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I guess I'm not familiar with people who are falling into this category you're suggesting. Could you cite some specific examples? I'm thinking of Kanye, Jorda

I guess I'm not familiar with people who are falling into this category you're suggesting. Could you cite some specific examples? I'm thinking of Kanye, Jordan Peterson, Andrew Tate, Nick Fuentes, etc. These people expressed reprehensible viewpoints and were subsequently removed from various platforms as a result. That's not politics; what they said was reprehensible regardless of political ideology. You can find people who expressed similar political thoughts without the hate, but the people I named can't figure out how to do that and therefore have been removed (to some degree or another) from the communal discourse.

throwaway894345 4y ago
The examples cited in my original comment were all specific examples. Some names include Lee Fang, Daniel Shor, James Damore.
- minsc_and_boo 4y ago
  James Damore was fired for violating his employee agreement with Google, because he said the reason you don't see women in engineering and leadership positions is due to them being biologically incapable. Even James confirmed as much. Trotting him out as an example is more to my point of how playing the victim card without acknowledging agreement violations is intentionally misleading. And before someone asks, "DiD u rEaD tHe MeMo?" it's right here: > I’m simply stating that the distribution of preferences and abilities of men and women differ in part due to biological causes and that these differences may explain why we don’t see equal representation of women in tech and leadership.
  - throwaway894345 4y ago
    Of course, those are two completely different statements, as I'm sure you know: > you don't see women in engineering and leadership positions is due to them being biologically incapable. > I’m simply stating that the distribution of preferences and abilities of men and women differ in part due to biological causes and that these differences may explain why we don’t see equal representation of women in tech and leadership. And having read the full document (or even just the bits I quoted in my comment above), you surely also know that he was very explicitly not imputing population-level averages onto individuals. Damore's critics have been very openly lying about the contents of the document; there's no charitable way to interpret their claims. To be quite clear, I don't think Damore is a hero (his politics are more conservative than mine and I don't think he handled the fallout particularly well), but he was clearly fired for claims he very explicitly didn't make[^1], and his critics are just doubling-down on what can't be described as anything other than trivially-verifiable lies. [^1]: Even Google's legal team knew that they couldn't get him on those bases and instead they argued that criticizing Google's hiring practices implied that some of his coworkers weren't the best candidates for the job thus creating a hostile workplace. Of course, criticizing Google's hiring practices was absolutely pedestrian at Google at the time, although the argument was that Google's hiring practices were biased toward whites, men, etc. This is pretty obviously just pretense to fire him for ideological transgressions.
    - minsc_and_boo 4y ago
      Hiding behind an appeal to averages does not change the fact that Damore said women [on average] are biologically incapable of being in tech and leadership positions. Again, Damore reaped the consequences of his own actions by violating a contract he agreed to. This is intentionally misleading to represent him as a martyr for right-wingers. Unless, of course, you think the conservative agenda includes promoting that women are biologically incapable of holding teach and leadership positions.
      - throwaway894345 4y ago
        If course, he didn’t say “on average women are incapable of leadership”. Care to try again with words he actually used?
        minsc_and_boo 4y ago
        Can you? I'm not trying to make a point by hiding behind an appeal to averages.
        throwaway894345 4y ago
        No one is trying to make a point by hiding behind an appeal to averages. That's the point. The fact that you can't support your assertions about Damore's claims (without changing his words) proves my point. :)
        minsc_and_boo 4y ago
        You mean the direct quote made above with the "assertions"? Are you intentionally playing dumb? Here it is (again): > I’m simply stating that the distribution of preferences and abilities of men and women differ in part due to biological causes and that these differences may explain why we don’t see equal representation of women in tech and leadership.
      - ackfoobar 4y ago
- SpeedilyDamage 4y ago
  Can you name others? I literally could not find the controversies for the first two, and it doesn’t appear anything worse than being fired from Google has happened to James Damore.
  - throwaway894345 4y ago
    Both of the first two are on Wikipedia. Prom dress controversy: https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/kassycho/keziah-daum-prom-qipao-cheongsam https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/kassycho/keziah-daum-pr... Geisha party: https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/mom-called-apos-racist-apos-082736174.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly9kdWNrZHVja2dvLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAFMfgAFlnP1e-PuBiCyvfniQqJs1nv3zuAS8BVhR7gN3_VQoOnX9erD2gtMXcR3oKLUKp9I_7i3bgvmm0XTFLHsxDKP7MBxT11StdSyrTMlgEAhmcKHl7aKQ6-roaqxb1QUCy7xKQYmbAh3_uvkn8bFeUw-i4T3VP9dP4RILOd9k https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/mom-called-apos-racist-apos-... Professor suspended for using a Chinese word: https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2020/09/08/professor-suspended-saying-chinese-word-sounds-english-slur https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2020/09/08/professor-sus... Asian fusion restaurant incident: https://www.dailywire.com/news/asian-restaurant-in-nyc-forced-to-close-because-critics-say-white-owner-culturally-appropriated-chinese-cuisine https://www.dailywire.com/news/asian-restaurant-in-nyc-force... These links are just the first things that came up on Google to help you find what you’re looking for. I’m not claiming these links are the best sources. Man fired for cracking knuckles: https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/502975-california-man-fired-over-alleged-white-power-sign-says-he-was/ https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/502975-cal...
    - SpeedilyDamage 4y ago
      Sure, the people are on Wikipedia, but the account of their controversy was not. Besides, what do any of these have to do with conservative views being suppressed?
      - throwaway894345 4y ago
        They are both on wikipedia; I read them yesterday. On mobile now, but you can google them easily. They don’t have anything to do with conservatives views being suppressed because we weren’t talking about that. The original claim was that people who get “called out” have reprehensible views—I gave examples of people who were fired or harassed or etc for completely innocuous speech.

