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I struggle to think of what purpose a device that wasn’t meant to be a Linux computer would realistically serve beyond nefarious goals.

by xwdv 4y ago

pjc50 4y ago
Running Linux is the goal. It might be useful if you want to drive a TV, say. And of course, since it already runs Android, it's pretty close to "intended to run Linux" to start with.
BoatyPrint 4y ago
Plenty of applications for a Linux box that aren't "nefarious". Maybe digital signage, or backup server, to name two.
tenebrisalietum 4y ago
This is an ethically neutral activity. The mere act of transforming a device into such a computer doesn't add or remove any nefarious goals, if you have those goals, you can get another device intended to be a Linux computer and still accomplish them (and it would be much easier). If the transformation is done in contravention of the owner, it's bad, but it sounds like from the article that the ISP has written it off and in any case, they say they are doing this nondestructively.
- jrm4 4y ago
  I'd argue 100% ethically positive; it's the sprinkling of unnecessary devices by companies that's the negative.
- hungryforcodes 4y ago
  In a worst case scenario the company (so called "owner), will just charge you for its replacement. Since it was well calculated that a) the box was useless and b) would never be asked for again and c) (as I've said) would just be charged a certain amount for non-return... I hardly see how it's an ethical activity. If the owner was one person that was needing this device -- fine. But this is just a company doing business...
redfast00 4y ago
(author here) We use the device instead of a Raspberry Pi, not for anything too serious: we attached it to a screen and have a small server running with an API where you can write single pixels into the framebuffer (a bit like /r/place)
- joezydeco 4y ago
  Ironically, the Raspberry Pi started as a failed set-top box.
  - rbanffy 4y ago
    I always thought that SoC was wildly popular.
    - joezydeco 4y ago
      It is, because Broadcom had a surplus of them and couldn't get anyone to adopt it for a streaming device. So an enterprising Broadcom FAE decided to turn it into an "educational" Linux desktop device. The "wildly popular" part came when people realized BRCM was dumping these boards cheaper than any existing Linux SBC at the time. The educational angle is long gone.
      - rootbear 4y ago
        The educational angle is far from gone. The Raspberry Pi Foundation handles that part of it now. https://www.raspberrypi.org https://www.raspberrypi.org I would agree that most of the Pis sold are not used for education, but that doesn't diminish their importance in that area.
      - Symbiote 4y ago
        The education part continues. Raspberry Pi continue to make teaching materials, run training etc. I think the focus is the UK.
- rbanffy 4y ago
  Pretty much any device like these (as well as most modern TVs with network ports) can probably be turned into computers or, at least, X terminals.
felipesoc 4y ago
I have an android TV using armbian with a nextcloud instance, transmission, pydownloader, radarr and sonarr. I have another running a quake 3 server. They are cheap raspberry pi alternatives with a nice case and a very good power supply using 12v instead of 5v, which is more stable.
- severine 4y ago
  Vey interesting, does the remote also work? How do you asses Linux compatibility of those boxes?
  - felipesoc 4y ago
    I just look for ones with a rk322x chip and use this image: https://forum.armbian.com/topic/12656-csc-armbian-for-rk322x-tv-boxes/ https://forum.armbian.com/topic/12656-csc-armbian-for-rk322x...
no_time 4y ago
On the contrary, I struggle to think of "nefarious" goals.
- jeroenhd 4y ago
  Many of these SBCs are programmed in stupid ways. For example, there was a whole subforum on a popular Dutch site that was shut down because it turned out the way ISPs make you pay for premium channels is to... not encrypt them in any special way and hide them in the front end. This was all configured through a JSON file over an unencrypted protocol. The whole project began because people wanted to record their shows onto the disabled USB drive, and ended up exposing trivial ways to get around subscription limitations. People immediately MitM'd these devices to get unlimited free bonus stuff, and the forum was copyright struck to hell. These devices are programmed so badly that once you give any user any modicum of control over them, you can bypass almost every restriction your TV provider can think of. Modify one or two files and you've got an excellent piracy box. Personally, I think this whole situation is terrible and I think that it's up to providers to fix their shitty DRM, but legally speaking these boxes don't become your property.
  - bornfreddy 4y ago
    Do you have the name of the forum maybe?
hbossy 4y ago
Getting a cheap NAS.
- rbanffy 4y ago
  Or, if you manage to get a dozen, it can become an educational cluster where students can get hands-on experience with managing computer clusters.
  - theodric 4y ago
    Entirely correct, although I question the value of investing time with such a goal in mind when ex-corp laptops, desktops, and thin clients are available, inexpensive, likely more powerful, and require no hackarounds to be serviceable Linux systems. I feel an effort like this should be enjoyed for its hack value, rather than for any potential practical purposes.
    - rbanffy 4y ago
      If you get one model up and runnning, getting a couple dozen of them up and running is easy. 2GB and 4 cores per node is not too shabby either. My last Pi-based cluster has Pi Zero's as nodes, with single puny core with a very minimal 512MB per node.
ilyt 4y ago
...to not have to throw it into a landfill ? How's that not natural conclusion to you ? It's in the title of article...
dsr_ 4y ago
I don't know about supported video playback capabilities, but being a settop box under your own control is pretty good by itself. It can play back music, video, do light desktop duty -- any place you just need one or two browser tabs, it will probably work.
hakube 4y ago
less e-waste. If you cared enough about our planet, you'll know that

I struggle to think of what purpose a device that wasn’t meant to be a Linux computer would realistically serve beyond nefarious goals.

by xwdv 4y ago

I struggle to think of what purpose a device that wasn’t meant to be a Linux computer would realistically serve beyond nefarious goals.

pjc50 4y ago

Running Linux is the goal. It might be useful if you want to drive a TV, say. And of course, since it already runs Android, it's pretty close to "intended to run Linux" to start with.

