader despite having a terrible UI: they have been very good to their customers.

capableweb 4y ago
> Also why steam is still the leader despite having a terrible UI: they have been very good to their customers. Steams core customer is the game developers/publishers, who they take a ~30% (last time I checked) cut from the profits from. The people who buy games are simply users of Steam, and Steam has to treat them well, otherwise their actual customers (developers/publishers) won't get as much profits, and indirectly Steam.
- bioemerl 4y ago
  Developers don't pay that 30 percent, users do. You could even say that steam is a customer of the developers (I buy your game at x to sell for y), and the average person is a customer of steam and the devs. I don't really see the customers or the developers as the core. Both groups tie into each other in a big network effect.
  - echelon 4y ago
    Developers do. It comes out of their margins. If game developers and publishers could get the same audience without steam and the 30% tax, they would in a heartbeat. They'd probably cut the price a little to expand sales and enjoy the wider margin. Margin that could be spent on salaries and growth. Thankfully Valve is investing its proceeds in developing competitive products that enrich the industry and not just skimming.
  - j_maffe 4y ago
    They are neither buyers nor sellers, they have a marketplace business model. https://www.bluecart.com/blog/marketplace-business-model#:~:text=An%20online%20marketplace%20business%20model,ways%20and%20different%20in%20others https://www.bluecart.com/blog/marketplace-business-model#:~:....
  - thomastjeffery 4y ago
    That is a pointless distinction. 30% of the price is distributed to Valve instead of developers. Whether that results in developers obtaining lower profits or users paying higher prices is entirely subjective; that depends on what would happen otherwise, which is categorically unprovable.

elpool2 4y ago

When you unlock an item in a battle-pass, you have to hold down the button for about a second to unlock it (and there's a little progress bar animation as it unlocks). This is great! it makes it much harder to accidentally unlock the wrong thing with a single button press. The downside to a wrong click is pretty negligible though, you're probably going to unlock everything in the battle-pass eventually anyway. But in the "store" part of the app, where you're purchasing things with the "v-bucks" in-game currency (which you've paid actual money for), the purchase was just a single button press. It was very easy to accidentally purchase when instead you meant to press the "back" or "preview item" button. Only recently did they change this to use the same "hold for 1 second" pattern already used in the battle-pass.

_the_inflator 4y ago

Somewhat ironic. Remember Epic's attack on Apple's game store? At least Apple does not apply that many controversial patterns to their customer experience.

tuxone 4y ago

Is this the company that craves to install its Store on the most profitable mobile platform? I will try to keep that in mind

mock-possum 4y ago

> Epic feared that adding a confirmation button would add “friction,” “result in a decent number of people second guessing their purchase,” and reduce the number of “impulse purchases.” yeah, it would have absolutely done that.