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Nobody in the US, and indeed most of the world, "owns" their property. Try not paying your property taxes, and see where that gets you. You lease the right to

Nobody in the US, and indeed most of the world, "owns" their property. Try not paying your property taxes, and see where that gets you. You lease the right to usus, mostly fructus, and to some extent abusus from the state.

avereveard 4y ago
Even then that would mean that the state would have a voice, not the neighbors.
notch898a 4y ago
False, much of Alaska has no property tax.
- rjbwork 4y ago
  Fair enough. I have looked into this before and that exception has not come up before. Let's say roughly 99.7%+ of people, then.
- throwanem 4y ago
  Where does title revert if you die intestate and with no next of kin?
  - jonhohle 4y ago
    It goes to probate like any other property.
RealityVoid 4y ago
I feel that this is a misleading. Property taxes are not leases on property but simply a disincentive to hoarding unused land.
- rjbwork 4y ago
  Maybe in theory, but functionally it is the same. You don't pay your property taxes, you get a lien, and can eventually, in extreme circumstances, be foreclosed on.
  - RealityVoid 4y ago
    I do not understand your point, really. Obviously, from a legal standpoint, ownership exists. But you say, no, no, no, that's not _reaaaal_ ownership, since I have to pay property taxes. When most people talk about ownership, when the law talks about ownership, it exists, and I think that is enough for it to exist.
    - rjbwork 4y ago
      That's okay, it requires some knowledge of rather niche economic philosophies. I'd suggest reading into some philosophy of property, labor, and ownership. Specifically in the right-libertarian and left-anarchist traditions. Start with John Locke and Adam Smith, then move into thinkers such as Marx, Proudhon, George (Henry, of Georgism fame), Nozick, Rothbard, and writers on similar topics.
- HDThoreaun 4y ago
  LVT is a disincentive to hoarding land. Property taxes are incentive to tear buildings on used land down.
  - notch898a 4y ago
    This is a great example of how framing makes a big difference. If I used the same framing, I would say LVT are an incentive to tear down the land (introduce toxic waste, endangered species that can't legally be disturbed, etc). Or I could say Property taxes are a disincentive to hoarding buildings.
jonhohle 4y ago
Even if you consider property tax that is legally false.
- Supermancho 4y ago
  I'm not sure if you even understood what you're replying to, since this is pointlessly contrarian. "legally" is an acknowledgement that the ownership is conditional on someone else who has authority about the ownership (ie the practical owner). This is a reasonable point of view, in theory.

avereveard 4y ago

Even then that would mean that the state would have a voice, not the neighbors.

notch898a 4y ago

False, much of Alaska has no property tax.

rjbwork 4y ago
Fair enough. I have looked into this before and that exception has not come up before. Let's say roughly 99.7%+ of people, then.
throwanem 4y ago
Where does title revert if you die intestate and with no next of kin?
- jonhohle 4y ago
  It goes to probate like any other property.

RealityVoid 4y ago

I feel that this is a misleading. Property taxes are not leases on property but simply a disincentive to hoarding unused land.

rjbwork 4y ago
Maybe in theory, but functionally it is the same. You don't pay your property taxes, you get a lien, and can eventually, in extreme circumstances, be foreclosed on.
- RealityVoid 4y ago
  I do not understand your point, really. Obviously, from a legal standpoint, ownership exists. But you say, no, no, no, that's not _reaaaal_ ownership, since I have to pay property taxes. When most people talk about ownership, when the law talks about ownership, it exists, and I think that is enough for it to exist.
  - rjbwork 4y ago
    That's okay, it requires some knowledge of rather niche economic philosophies. I'd suggest reading into some philosophy of property, labor, and ownership. Specifically in the right-libertarian and left-anarchist traditions. Start with John Locke and Adam Smith, then move into thinkers such as Marx, Proudhon, George (Henry, of Georgism fame), Nozick, Rothbard, and writers on similar topics.
HDThoreaun 4y ago
LVT is a disincentive to hoarding land. Property taxes are incentive to tear buildings on used land down.
- notch898a 4y ago
  This is a great example of how framing makes a big difference. If I used the same framing, I would say LVT are an incentive to tear down the land (introduce toxic waste, endangered species that can't legally be disturbed, etc). Or I could say Property taxes are a disincentive to hoarding buildings.

jonhohle 4y ago

Even if you consider property tax that is legally false.

Supermancho 4y ago
I'm not sure if you even understood what you're replying to, since this is pointlessly contrarian. "legally" is an acknowledgement that the ownership is conditional on someone else who has authority about the ownership (ie the practical owner). This is a reasonable point of view, in theory.