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What began as effectively an IRC-like alternative + file hosting and voice support is now being used as a replacement for forums and I think that's where the is

What began as effectively an IRC-like alternative + file hosting and voice support is now being used as a replacement for forums and I think that's where the issue is. IRC isn't publicly searchable either unless someone was logging it and uploading them to some web server. IRC chats similarly often contain very useful info and answers. Discord unfortunately doesn't have any native chat export feature so the best that can be done are third-party exporters, copy-pasting or screenshots which aren't ideal and don't end up being indexed as desired even if communities wanted them to be.

urthor 4y ago
Exactly right. We're complaining about a problem that was no different in the heyday of IRC. Ultimately, publicly searchable information is a voluntary act.
- Dalewyn 4y ago
  IRC can be accessed by any client adhering to IRC standards which are free and open. Discord can be accessed by any client adhering to Discord standards, which are closed and proprietary. Nobody has an obligation to publish information for public access, nor is free necessarily superior to proprietary or vice versa, but Discord is absolutely less accessible than IRC or HTTP(S) as an objective fact.
  - NavinF 4y ago
    99.9% of users don't care about any of that. Users want embedded media, custom emotes, free fully featured clients on every device they use (any client that needs a bouncer doesn't count), integration with desktop software such as games, video streaming / screen sharing, and voice calls. Notice that every single chat software used by normal humans (iMessage, Google chat, FB messenger, etc) has most of these features, just with much lower bitrates than Discord. For the very few users that don't need any feature they didn't have in the 90s, IRC is still around. The rest of us just add one of many text logging bots to our discord servers.
    - 6510 4y ago
      You only let users design a product or tool if they are better at it or more correctly if you are even worse at it. Users don't want fire exits or seat belts. They basically want tasty food that kills them. It if can be more tasty and kill them faster they all want it. Even better if the product kills other people but silently and far away. If it can be slightly cheaper and kill many more people you've done well in their opinion. Of course sometimes having the user design the product or tool is the only available option. Just remember it is a terrible thing when it happens.
      - raverbashing 4y ago
        That's a funny comparison (with fire exits and seat belts), because IRC is none of it Plain text protocol with poor (and optional) auth? Please where are the adults in the room "oh but extension XYZ etc" yes and how many servers do implement that in a mandatory (and user friendly) way? The user wants their images and reactions and I can't blame them because it's the 2020's and IRC was already limited 20 years ago
        6510 4y ago
        haha, I use IRC all the time but don't necessarily disagree. Imagine if we could post images to HN! Or wait...
      - NavinF 4y ago
        > They basically want tasty food that kills them What do you mean "they"? I'm the dev in this scenario and I also prefer to eat tasty food that supposedly kills me. I know how to count my calories. > sometimes having the user design the product or tool is the only available option. Just remember it is a terrible thing when it happens I'll continue to have my users design my product/tool every time and those who don't will get eaten alive in any market that has consumer choice. Also Santa Claus isn't real.
        JPws_Prntr_Fngr 4y ago
        > I'll continue to have my users design my product/tool every time and those who don't will get eaten alive in any market that has consumer choice. Also Santa Claus isn't real. Somewhere, the ghost of the man responsible for the iPod and iPhone is laughing at you.
  - madars 4y ago
    >Discord can be accessed by any client adhering to Discord standards, which are closed and proprietary. It's worse. Official Twitter account: >All 3rd party apps or client modifiers are against our ToS, and the use of them can result in your account being disabled. I don't recommend using them. https://twitter.com/discord/status/1229357198918197248 https://twitter.com/discord/status/1229357198918197248 In practice you can't have a client that has local chat history, local search, or just better information density on the screen, and simultaneously hope to not have your account nuked.
    - Dalewyn 4y ago
      Like I said: Accessed by any client adhering to Discord standards, which are closed and proprietary. Discord standards include "official Discord", which doesn't take away from the point.
      - account42 4y ago
        It doesn't take away from the point but it adds to it. Proprietary chat protocols are nothing new but in the past alternative clients were either ignored or blocked. Now it is getting more common to punish the individual users of such clients, like Discord here threatening to nuke your account. This is a much worse situation than just "closed and proprietary standards".
        anticensor 4y ago
        In actual Discord practice, that clause acts more as a liability disclaimer. They do not actively look for and kill third party clients like, say, WhatsApp. However they have an antispam with a high false positive rate, which is tuned to almost always produce a non-spam result with their first party client.
