8 ms·

The Edge integration announced today also looks very impressive. I chuckled at the thought that MS is probably about to make a daily Edge user out of me and a l

The Edge integration announced today also looks very impressive. I chuckled at the thought that MS is probably about to make a daily Edge user out of me and a lot of other people, but of course Edge is Chrome under the hood now. So Google beat MS to browser market dominance, and now MS is using their browser as a platform to go after Google's core business. Neat. I think this tech is going to be transformative for everyone in a positive way. I've been doing a lot of bookkeeping and form-filling-out the past couple weeks and I keep thinking, wow, I wish I could just explain to ChatGPT what I need copied and pasted from one document to another or what needs to be filled out.

basch 4y ago
>of course Edge is Chrome under the hood Embrace, Extend. That's the beauty of open source, right? If development and innovation slows, somebody can fork.
- loudmax 4y ago
  > Embrace, Extend. Wonder what comes next from Microsoft after Embrace and Extend ...
  - huijzer 4y ago
    Antitrust?
  - acchow 4y ago
    Extinguish?
- poutine 4y ago
  Left out the last E there...
  - spixy 4y ago
    that is right, with open source there is no last E
    - fomine3 4y ago
      That's why Edge's user agent lacks "e": Edg/111.0.1660.6
      - katbyte 4y ago
        oh wow thats not a joke Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 13_2) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/110.0.0.0 Safari/537.36 Edg/109.0.1518.78
    - trelane 4y ago
      Oh? Were can I get the source and compile Edge myself? Perhaps you've mistaken open source for Free Software.
- peteradio 4y ago
  Embrace like king kong embraces godzilla, how are you going to extinguish godzilla? Newsflash its not possible!
  - diffeomorphism 4y ago
    Nah, it is rather easy. For instance how many people use vscode and how many vscodium? Why? And for that reason codium could be easily reduced to irrelevance.
- htag 4y ago
  This is the longterm strength of the GPL over MIT/BSD.
partiallypro 4y ago
Edge is genuinely very very good. It does have some dev tool problems that I've run into, but for browser it's top notch.
- ycta20221203980 4y ago
  I like Edge and I want to like Bing but my problem is that the new tab page on Edge and the landing page on (current) Bing are so bad. They're full of random junk and articles I don't want to see. I'll switch to Bing full time if they just make the landing page clean.
  - partiallypro 4y ago
    There are settings that will hide all of it, at least until you scroll, but it would be nice to have it just be the search and Bing image of the day (or no image if that's your jam.)
  - spullara 4y ago
    Aside from telling you about the new GPT functionality I don't see anything else on the landing page at bing.com: https://i.imgur.com/2f1D53L.png https://i.imgur.com/2f1D53L.png
    - pphysch 4y ago
      You appear to have gotten the new version. The old (GPT-less) one is a horribly noisy mess, with a high-contrast background image to boot.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - georgemcbay 4y ago
    I don't know about Bing, but in Edge you can disable all of that random junk content and get a nice clean default page with just a single search text entry box (similar to the Chrome default). The settings for modifying your layout and turning off all the content you don't want is available through the gear icon settings from the top right of the page. Would be nice if the default were clean, but you can opt out of all of that stuff.
kyriakos 4y ago
I'm using Edge full time since it switched to chromium. Have absolutely no problems with it.
- henriquez 4y ago
  It’s my go-to browser for porn, and Bing is also the best porn search engine.
- darkvertex 4y ago
  I don't know why but Edge has extra buttery smooth video performance. 4K? No stuttering. I think they tap into some magic Windows APIs that regular Chrome does not.
layer8 4y ago
It won’t be limited to Edge. From the event: Q: Will this be available in Chrome or other browsers? Yusuf: Our intention is to bring it to all browsers. We're starting with Edge. Chrome has to implement some things to make it work, but our intention is all browsers.
- nailer 4y ago
  That seems odd. What would Chrome not have that Edge does that allows Bing to work?
  - infinityio 4y ago
    The edge-specific integration seems to include a chatbot you can pull up on any page for content summaries / asking questions, I imagine this is the feature in question (although I'd imagine it would work perfectly fine as an extension, with no changes needed)
seydor 4y ago
I ve been using Edge to read aloud documents and articles recently. It seems like its a great browser, but it s late to the party and it s hard for people to move there.
curiousllama 4y ago
> I wish I could just explain to ChatGPT what I need copied and pasted from one document to another or what needs to be filled out Is this something in the same problem space as ChatGPT? I'm not sure an LLM would be well suited for that, but could be wrong.
- gtirloni 4y ago
  People in tech keep thinking ChatGPT is sentient or something.