throwaway894345 4y ago

The examples cited in my original comment were all specific examples. Some names include Lee Fang, Daniel Shor, James Damore.

minsc_and_boo 4y ago
James Damore was fired for violating his employee agreement with Google, because he said the reason you don't see women in engineering and leadership positions is due to them being biologically incapable. Even James confirmed as much. Trotting him out as an example is more to my point of how playing the victim card without acknowledging agreement violations is intentionally misleading. And before someone asks, "DiD u rEaD tHe MeMo?" it's right here: > I’m simply stating that the distribution of preferences and abilities of men and women differ in part due to biological causes and that these differences may explain why we don’t see equal representation of women in tech and leadership.
- throwaway894345 4y ago
  Of course, those are two completely different statements, as I'm sure you know: > you don't see women in engineering and leadership positions is due to them being biologically incapable. > I’m simply stating that the distribution of preferences and abilities of men and women differ in part due to biological causes and that these differences may explain why we don’t see equal representation of women in tech and leadership. And having read the full document (or even just the bits I quoted in my comment above), you surely also know that he was very explicitly not imputing population-level averages onto individuals. Damore's critics have been very openly lying about the contents of the document; there's no charitable way to interpret their claims. To be quite clear, I don't think Damore is a hero (his politics are more conservative than mine and I don't think he handled the fallout particularly well), but he was clearly fired for claims he very explicitly didn't make[^1], and his critics are just doubling-down on what can't be described as anything other than trivially-verifiable lies. [^1]: Even Google's legal team knew that they couldn't get him on those bases and instead they argued that criticizing Google's hiring practices implied that some of his coworkers weren't the best candidates for the job thus creating a hostile workplace. Of course, criticizing Google's hiring practices was absolutely pedestrian at Google at the time, although the argument was that Google's hiring practices were biased toward whites, men, etc. This is pretty obviously just pretense to fire him for ideological transgressions.
  - minsc_and_boo 4y ago
    Hiding behind an appeal to averages does not change the fact that Damore said women [on average] are biologically incapable of being in tech and leadership positions. Again, Damore reaped the consequences of his own actions by violating a contract he agreed to. This is intentionally misleading to represent him as a martyr for right-wingers. Unless, of course, you think the conservative agenda includes promoting that women are biologically incapable of holding teach and leadership positions.
    - throwaway894345 4y ago
      If course, he didn’t say “on average women are incapable of leadership”. Care to try again with words he actually used?
      - minsc_and_boo 4y ago
        Can you? I'm not trying to make a point by hiding behind an appeal to averages.
        throwaway894345 4y ago
        No one is trying to make a point by hiding behind an appeal to averages. That's the point. The fact that you can't support your assertions about Damore's claims (without changing his words) proves my point. :)
        minsc_and_boo 4y ago
        You mean the direct quote made above with the "assertions"? Are you intentionally playing dumb? Here it is (again): > I’m simply stating that the distribution of preferences and abilities of men and women differ in part due to biological causes and that these differences may explain why we don’t see equal representation of women in tech and leadership.
    - ackfoobar 4y ago
SpeedilyDamage 4y ago
Can you name others? I literally could not find the controversies for the first two, and it doesn’t appear anything worse than being fired from Google has happened to James Damore.
- throwaway894345 4y ago
  Both of the first two are on Wikipedia. Prom dress controversy: https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/kassycho/keziah-daum-prom-qipao-cheongsam https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/kassycho/keziah-daum-pr... Geisha party: https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/mom-called-apos-racist-apos-082736174.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly9kdWNrZHVja2dvLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAFMfgAFlnP1e-PuBiCyvfniQqJs1nv3zuAS8BVhR7gN3_VQoOnX9erD2gtMXcR3oKLUKp9I_7i3bgvmm0XTFLHsxDKP7MBxT11StdSyrTMlgEAhmcKHl7aKQ6-roaqxb1QUCy7xKQYmbAh3_uvkn8bFeUw-i4T3VP9dP4RILOd9k https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/mom-called-apos-racist-apos-... Professor suspended for using a Chinese word: https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2020/09/08/professor-suspended-saying-chinese-word-sounds-english-slur https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2020/09/08/professor-sus... Asian fusion restaurant incident: https://www.dailywire.com/news/asian-restaurant-in-nyc-forced-to-close-because-critics-say-white-owner-culturally-appropriated-chinese-cuisine https://www.dailywire.com/news/asian-restaurant-in-nyc-force... These links are just the first things that came up on Google to help you find what you’re looking for. I’m not claiming these links are the best sources. Man fired for cracking knuckles: https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/502975-california-man-fired-over-alleged-white-power-sign-says-he-was/ https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/502975-cal...
  - SpeedilyDamage 4y ago
    Sure, the people are on Wikipedia, but the account of their controversy was not. Besides, what do any of these have to do with conservative views being suppressed?
    - throwaway894345 4y ago
      They are both on wikipedia; I read them yesterday. On mobile now, but you can google them easily. They don’t have anything to do with conservatives views being suppressed because we weren’t talking about that. The original claim was that people who get “called out” have reprehensible views—I gave examples of people who were fired or harassed or etc for completely innocuous speech.