  - dancemethis 4y ago
    Nah, Free Software is better than proprietary. Discord's attack on privacy and user safety are there to see.
- smaudet 4y ago
  > We're complaining about a problem that was no different in the heyday of IRC. IRC didn't pretend that you had information stored there, though... Discord hides this fact better by offering semi-permanence and a "search" feature, so it seems like its a real-time forum, when in fact its just slack with better video features... Its very different. The IRC of the yester-yore was filled with people sharing links to more-permanent docs, mailing lists. Discord is filled with people under the mistaken impression they have documented anything by having a chat with a search feature, (and this is has happened to me) claiming that the "rules" are documented somewhere in a channel and why haven't I seen them, when the "rules" are in fact buried, no longer accessible, or just hidden in a wall of conflicting information. If you have an IRC, you have a dedicated community of people who try because they must, if you have a Discord you have a group of randos at best, or at worst a delusional echo chamber.
  - Springtime 4y ago
    > Discord is filled with people under the mistaken impression they have documented anything by having a chat with a search feature... when the "rules" are in fact buried, no longer accessible, or just hidden in a wall of conflicting information. Part of this is a result of some communities not being organized well enough but also making do with fitting an IRC-like format ('servers'/channels/message buffers) into a more structured one. People are willing to compromise on having less suitable structure for denser/more important information since Discord offers such attractive and easy-to-use features in one place. That said most communities I know of create channels devoted to rules/FAQs, though for things like lists of file announcements/releases (in eg: modding communities) it's messier. The new forums channel feature has helped by making things sortable and more structured but those only apply to new channels not existing. The forums feature also highlights Discord has recognized how communities have been using their site like a forum for certain channels such as Q&A/releases/showcases (and why comparing it to publicly indexable forums is even more relevant since the feature set will only grow).
- bryanrasmussen 4y ago
  >We're complaining about a problem that was no different in the heyday of IRC. so the death of lore happened essentially when textual knowledge moved from the printed, physically stored version to the electronic version that has no easy way of going and getting the verifiable source of lore for reference when needed? sounds about right.
- agumonkey 4y ago
  IRC never persisted anything so nobody used it as information source.
  - Dalewyn 4y ago
    It's true IRC never stores anything server-side besides user and channel registration details, depending on the network's features and services. But it is patently false to say nobody used IRC as a source of information. IRC was essential in sharing information quickly back in the 90s. Information on things like natural disasters and the fall of the Soviet Union were shared live using IRC.
    - agumonkey 4y ago
      The wording was bad but I mean discord stores stuff from the start so you naturally say things with that idea in mind, for later. On IRC you come and talk, it might be logged or not, it's still not part of the spirit when you get into a chan.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
jhanschoo 4y ago
> Discord unfortunately doesn't have any native chat export feature so the best that can be done are third-party exporters, copy-pasting or screenshots which aren't ideal and don't end up being indexed as desired even if communities wanted them to be. Server owners have the option for message logging bots. If communities wanted logging, they do have that option with server owner buy-in. Arguably, difficult-to-archive by default if you aren't a server owner helps foster a safer chat experience.
- dr_dshiv 4y ago
  How? I’m an owner.
  - jhanschoo 4y ago
    You can google for a third party bot service, google for openly-distributed bots and host your own, or write your own.
  - zahrc 4y ago
    https://www.linen.dev/ https://www.linen.dev/
- alwayslikethis 4y ago
  No, it fosters a less safe experience, when the behavior is hidden. For someone willing to spend just about 30 minutes, it isn't hard to have a script log in to your own account to record messages without anyone noticing.
  - jhanschoo 4y ago
    That's against TOS, and my line of reasoning is that it helps against opportunistic and casual abuse, and there aren't really mitigations against more determined abuse. e.g. your relationship with someone has soured. Your IRC client has your private messages with them saved in a backlog. You can access them at any time. vs. you normally wouldn't save a backlog of messages because Discord remembers your message history, and if their relationship with you has soured, they have the option of nuking their messages.
eschaton 4y ago
Forums have the same problem of locking up knowledge, and they also keep out anyone who doesn’t want to constantly visit a web site. Mailing lists and newsgroups are the proper mechanisms for this. And you should be able to use them with a browser forum-style too.
- zelphirkalt 4y ago