basch 4y ago
[ended up with a duplicate half comment. see above: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34698426 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34698426]
- wilsonnb3 4y ago
  Microsoft using blink/chromium is a good thing IMO. Once Apple is forced to open up iOS to other browsers, the blink/chromium monopoly will be complete. The only check on Google's ability to dictate what a web browser is will be the influence of companies like Microsoft, who are invested in blink/chromium and have the resources to potentially fork it if Google does something they don't like. I would not be surprised if we see a blink/chromium based Safari in the future so that Apple can join the party as well.
  - WorldMaker 4y ago
    Your "dream" there fuels some of my nightmares. You may discount the potentially devasting threat of a possible massive ecological collapse from relying on one single implementation of web rendering because you don't think open source projects can die because "someone has the resources to potentially fork it", but open source is no guarantee. Beyond that, even discounting the threat of ecological collapse due to a single codebase, most of the web's best standards have come from lessons learned from multiple implementations. Without multiple implementations we lose a lot of guide rails away from bad single vendor "standards". Even if you think downstream players like Microsoft can act as a big enough check on Google's rubber stamp in standards boards like WHATWG, there's a huge difference between Microsoft developers evaluating potential standards because they have to build their own implementation of them versus just reading them in code review to accept an upstream PR they didn't need to write themselves. Also, as close to a single implementation as WebKit and Blink still sometimes are, it's hard to argue that Apple isn't already still a contributor to the WebKit/Blink/Chromium Hegemony. It doesn't matter if iOS opens up to other browsers or not right now while WebKit and Blink are still so close to mostly not matter. Apple is sort of protecting everyone from a true V8 (JS Engine) monopoly, but the renderer has always been close enough to not matter to those terrible web developers only testing websites in Chrome and assuming they work "everywhere" and supporting a "Works Only in Chrome" agenda.
visarga 4y ago
Browser and desktop automation coming soon from AdeptAI and other companies. This kind of task requires learning to act and understand UIs.
codethief 4y ago
> I wish I could just explain to ChatGPT what I need copied and pasted from one document to another or what needs to be filled out. Recently, in a conversation with ChatGPT, I gave him a system administration task and told him I was a Linux terminal running bash and I would paste and execute everything he told me into the shell (and respond with the output). It worked okay – I wouldn't recommend it for production use yet – but I think, with future iterations of language transformer models, interfaces like the one you're describing as well as others (AI <> terminal, AI <> X Server, AI <> speakers/microphone) and combinations thereof stand a very good chance of becoming integral to our daily work.
- quasarj 4y ago
  This kind of thing is so far beyond anything I've learned about AI and machine learning. It blows my mind.
- habith 4y ago
  Gave “him”?
  - codethief 4y ago
    Ok, her.
datavirtue 4y ago
It can also be a third party moderator. My daughter and I were discussing some issues she was having and, in a playful way, just started asking OpenAI about some of her issues. It was able to tell her things directly that would have been more difficult to accept coming from me. I considered it a breakthrough of sorts. Writing code for me...yes, thank you! Helping me get through to my teenage daughter, that is amazing. Another thing, is that if people get indoctrinated to expect bad information from the machine, it might have some impact in correcting our society's propensity for spreading and believing false information.
- 51Cards 4y ago
  I'm going to play devil's advocate here but that last part is only if you trust the model and data coming out of the AI. Many of the conspiracy minded people I know would flat out say that it is obviously programmed to say what the goverment wants it to (or whatever flavour of argument it is this week) In short, while individuals in our community might understand more about the underlying process, I'm not sure it would be accepted as more credible to those already skeptical of anything that goes against their opinion?
jonathanyc 4y ago
I don’t feel much empathy for Chrome given that they did the exact same embrace/extend strategy with WebKit. He who lives by the sword will die by the sword…
napier 4y ago
The cordyceps-like elegance of using Googles core browser tech and foundational LLM research to try and flip the tables on them feels to me quintessentially Microsoft going back to it's roots behaviour.
- nailer 4y ago
  Technically it's KDE's browser tech, that Apple, Google, Brave, Microsoft and others contributed to. People sometimes talk like Google made Blink out of thin air.
  - napier 4y ago
    Good point.

