4 ms·

You no longer hire the best candidate on the merits but rather the one with a sufficiently high DEI score.

by adamsmith143 4y ago

shadowgovt 4y ago
Isn't "ability to work with people of a diverse background" also one of the merits in a very, very diverse society?
- freejazz 4y ago
  Ding ding ding. I'm still struggling to understand what is so bad about wanting to have a diverse workplace...
- adamsmith143 4y ago
  If my goal is to hire e.g "the best physicists" in the world then its probably going to be low on my list. Particularly in stem where disagreeableness is high in general. Also if a University is optimizing for say "Most High Impact Research published" by a prospective hire, their skin color is going to be pretty irrelevant.
  - shadowgovt 4y ago
    So assuming that's what the university is optimizing for, I can see your point. As noted in peer comments in these threads though, universities aren't solely in the business of pure research. They optimize for a wide band of goals, including teaching, grant acquisition and use, and publication. Those are human interaction skill-spaces, not particle-behavior-comprehension skill spaces. And even in the realm of pure research: of the top ten big physics and astronomy institutions, four are in Europe (across three countries), one in China, one in Japan, two in Russia, and two in the United States. The ability to work cross-culturally with diverse people is extremely important for physics collaboration in the 21st century.
- goatlover 4y ago
  Why can't that just be "ability to work with people" full stop, regardless of their background? If society is very, very diverse, then surely we all have to work, live and grow up with different people anyway.
  - ModernMech 4y ago
    Sure that’s fine a fine sentiment to hold. But it’s also anodyne and unspecific. It’s certainly not the kind of thing that’s going to differentiate you in a competitive job application process. Because the job in fact is to teach a diverse classroom. So if all you have to say are banal platitudes in your DEI statement, you will be passed over. Not because your position is wrong, it’s not. But because others are able to articulate with specificity and examples as to how they handle the job of teaching a diverse classroom. That’s what you’re up against as an applicant.
    - goatlover 4y ago
      So for example if you're a math teacher, and the job is to teach a diverse classroom, what the hell does that mean?
      - shadowgovt 4y ago
        https://blogs.ams.org/matheducation/2017/03/06/six-ways-mathematics-instructors-can-support-diversity-and-inclusion/ https://blogs.ams.org/matheducation/2017/03/06/six-ways-math...
      - ModernMech 4y ago
        If you are a math teacher, the job is to teach math to a diverse classroom. For example, one thing you could talk about in a DEI statement could be your experience e.g. teaching math to a student who was bound to a wheelchair and couldn’t talk except through a computer, and how that impacted your teaching practice in general.

You no longer hire the best candidate on the merits but rather the one with a sufficiently high DEI score.

shadowgovt 4y ago

Isn't "ability to work with people of a diverse background" also one of the merits in a very, very diverse society?

freejazz 4y ago
Ding ding ding. I'm still struggling to understand what is so bad about wanting to have a diverse workplace...
adamsmith143 4y ago
If my goal is to hire e.g "the best physicists" in the world then its probably going to be low on my list. Particularly in stem where disagreeableness is high in general. Also if a University is optimizing for say "Most High Impact Research published" by a prospective hire, their skin color is going to be pretty irrelevant.
- shadowgovt 4y ago
  So assuming that's what the university is optimizing for, I can see your point. As noted in peer comments in these threads though, universities aren't solely in the business of pure research. They optimize for a wide band of goals, including teaching, grant acquisition and use, and publication. Those are human interaction skill-spaces, not particle-behavior-comprehension skill spaces. And even in the realm of pure research: of the top ten big physics and astronomy institutions, four are in Europe (across three countries), one in China, one in Japan, two in Russia, and two in the United States. The ability to work cross-culturally with diverse people is extremely important for physics collaboration in the 21st century.
goatlover 4y ago
Why can't that just be "ability to work with people" full stop, regardless of their background? If society is very, very diverse, then surely we all have to work, live and grow up with different people anyway.
- ModernMech 4y ago
  Sure that’s fine a fine sentiment to hold. But it’s also anodyne and unspecific. It’s certainly not the kind of thing that’s going to differentiate you in a competitive job application process. Because the job in fact is to teach a diverse classroom. So if all you have to say are banal platitudes in your DEI statement, you will be passed over. Not because your position is wrong, it’s not. But because others are able to articulate with specificity and examples as to how they handle the job of teaching a diverse classroom. That’s what you’re up against as an applicant.
  - goatlover 4y ago
    So for example if you're a math teacher, and the job is to teach a diverse classroom, what the hell does that mean?
    - shadowgovt 4y ago
      https://blogs.ams.org/matheducation/2017/03/06/six-ways-mathematics-instructors-can-support-diversity-and-inclusion/ https://blogs.ams.org/matheducation/2017/03/06/six-ways-math...
    - ModernMech 4y ago
      If you are a math teacher, the job is to teach math to a diverse classroom. For example, one thing you could talk about in a DEI statement could be your experience e.g. teaching math to a student who was bound to a wheelchair and couldn’t talk except through a computer, and how that impacted your teaching practice in general.