  That depends on the forum. Most forums could be searched and posts found via your search engine of choice. Well, the current crop of forums (discourse) prevents that with being JS based, but I would not count it as a good forum anyway.
  - RobotToaster 4y ago
    I have no idea why so many choose to run a forum using discourse. It's the worst forum software I have seen.
- t-3 4y ago
  While some forums do lock information behind registration-barriers, it's rare, whereas every discord is locked behind a email+cell phone barrier. It's far, far worse for anyone who doesn't want to be part of your community or install an app just to be able to read the docs or download a patch or ask a question.
  - alexriddle 4y ago
    I have joined 2 discords in the last week (as lots of 'community support' seems to be moving there these days). I set a username but I haven't had to supply any other info - I can't post anything and there's a banner saying I need to claim the account to avoid losing access but it's definitely not every discord which requires a verified account. Doesn't help with the issues around searching for data from outside of discord.
    - account42 4y ago
      Discord randomly (e.g. when a black box ML algorithm scores you naughty or if you just happen to log in from an ip that someone "bad" used) requires you to provide a valid mobile phone number before you can access anything.
vehementi 4y ago
> What began as effectively an IRC-like alternative + file hosting and voice support is now being used as a replacement for forums and I think that's where the issue is. IRC was always an alternative/replacement for forums for many people (there was always the IRC vs forums debate for projects, gaming teams, etc.). Discord is just better IRC (Slack would have been this without the self sabotage via limited free accounts and sleeping on voice chat for years). Now it's more... Discord vs Reddit. But think of all the lost lore on those IRC servers or random private forums that are now gone.
- PeterisP 4y ago
  > there was always the IRC vs forums debate for projects Was there? IIRC for any non-tiny community the conclusion pretty much always was to use both, for different purposes.
- techdragon 4y ago
  Don’t forget the multiple severs multiple logins hassle, I wasn’t particularly bothered until I got to about the dozen mark at which point I started to resent any new slack I had to interact with, because even with a password manager it was a shitty interaction, because your likely matching on the slack TLD not the per slack unique FQDN, and given that owners can rename the slack and change that it’s not a bad thing to have the slack TLD be the login domain… anyway some people found this a problem immediately (likely not using password managers) and you can tell that it’s been an issue given that Slack really pushed the Magic Link logins pretty quickly, they obviously felt the pain.
rapnie 4y ago
> now being used as a replacement for forums In Matrix there is an awful "threaded discussions" feature now, where collapsed forks branch off from the main chat flow. Which you have to separately manage. Keep a chat a chat, and a forum a forum.
- mavhc 4y ago
  Why is this bad, threaded discussions have existed for all internet time
- scotty79 4y ago
  I always wanted to get this feature in chat, as my conversation (with a single person) often consist of few separate, independant threads.
- adham-omran 4y ago
  Why do you think the threaded discussion feature is awful? I find it useful to keep track of multiple running conversations with someone or have a topic discussion within say a #Help room.
grishka 4y ago
> file hosting That part is such a joke. I routinely run into the problem that I can't send someone a screencast because it's over EIGHT MEGABYTES. In 2023. And Discord insists on storing the bit-perfect copies of original images and videos too to add to the insult. I would be perfectly fine with them being compressed and/or stored temporarily but nah. I have to resort to cloud storage services like Yandex disk to go around that asinine limitation. Your files are too powerful, my ass.
- Arrath 4y ago
  > I routinely run into the problem that can't I send someone a screencast because it's over EIGHT MEGABYTES. Same. I can't just hit print screen and paste it into Discord, a single frame of my 3440x1440 resolution is too big for their free file size limit. I have to crop and/or scale it first. Just frustrating and an extra few steps.
  - BlueTemplar 4y ago
    That is actually one aspect where I agree with Discord : free hosting isn't free ! (And I would prefer that my files weren't arbitrarily modified by the host. BTW, there is software, like ShareX, which allows you to automatically do operations on files when you capture them.)
    - grishka 4y ago
      Sure, then allow me to send larger files and delete them after a while to reclaim disk space, and/or compress images and videos server-side so they take up less space. Heck, even the old-school ICQ-like direct file transfer, maybe through a proxy server of some sort, would be much, much better than this stupid limit.
      - glenneroo 4y ago
        You can send larger files if you pay for Nitro - basic is $30/yr and allows 50MB, normal is $100/yr and allows 500MB (they recently upped it from 100MB). And to be fair to them, they offer a ton of features for free - 8MB seems reasonable IMO - though I do agree that some form of auto-compression if your file exceeds the limits would be nice... on the other hand, the infra to run ffmpeg on videos or imagemagick on photos is not free either...

