5 ms·
That has nothing to do with workers' rights. Firing with notice is how the problem is solved in Germany. When your boss fires you, you don't get chased out of t
by imtringued 4y ago
That has nothing to do with workers' rights. Firing with notice is how the problem is solved in Germany. When your boss fires you, you don't get chased out of the building, no, your employment contract transforms from indefinite to definite and you just wait until the contract runs out. Gross misbehaviour like theft allows immediate firing. Also new hires have a probatory period (several months) during which firing works exactly the same way it does in the USA e.g. you can fire immediately for any reason.
Americans will tell me how onerous this is and yet they somehow managed to screw it up anyway because I constantly read on the internet about "unfireable" employees which is a ridiculous concept. Even hiring quotas for large corporation's and government funded institutions (universities for example) don't matter when making firing decisions, the point is to let people with other backgrounds into the door, not keep them locked in.
- chitowneats 4y ago[flagged]
- KptMarchewa 4y agoYeah, no.
- chitowneats 4y ago[flagged]
- KptMarchewa 4y agoYou just pretend you did and invent fake arguments in support of it too
- smcl 4y agoThere's really no need to shoehorn Nordstream explosions into a discussion about transport infrastructure
- junofan 4y agoGov’t jobs often require due process to dismiss. This can involve steps that are almost impossible to fail. They also often have a probationary period. It’s cool that Germany does things differently.
- Teever 4y agoI don't believe that the US Federal government can't lay people off.
- crimsoneer 4y agoQuite. What they generally mean is they have managers that are too incompetent or too temporary to do the work to get rid of people.
- namdnay 4y ago> That has nothing to do with workers' rights A french court would disagree with you - the German process you described is impossible in france. once an employee has finished their trial period, only gross misbehaviour or an official economic redundancy plan can get rid of them...
- sidlls 4y agoYou're saying that in France it's against the law to fire someone for performance related reasons?
- slackdog 4y agoEmployers in France need valid grounds, which may be personal or economic. Personal grounds includes poor performance. Easier said than done though, it requires a lot of documentation proving that the employer provided sufficient training/retraining to improve performance, regular documented meetings to discuss performance problems, etc. If the worker stops showing up to work at all it becomes easier, but if the worker wants to drag out the process they can.
- sidlls 4y agoThat sounds perfectly reasonable to me, and is a far cry from the OP's assertion.
- namdnay 4y agoonly if the employee plays ball. all they need to do is go to the doctor, say that they're burned out, and no amount of poor performance reviews will be enough. the next step will be a negotiation between employer and employee
- light_hue_1 4y agoYou can fire someone in France for poor performance. But it's not like in the US where you just declare this, and then fire them. It works like in many union shops in the US. You need to document that poor performance, show missed deadlines, show that you attempted to train and accommodate them, give them a few months of heads up to adjust, and then you can proceed with dismissal. Just think of France as an all-hands union shop.
- RajT88 4y ago> I constantly read on the internet about "unfireable" employees which is a ridiculous concept. Anecdotally, I've heard about companies with these, which got that way by getting sued over and over again for wrongful termination. Now they are scared to even discipline employees engaged in sub-extremely-egregious behavior. Like one story I heard was, "As long as they spend more time working than looking at porn, let's just let it be." My 2 cents on this: Your company gets this way with poor leadership. Terminations without your i's dotted and t's crossed, and also an unwillingness to take some things on the chin for a broader view of how things are going to go.