basch 4y ago

>of course Edge is Chrome under the hood Embrace, Extend. That's the beauty of open source, right? If development and innovation slows, somebody can fork.

loudmax 4y ago
> Embrace, Extend. Wonder what comes next from Microsoft after Embrace and Extend ...
- huijzer 4y ago
  Antitrust?
- acchow 4y ago
  Extinguish?
poutine 4y ago
Left out the last E there...
- spixy 4y ago
  that is right, with open source there is no last E
  - fomine3 4y ago
    That's why Edge's user agent lacks "e": Edg/111.0.1660.6
    - katbyte 4y ago
      oh wow thats not a joke Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 13_2) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/110.0.0.0 Safari/537.36 Edg/109.0.1518.78
  - trelane 4y ago
    Oh? Were can I get the source and compile Edge myself? Perhaps you've mistaken open source for Free Software.
peteradio 4y ago
Embrace like king kong embraces godzilla, how are you going to extinguish godzilla? Newsflash its not possible!
- diffeomorphism 4y ago
  Nah, it is rather easy. For instance how many people use vscode and how many vscodium? Why? And for that reason codium could be easily reduced to irrelevance.
htag 4y ago
This is the longterm strength of the GPL over MIT/BSD.

partiallypro 4y ago

Edge is genuinely very very good. It does have some dev tool problems that I've run into, but for browser it's top notch.

ycta20221203980 4y ago
I like Edge and I want to like Bing but my problem is that the new tab page on Edge and the landing page on (current) Bing are so bad. They're full of random junk and articles I don't want to see. I'll switch to Bing full time if they just make the landing page clean.
- partiallypro 4y ago
  There are settings that will hide all of it, at least until you scroll, but it would be nice to have it just be the search and Bing image of the day (or no image if that's your jam.)
- spullara 4y ago
  Aside from telling you about the new GPT functionality I don't see anything else on the landing page at bing.com: https://i.imgur.com/2f1D53L.png https://i.imgur.com/2f1D53L.png
  - pphysch 4y ago
    You appear to have gotten the new version. The old (GPT-less) one is a horribly noisy mess, with a high-contrast background image to boot.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- georgemcbay 4y ago
  I don't know about Bing, but in Edge you can disable all of that random junk content and get a nice clean default page with just a single search text entry box (similar to the Chrome default). The settings for modifying your layout and turning off all the content you don't want is available through the gear icon settings from the top right of the page. Would be nice if the default were clean, but you can opt out of all of that stuff.

kyriakos 4y ago

I'm using Edge full time since it switched to chromium. Have absolutely no problems with it.

henriquez 4y ago
It’s my go-to browser for porn, and Bing is also the best porn search engine.
darkvertex 4y ago
I don't know why but Edge has extra buttery smooth video performance. 4K? No stuttering. I think they tap into some magic Windows APIs that regular Chrome does not.

layer8 4y ago

It won’t be limited to Edge. From the event: Q: Will this be available in Chrome or other browsers? Yusuf: Our intention is to bring it to all browsers. We're starting with Edge. Chrome has to implement some things to make it work, but our intention is all browsers.

nailer 4y ago
That seems odd. What would Chrome not have that Edge does that allows Bing to work?
- infinityio 4y ago
  The edge-specific integration seems to include a chatbot you can pull up on any page for content summaries / asking questions, I imagine this is the feature in question (although I'd imagine it would work perfectly fine as an extension, with no changes needed)

seydor 4y ago

I ve been using Edge to read aloud documents and articles recently. It seems like its a great browser, but it s late to the party and it s hard for people to move there.

curiousllama 4y ago

> I wish I could just explain to ChatGPT what I need copied and pasted from one document to another or what needs to be filled out Is this something in the same problem space as ChatGPT? I'm not sure an LLM would be well suited for that, but could be wrong.