urthor 4y ago

Exactly right. We're complaining about a problem that was no different in the heyday of IRC. Ultimately, publicly searchable information is a voluntary act.

Dalewyn 4y ago
IRC can be accessed by any client adhering to IRC standards which are free and open. Discord can be accessed by any client adhering to Discord standards, which are closed and proprietary. Nobody has an obligation to publish information for public access, nor is free necessarily superior to proprietary or vice versa, but Discord is absolutely less accessible than IRC or HTTP(S) as an objective fact.
- NavinF 4y ago
  99.9% of users don't care about any of that. Users want embedded media, custom emotes, free fully featured clients on every device they use (any client that needs a bouncer doesn't count), integration with desktop software such as games, video streaming / screen sharing, and voice calls. Notice that every single chat software used by normal humans (iMessage, Google chat, FB messenger, etc) has most of these features, just with much lower bitrates than Discord. For the very few users that don't need any feature they didn't have in the 90s, IRC is still around. The rest of us just add one of many text logging bots to our discord servers.
  - 6510 4y ago
    You only let users design a product or tool if they are better at it or more correctly if you are even worse at it. Users don't want fire exits or seat belts. They basically want tasty food that kills them. It if can be more tasty and kill them faster they all want it. Even better if the product kills other people but silently and far away. If it can be slightly cheaper and kill many more people you've done well in their opinion. Of course sometimes having the user design the product or tool is the only available option. Just remember it is a terrible thing when it happens.
    - raverbashing 4y ago
      That's a funny comparison (with fire exits and seat belts), because IRC is none of it Plain text protocol with poor (and optional) auth? Please where are the adults in the room "oh but extension XYZ etc" yes and how many servers do implement that in a mandatory (and user friendly) way? The user wants their images and reactions and I can't blame them because it's the 2020's and IRC was already limited 20 years ago
      - 6510 4y ago
        haha, I use IRC all the time but don't necessarily disagree. Imagine if we could post images to HN! Or wait...
    - NavinF 4y ago
      > They basically want tasty food that kills them What do you mean "they"? I'm the dev in this scenario and I also prefer to eat tasty food that supposedly kills me. I know how to count my calories. > sometimes having the user design the product or tool is the only available option. Just remember it is a terrible thing when it happens I'll continue to have my users design my product/tool every time and those who don't will get eaten alive in any market that has consumer choice. Also Santa Claus isn't real.
      - JPws_Prntr_Fngr 4y ago
        > I'll continue to have my users design my product/tool every time and those who don't will get eaten alive in any market that has consumer choice. Also Santa Claus isn't real. Somewhere, the ghost of the man responsible for the iPod and iPhone is laughing at you.
- madars 4y ago
  >Discord can be accessed by any client adhering to Discord standards, which are closed and proprietary. It's worse. Official Twitter account: >All 3rd party apps or client modifiers are against our ToS, and the use of them can result in your account being disabled. I don't recommend using them. https://twitter.com/discord/status/1229357198918197248 https://twitter.com/discord/status/1229357198918197248 In practice you can't have a client that has local chat history, local search, or just better information density on the screen, and simultaneously hope to not have your account nuked.
  - Dalewyn 4y ago
    Like I said: Accessed by any client adhering to Discord standards, which are closed and proprietary. Discord standards include "official Discord", which doesn't take away from the point.
    - account42 4y ago
      It doesn't take away from the point but it adds to it. Proprietary chat protocols are nothing new but in the past alternative clients were either ignored or blocked. Now it is getting more common to punish the individual users of such clients, like Discord here threatening to nuke your account. This is a much worse situation than just "closed and proprietary standards".
      - anticensor 4y ago
        In actual Discord practice, that clause acts more as a liability disclaimer. They do not actively look for and kill third party clients like, say, WhatsApp. However they have an antispam with a high false positive rate, which is tuned to almost always produce a non-spam result with their first party client.
- dancemethis 4y ago
  Nah, Free Software is better than proprietary. Discord's attack on privacy and user safety are there to see.
smaudet 4y ago
> We're complaining about a problem that was no different in the heyday of IRC. IRC didn't pretend that you had information stored there, though... Discord hides this fact better by offering semi-permanence and a "search" feature, so it seems like its a real-time forum, when in fact its just slack with better video features... Its very different. The IRC of the yester-yore was filled with people sharing links to more-permanent docs, mailing lists. Discord is filled with people under the mistaken impression they have documented anything by having a chat with a search feature, (and this is has happened to me) claiming that the "rules" are documented somewhere in a channel and why haven't I seen them, when the "rules" are in fact buried, no longer accessible, or just hidden in a wall of conflicting information. If you have an IRC, you have a dedicated community of people who try because they must, if you have a Discord you have a group of randos at best, or at worst a delusional echo chamber.
- Springtime 4y ago
  > Discord is filled with people under the mistaken impression they have documented anything by having a chat with a search feature... when the "rules" are in fact buried, no longer accessible, or just hidden in a wall of conflicting information. Part of this is a result of some communities not being organized well enough but also making do with fitting an IRC-like format ('servers'/channels/message buffers) into a more structured one. People are willing to compromise on having less suitable structure for denser/more important information since Discord offers such attractive and easy-to-use features in one place. That said most communities I know of create channels devoted to rules/FAQs, though for things like lists of file announcements/releases (in eg: modding communities) it's messier. The new forums channel feature has helped by making things sortable and more structured but those only apply to new channels not existing. The forums feature also highlights Discord has recognized how communities have been using their site like a forum for certain channels such as Q&A/releases/showcases (and why comparing it to publicly indexable forums is even more relevant since the feature set will only grow).
bryanrasmussen 4y ago
>We're complaining about a problem that was no different in the heyday of IRC. so the death of lore happened essentially when textual knowledge moved from the printed, physically stored version to the electronic version that has no easy way of going and getting the verifiable source of lore for reference when needed? sounds about right.
agumonkey 4y ago
IRC never persisted anything so nobody used it as information source.
- Dalewyn 4y ago
  It's true IRC never stores anything server-side besides user and channel registration details, depending on the network's features and services. But it is patently false to say nobody used IRC as a source of information. IRC was essential in sharing information quickly back in the 90s. Information on things like natural disasters and the fall of the Soviet Union were shared live using IRC.
  - agumonkey 4y ago
    The wording was bad but I mean discord stores stuff from the start so you naturally say things with that idea in mind, for later. On IRC you come and talk, it might be logged or not, it's still not part of the spirit when you get into a chan.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

