5 ms·

I would posit that common sense is the antithesis to government. Consider children whose parents are arrested for letting them walk to the park, or the woman ar

I would posit that common sense is the antithesis to government. Consider children whose parents are arrested for letting them walk to the park, or the woman arrested for silently praying, in her head, while standing in front of an abortion clinic. Prosecutorial abuse is equally, if not more of a crisis in the world, than police abusing their arrest powers.

mywittyname 4y ago
I have a conflicting opinions on this post. On one hand, I loathe the use of "the government" as though it is some sort of monoblock. There are plenty of people who get into public service as a way to tangibly improve society and the lives of the people. OTOH, you are right that too many people get away with abusing their powers.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- majormajor 4y ago
  The "some abuses make it worth scrapping the whole thing" thesis is just pure folly. Two parallel possible spins on that: "Restrict the government since otherwise people will abuse government power." "Have a lot of rules and regulations since otherwise people will abuse individual liberties." Both of these make just as much sense on paper to me. On one hand you have examples of government harassment; on the other hand you have people literally being willing to sell other people poison to make a buck. The problem in both cases is the people, not the system. I've come to the thinking that you have to build societal values from the bottom up. You aren't gonna lawyer your way to a perfect system if you are still fostering an environment that encourages people to ignore that system, resist it, and take advantage of each other.
  - marcosdumay 4y ago
    > I've come to the thinking that you have to build societal values from the bottom up. And one way to build those values is by writing some basic rules down, communicating them to everybody, and enforce them. You will never have every single person refraining from taking advantage of something.
snozolli 4y ago
or the woman arrested for silently praying, in her head, while standing in front of an abortion clinic. Hmm... Looks like this happened in the UK: The video shows an officer asking Vaughan-Spruce if she was praying, to which she answers: “I might be praying in my head.” She was charged Dec. 15 with four counts of breaking a Public Space Protection Order (PSPO) around the abortion facility. A PSPO is intended to stop antisocial behavior. Source: https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/253187/woman-arrested-while-praying-silently-outside-abortion-clinic-charged-with-intimidation https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/253187/woman-arreste... The Public Spaces Protection Order is here: https://www.bcpcouncil.gov.uk/Communities/PSPOs/Ophir-Road-and-surrounding-area-Public-Spaces-Protection-Order.aspx https://www.bcpcouncil.gov.uk/Communities/PSPOs/Ophir-Road-a... Some background on the protective order: https://www.bcpcouncil.gov.uk/news-article.aspx?title=decision-made-to-implement-public-spaces-protection-order-around-ophir-road-in-bournemouth https://www.bcpcouncil.gov.uk/news-article.aspx?title=decisi... So, they had so many problems that the local council put an order in place, with overwhelming public support. The woman then violated the order and even indicated that she was violating the order, by choice, all so she can play the victim. Now it's being spun as "thought crime" so that they don't have to take responsibility for their abhorrent behavior and continue to pretend to be the ones who are victimized.
- nostromo 4y ago
  > abhorrent behavior How can any sane person watch this video and say her behavior was "abhorrent?" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6E105a58p8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6E105a58p8 Videos like this make me so thankful for the US constitution.
  - ck425 4y ago
    The behaviour in a vacuum might not be so bad but she was consciously trying to test how far she could go before they broke a law made specifically due to anti-abortion protesters like her intimidating woman to the point they wouldn't use the services.
    - erenyeager 4y ago

mywittyname 4y ago

I have a conflicting opinions on this post. On one hand, I loathe the use of "the government" as though it is some sort of monoblock. There are plenty of people who get into public service as a way to tangibly improve society and the lives of the people. OTOH, you are right that too many people get away with abusing their powers.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
majormajor 4y ago
The "some abuses make it worth scrapping the whole thing" thesis is just pure folly. Two parallel possible spins on that: "Restrict the government since otherwise people will abuse government power." "Have a lot of rules and regulations since otherwise people will abuse individual liberties." Both of these make just as much sense on paper to me. On one hand you have examples of government harassment; on the other hand you have people literally being willing to sell other people poison to make a buck. The problem in both cases is the people, not the system. I've come to the thinking that you have to build societal values from the bottom up. You aren't gonna lawyer your way to a perfect system if you are still fostering an environment that encourages people to ignore that system, resist it, and take advantage of each other.
- marcosdumay 4y ago
  > I've come to the thinking that you have to build societal values from the bottom up. And one way to build those values is by writing some basic rules down, communicating them to everybody, and enforce them. You will never have every single person refraining from taking advantage of something.

snozolli 4y ago

or the woman arrested for silently praying, in her head, while standing in front of an abortion clinic. Hmm... Looks like this happened in the UK: The video shows an officer asking Vaughan-Spruce if she was praying, to which she answers: “I might be praying in my head.” She was charged Dec. 15 with four counts of breaking a Public Space Protection Order (PSPO) around the abortion facility. A PSPO is intended to stop antisocial behavior. Source: https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/253187/woman-arrested-while-praying-silently-outside-abortion-clinic-charged-with-intimidation https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/253187/woman-arreste... The Public Spaces Protection Order is here: https://www.bcpcouncil.gov.uk/Communities/PSPOs/Ophir-Road-and-surrounding-area-Public-Spaces-Protection-Order.aspx https://www.bcpcouncil.gov.uk/Communities/PSPOs/Ophir-Road-a... Some background on the protective order: https://www.bcpcouncil.gov.uk/news-article.aspx?title=decision-made-to-implement-public-spaces-protection-order-around-ophir-road-in-bournemouth https://www.bcpcouncil.gov.uk/news-article.aspx?title=decisi... So, they had so many problems that the local council put an order in place, with overwhelming public support. The woman then violated the order and even indicated that she was violating the order, by choice, all so she can play the victim. Now it's being spun as "thought crime" so that they don't have to take responsibility for their abhorrent behavior and continue to pretend to be the ones who are victimized.

nostromo 4y ago
> abhorrent behavior How can any sane person watch this video and say her behavior was "abhorrent?" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6E105a58p8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6E105a58p8 Videos like this make me so thankful for the US constitution.
- ck425 4y ago
  The behaviour in a vacuum might not be so bad but she was consciously trying to test how far she could go before they broke a law made specifically due to anti-abortion protesters like her intimidating woman to the point they wouldn't use the services.
  - erenyeager 4y ago