BoatyPrint 4y ago

Plenty of applications for a Linux box that aren't "nefarious". Maybe digital signage, or backup server, to name two.

tenebrisalietum 4y ago

This is an ethically neutral activity. The mere act of transforming a device into such a computer doesn't add or remove any nefarious goals, if you have those goals, you can get another device intended to be a Linux computer and still accomplish them (and it would be much easier). If the transformation is done in contravention of the owner, it's bad, but it sounds like from the article that the ISP has written it off and in any case, they say they are doing this nondestructively.

jrm4 4y ago
I'd argue 100% ethically positive; it's the sprinkling of unnecessary devices by companies that's the negative.
hungryforcodes 4y ago
In a worst case scenario the company (so called "owner), will just charge you for its replacement. Since it was well calculated that a) the box was useless and b) would never be asked for again and c) (as I've said) would just be charged a certain amount for non-return... I hardly see how it's an ethical activity. If the owner was one person that was needing this device -- fine. But this is just a company doing business...

redfast00 4y ago

(author here) We use the device instead of a Raspberry Pi, not for anything too serious: we attached it to a screen and have a small server running with an API where you can write single pixels into the framebuffer (a bit like /r/place)

joezydeco 4y ago
Ironically, the Raspberry Pi started as a failed set-top box.
- rbanffy 4y ago
  I always thought that SoC was wildly popular.
  - joezydeco 4y ago
    It is, because Broadcom had a surplus of them and couldn't get anyone to adopt it for a streaming device. So an enterprising Broadcom FAE decided to turn it into an "educational" Linux desktop device. The "wildly popular" part came when people realized BRCM was dumping these boards cheaper than any existing Linux SBC at the time. The educational angle is long gone.
    - rootbear 4y ago
      The educational angle is far from gone. The Raspberry Pi Foundation handles that part of it now. https://www.raspberrypi.org https://www.raspberrypi.org I would agree that most of the Pis sold are not used for education, but that doesn't diminish their importance in that area.
    - Symbiote 4y ago
      The education part continues. Raspberry Pi continue to make teaching materials, run training etc. I think the focus is the UK.
rbanffy 4y ago
Pretty much any device like these (as well as most modern TVs with network ports) can probably be turned into computers or, at least, X terminals.

felipesoc 4y ago

I have an android TV using armbian with a nextcloud instance, transmission, pydownloader, radarr and sonarr. I have another running a quake 3 server. They are cheap raspberry pi alternatives with a nice case and a very good power supply using 12v instead of 5v, which is more stable.

severine 4y ago
Vey interesting, does the remote also work? How do you asses Linux compatibility of those boxes?
- felipesoc 4y ago
  I just look for ones with a rk322x chip and use this image: https://forum.armbian.com/topic/12656-csc-armbian-for-rk322x-tv-boxes/ https://forum.armbian.com/topic/12656-csc-armbian-for-rk322x...

no_time 4y ago

On the contrary, I struggle to think of "nefarious" goals.

jeroenhd 4y ago
Many of these SBCs are programmed in stupid ways. For example, there was a whole subforum on a popular Dutch site that was shut down because it turned out the way ISPs make you pay for premium channels is to... not encrypt them in any special way and hide them in the front end. This was all configured through a JSON file over an unencrypted protocol. The whole project began because people wanted to record their shows onto the disabled USB drive, and ended up exposing trivial ways to get around subscription limitations. People immediately MitM'd these devices to get unlimited free bonus stuff, and the forum was copyright struck to hell. These devices are programmed so badly that once you give any user any modicum of control over them, you can bypass almost every restriction your TV provider can think of. Modify one or two files and you've got an excellent piracy box. Personally, I think this whole situation is terrible and I think that it's up to providers to fix their shitty DRM, but legally speaking these boxes don't become your property.
- bornfreddy 4y ago
  Do you have the name of the forum maybe?

hbossy 4y ago

Getting a cheap NAS.

rbanffy 4y ago
Or, if you manage to get a dozen, it can become an educational cluster where students can get hands-on experience with managing computer clusters.
- theodric 4y ago
  Entirely correct, although I question the value of investing time with such a goal in mind when ex-corp laptops, desktops, and thin clients are available, inexpensive, likely more powerful, and require no hackarounds to be serviceable Linux systems. I feel an effort like this should be enjoyed for its hack value, rather than for any potential practical purposes.
  - rbanffy 4y ago
    If you get one model up and runnning, getting a couple dozen of them up and running is easy. 2GB and 4 cores per node is not too shabby either. My last Pi-based cluster has Pi Zero's as nodes, with single puny core with a very minimal 512MB per node.

ilyt 4y ago

...to not have to throw it into a landfill ? How's that not natural conclusion to you ? It's in the title of article...

dsr_ 4y ago

I don't know about supported video playback capabilities, but being a settop box under your own control is pretty good by itself. It can play back music, video, do light desktop duty -- any place you just need one or two browser tabs, it will probably work.

hakube 4y ago

less e-waste. If you cared enough about our planet, you'll know that