jhanschoo 4y ago

> Discord unfortunately doesn't have any native chat export feature so the best that can be done are third-party exporters, copy-pasting or screenshots which aren't ideal and don't end up being indexed as desired even if communities wanted them to be. Server owners have the option for message logging bots. If communities wanted logging, they do have that option with server owner buy-in. Arguably, difficult-to-archive by default if you aren't a server owner helps foster a safer chat experience.

dr_dshiv 4y ago
How? I’m an owner.
- jhanschoo 4y ago
  You can google for a third party bot service, google for openly-distributed bots and host your own, or write your own.
- zahrc 4y ago
  https://www.linen.dev/ https://www.linen.dev/
alwayslikethis 4y ago
No, it fosters a less safe experience, when the behavior is hidden. For someone willing to spend just about 30 minutes, it isn't hard to have a script log in to your own account to record messages without anyone noticing.
- jhanschoo 4y ago
  That's against TOS, and my line of reasoning is that it helps against opportunistic and casual abuse, and there aren't really mitigations against more determined abuse. e.g. your relationship with someone has soured. Your IRC client has your private messages with them saved in a backlog. You can access them at any time. vs. you normally wouldn't save a backlog of messages because Discord remembers your message history, and if their relationship with you has soured, they have the option of nuking their messages.

eschaton 4y ago

Forums have the same problem of locking up knowledge, and they also keep out anyone who doesn’t want to constantly visit a web site. Mailing lists and newsgroups are the proper mechanisms for this. And you should be able to use them with a browser forum-style too.