gtirloni 4y ago
People in tech keep thinking ChatGPT is sentient or something.

basch 4y ago

[ended up with a duplicate half comment. see above: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34698426 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34698426]

wilsonnb3 4y ago
Microsoft using blink/chromium is a good thing IMO. Once Apple is forced to open up iOS to other browsers, the blink/chromium monopoly will be complete. The only check on Google's ability to dictate what a web browser is will be the influence of companies like Microsoft, who are invested in blink/chromium and have the resources to potentially fork it if Google does something they don't like. I would not be surprised if we see a blink/chromium based Safari in the future so that Apple can join the party as well.
- WorldMaker 4y ago
  Your "dream" there fuels some of my nightmares. You may discount the potentially devasting threat of a possible massive ecological collapse from relying on one single implementation of web rendering because you don't think open source projects can die because "someone has the resources to potentially fork it", but open source is no guarantee. Beyond that, even discounting the threat of ecological collapse due to a single codebase, most of the web's best standards have come from lessons learned from multiple implementations. Without multiple implementations we lose a lot of guide rails away from bad single vendor "standards". Even if you think downstream players like Microsoft can act as a big enough check on Google's rubber stamp in standards boards like WHATWG, there's a huge difference between Microsoft developers evaluating potential standards because they have to build their own implementation of them versus just reading them in code review to accept an upstream PR they didn't need to write themselves. Also, as close to a single implementation as WebKit and Blink still sometimes are, it's hard to argue that Apple isn't already still a contributor to the WebKit/Blink/Chromium Hegemony. It doesn't matter if iOS opens up to other browsers or not right now while WebKit and Blink are still so close to mostly not matter. Apple is sort of protecting everyone from a true V8 (JS Engine) monopoly, but the renderer has always been close enough to not matter to those terrible web developers only testing websites in Chrome and assuming they work "everywhere" and supporting a "Works Only in Chrome" agenda.

visarga 4y ago

Browser and desktop automation coming soon from AdeptAI and other companies. This kind of task requires learning to act and understand UIs.

codethief 4y ago

> I wish I could just explain to ChatGPT what I need copied and pasted from one document to another or what needs to be filled out. Recently, in a conversation with ChatGPT, I gave him a system administration task and told him I was a Linux terminal running bash and I would paste and execute everything he told me into the shell (and respond with the output). It worked okay – I wouldn't recommend it for production use yet – but I think, with future iterations of language transformer models, interfaces like the one you're describing as well as others (AI <> terminal, AI <> X Server, AI <> speakers/microphone) and combinations thereof stand a very good chance of becoming integral to our daily work.

quasarj 4y ago
This kind of thing is so far beyond anything I've learned about AI and machine learning. It blows my mind.
habith 4y ago
Gave “him”?
- codethief 4y ago
  Ok, her.

datavirtue 4y ago

It can also be a third party moderator. My daughter and I were discussing some issues she was having and, in a playful way, just started asking OpenAI about some of her issues. It was able to tell her things directly that would have been more difficult to accept coming from me. I considered it a breakthrough of sorts. Writing code for me...yes, thank you! Helping me get through to my teenage daughter, that is amazing. Another thing, is that if people get indoctrinated to expect bad information from the machine, it might have some impact in correcting our society's propensity for spreading and believing false information.

51Cards 4y ago
I'm going to play devil's advocate here but that last part is only if you trust the model and data coming out of the AI. Many of the conspiracy minded people I know would flat out say that it is obviously programmed to say what the goverment wants it to (or whatever flavour of argument it is this week) In short, while individuals in our community might understand more about the underlying process, I'm not sure it would be accepted as more credible to those already skeptical of anything that goes against their opinion?

jonathanyc 4y ago

I don’t feel much empathy for Chrome given that they did the exact same embrace/extend strategy with WebKit. He who lives by the sword will die by the sword…

napier 4y ago

The cordyceps-like elegance of using Googles core browser tech and foundational LLM research to try and flip the tables on them feels to me quintessentially Microsoft going back to it's roots behaviour.

nailer 4y ago
Technically it's KDE's browser tech, that Apple, Google, Brave, Microsoft and others contributed to. People sometimes talk like Google made Blink out of thin air.
- napier 4y ago
  Good point.