zelphirkalt 4y ago
That depends on the forum. Most forums could be searched and posts found via your search engine of choice. Well, the current crop of forums (discourse) prevents that with being JS based, but I would not count it as a good forum anyway.
- RobotToaster 4y ago
  I have no idea why so many choose to run a forum using discourse. It's the worst forum software I have seen.
t-3 4y ago
While some forums do lock information behind registration-barriers, it's rare, whereas every discord is locked behind a email+cell phone barrier. It's far, far worse for anyone who doesn't want to be part of your community or install an app just to be able to read the docs or download a patch or ask a question.
- alexriddle 4y ago
  I have joined 2 discords in the last week (as lots of 'community support' seems to be moving there these days). I set a username but I haven't had to supply any other info - I can't post anything and there's a banner saying I need to claim the account to avoid losing access but it's definitely not every discord which requires a verified account. Doesn't help with the issues around searching for data from outside of discord.
  - account42 4y ago
    Discord randomly (e.g. when a black box ML algorithm scores you naughty or if you just happen to log in from an ip that someone "bad" used) requires you to provide a valid mobile phone number before you can access anything.

vehementi 4y ago

> What began as effectively an IRC-like alternative + file hosting and voice support is now being used as a replacement for forums and I think that's where the issue is. IRC was always an alternative/replacement for forums for many people (there was always the IRC vs forums debate for projects, gaming teams, etc.). Discord is just better IRC (Slack would have been this without the self sabotage via limited free accounts and sleeping on voice chat for years). Now it's more... Discord vs Reddit. But think of all the lost lore on those IRC servers or random private forums that are now gone.

PeterisP 4y ago
> there was always the IRC vs forums debate for projects Was there? IIRC for any non-tiny community the conclusion pretty much always was to use both, for different purposes.
techdragon 4y ago
Don’t forget the multiple severs multiple logins hassle, I wasn’t particularly bothered until I got to about the dozen mark at which point I started to resent any new slack I had to interact with, because even with a password manager it was a shitty interaction, because your likely matching on the slack TLD not the per slack unique FQDN, and given that owners can rename the slack and change that it’s not a bad thing to have the slack TLD be the login domain… anyway some people found this a problem immediately (likely not using password managers) and you can tell that it’s been an issue given that Slack really pushed the Magic Link logins pretty quickly, they obviously felt the pain.

rapnie 4y ago

> now being used as a replacement for forums In Matrix there is an awful "threaded discussions" feature now, where collapsed forks branch off from the main chat flow. Which you have to separately manage. Keep a chat a chat, and a forum a forum.

mavhc 4y ago
Why is this bad, threaded discussions have existed for all internet time
scotty79 4y ago
I always wanted to get this feature in chat, as my conversation (with a single person) often consist of few separate, independant threads.
adham-omran 4y ago
Why do you think the threaded discussion feature is awful? I find it useful to keep track of multiple running conversations with someone or have a topic discussion within say a #Help room.

grishka 4y ago

> file hosting That part is such a joke. I routinely run into the problem that I can't send someone a screencast because it's over EIGHT MEGABYTES. In 2023. And Discord insists on storing the bit-perfect copies of original images and videos too to add to the insult. I would be perfectly fine with them being compressed and/or stored temporarily but nah. I have to resort to cloud storage services like Yandex disk to go around that asinine limitation. Your files are too powerful, my ass.

Arrath 4y ago
> I routinely run into the problem that can't I send someone a screencast because it's over EIGHT MEGABYTES. Same. I can't just hit print screen and paste it into Discord, a single frame of my 3440x1440 resolution is too big for their free file size limit. I have to crop and/or scale it first. Just frustrating and an extra few steps.
- BlueTemplar 4y ago
  That is actually one aspect where I agree with Discord : free hosting isn't free ! (And I would prefer that my files weren't arbitrarily modified by the host. BTW, there is software, like ShareX, which allows you to automatically do operations on files when you capture them.)
  - grishka 4y ago
    Sure, then allow me to send larger files and delete them after a while to reclaim disk space, and/or compress images and videos server-side so they take up less space. Heck, even the old-school ICQ-like direct file transfer, maybe through a proxy server of some sort, would be much, much better than this stupid limit.
    - glenneroo 4y ago
      You can send larger files if you pay for Nitro - basic is $30/yr and allows 50MB, normal is $100/yr and allows 500MB (they recently upped it from 100MB). And to be fair to them, they offer a ton of features for free - 8MB seems reasonable IMO - though I do agree that some form of auto-compression if your file exceeds the limits would be nice... on the other hand, the infra to run ffmpeg on videos or imagemagick on photos is not free either...